How could I forget the FAD? My apologies, Phil.

Along the same lines, I just received my air box thermometer a few minutes ago. I'll have it in after work, I hope the probe is long enough.

 

sorry i never read that stuff . a friend who has a inskip porshe mentioned a new mini facillity . it's nice to know if needed . beats the trip to chambers .

 

has anyone provided iats with the methanol set up ? seems like it would be even better,and good for the top mount intercoolers .

 

Thanks for the clarifications . Still a couple more though, DEI and IRT. Also what are your thoughts on the M7 Aerogel ex? Thats the one that blocks the exhaust heat from getting into the engine bay. I just installed it the other day. Hope this isn't off thread?

 

DEI for any nascar fans is dale earnhart inc.; or in this case see my link on post #237 for designengineering.

 

I'm being considered for the other SA position there. I hope to get it, my current job sucks.

We'll have to wait and see what Sid comes up with. I won't have my setup for a little while.

 

I put my air box/filter thermometer in today, to compare my readings with what DrPhil is getting. I have a UNI Filter in my Dinan box and I put the probe right in between the red outer foam and the inner gray foam.
While I was only on a short ride, I managed 2F above ambient at the filter. Tomorrow i'll go for a longer ride and i'll also let the car sit and idle for a little bit.
We'll see how well the Dinan box insulates.

 

you guys are waaaaaaaaay into this . someone has to feed us . good luck on the job . just say to yourself .... the 07's aren't that bad . project , project, project.

 

Thanks, the BMW and MINI facilities are very, very nice at Inskip. I'm hoping I can get in there.

I haven't driven an '07 yet, and i'm not so sure I want to.

 

You owe it to yourself to drive 1. It is NOT the same car IMHO. Some will like it better, some won't. As far as under hood heat management...... I think the new car is better. Best of luck getting the job. Mini dealers need the best SAs they can get.

Acronymic Advisor & Title Holder, or, AA & TH,

Steve, MD, DDS, MR, LLC, LLP, PHD, SGT, CPT, OBE & more Et-Ux.........

 

That's quite a list, Steve. Are those all you?

Thanks about the job, it's just a waiting game.

The reason I said i'm not sure I want to drive the R56-S is because I may like the power more than mine. Then i'll be in trouble.

 

you can always go all turbo ; then you'll have the looks and the power . but..... no s/c whine . there lies the problem .

 

If the M45 ever comes off for another "boost producing device" it will be for a Whipple W140AX.

 

I took my car for a ride today to get some more numbers. I have an air box thermometer in there now, so here's how it went...

ambient temp: 66F
air box/filter temp: 66F
intake air temp: 72F
coolant temp: 198F

I stopped at a store and with the car off for FIVE minutes, the air box temps went to 71F while the IATs went to 96F. Seeing the IATs go up that much in 5 minutes shows that there was some heat under there, but it seems the Dinan box insulates pretty well.

 

Excellent results, PARTSMAN! They are very congruent with what I see. I think the phenolic plastic (I guess that's what it's called) is very good thermally. The pit-stop temp increase is also consistent with my observations...in all respects.
Where did you place your airbox temp probe? Mine is in the airfilter nowdays.
btw, I presume these are "average" readings with some variation due to inclines, downhills, stops, slowdowns, etc?

 

Those readings are pretty average of what i've been seeing Phil, along with slight variations as you stated.
My temp probe, for right now, is in between the outer red foam and the inner gray foam of my UNI filter. I may experiment with the placement.
I was just curious as to how well the Dinan box insulated as compared to your Alta. More testing and numbers soon.

 

Can you translate that in simple english for us none tech members?

 

Hi guys

Been looking at my air box for a long time (a modified Mymini CAI) wondering how to make a better mouse trap : keep the heat out!

#1 material: automotive underhood "plastic" parts are now made of enginired composites sutch as PE, PET, PBT, PA, PC, PA, PP, etc where P= poly... as PA=polyamide=nylon (no phenolic here Dr Phil ) This resin are mixed with short fibers, 2 to 3 milimeters long, usualy glass, then injection or compression molded into parts.
Enginers will play with resin type and fiber contant for each application, based on mecanical, Thermal, vibration dampening, acoustic, corrosion, resistance to chemicals etc,therefore, even if they look like made out of the same material, our valve cover, thermostat housing, and air box are most likely not.(Hope I wasn't too boring there )

That explain the thermal efficiency of the OEM, JCW, and Dinan boxes and IMHO metals are out no mater the insulation, Heat soack and transfer will happen even only through edges or fasteners.

