Hi guys,
I am not too sure this section is the right place to post this question, but hope you guys can help.

I have an 06 MCS with LSD for about 3 months now, and finally brought the car to an open track day this past weekend. My group had tons of seat time, spent around 7 hours at track, and maybe driving 80% of the time.

After the day, I wan pleasantly surprised by the MCS. It actually lap faster than the Miata(!!). However, here comes my questions. Everytime, after 6-7 laps (sometimes 9), the initial bite of the brake is all but gone. It still slows the car down but it's just kinda scary. The oil temp would come close to 320F as well, and we'll have to do a cool down lap