#2 Heat source: I don't know if any body ever looked into that but we have a heat generator build right into our air box , namely ... Drum rolls...
...the ECU .
These things, as all electonics, are generating a copious amont of heat and the ECU compartment is vented at the bottom inside the air box for incoming fresh air but not at the top for rising hot air under idling, so what happens to that hot air??? That might explain the fast but relativly low rise in temp in your box Partsman.
It would be intersting to put your probe by those vent holes .
I'm working on a new composite air box right now but I still don't have an answer to #2

Good work guys' keep it going

 

Thanks carbonized ! Very interesting, and educational for me. I knew those plastics were special, but now I have a greater appreciation of the differences by application--it all makes sense. It also means I won't be making one myself any time soon .
btw, I think this also argues for an Aerogel blanket for the airbox.
I didn't think of the ECU, but of course it's a computer and consequently a heat generator. Some boxes include the ECU (Alta for example) while others leave it outside, don't they?
I certainly have a mental picture of my ideal airbox...now I need someone to make it for me (anyone??)

 

The Whipple Supercharger is more commonly known as a "twinscrew". This type of SC is very efficient, and will make much more power at a much lower PSI than an Eaton.
http://www.whipplesuperchargers.com/...sp?ProdID=1162

 

Thanks very much and an excellent post. Very good point about the ECU, i'll have to look into that and see what's going on there.
There is an air gap between that side of my Dinan box and the outside of the ECU housing, although it is very small I think that the air that's being pushed out of my hood vent right above it helps to some degree with the heat.

 

All of the CAI I've ever seen only deal with the top half of the air box, not sure about Dinan, and those ECU vents are built into the bottom half ( driver side of bottom alf, two square holes if I remember correctly).
The thing is , you want to keep the ECU in the air box for the same reason BMW put it there: Fresh air for cooling and because it sure is the coolest place under the bonnet to begin with , now how mutch heat is the ECU generating and how does it affect the temps inside the air box? I don't think it is a major factor at speed, but at idle or slow traffic it might be significant.

Ho!what the hell! I just whent for a ride 10 miles around the airport nice twisties, long straights, slow airport busses. one very slow sheriff , stop signs etc.
My air box top is insulated with a silver foil we use on our race cars to protect carbon fiber parts from exaust and turbocharger heat. Joint betwen lower and top half is siliconed with high temp rtv.
Ambiant :90F
all parts of air box and ECU:90F
Pulled Ecu and noticed that there is top venting in the form of small loovres in the plastic but again inside of the filter compartment .Upon return and 5 minutes soak:
Air box temp(air):104F
Top half (metal) of air box: 115F
Bottom half (plastic) of air box:109F
Heat sink of ECU:108F

I'll let you experts, crunch these (Not so sientific )#!
My digital thermo. has a short lead wire so I have to mesure those temps whith open bonnet EI: air box top.
This was a 15 minutes trip only, maby too short?
-Confirmes anyway my view on metal air box:
-Ecu mesurment needs: 1) similar materials for top an bottom halfs: Who can tell where that heat is comming from?
2) longuer runnig time to get ECU up to temp ??

Anyway, this is fun! Reinvent the BMW wheel

 

BTW Phil
Aerogels are faily new on the maket, not in labs . You can bet that sooner or later some chimist will find a way to mix it into those thermopalstics if its not alrady done. Nanotechnology is alrady used in thermal management.

Lets get us some of that stuff and build ourself an intake manifold

 

Thanks for your numbers carbonized.
Your numbers are somewhat consistent with what DrPhil has experienced with his CAI, the one difference is with his FAD hooked up the recovery time is less.
My Dinan recovers pretty quick once there is airflow, but it has a little less heat soak than the traditional CAI to begin with. I hope to make that very quick with the addition of a ram type setup soon.

 

EDIT: Double post, this thing with the NAM server is getting annoying.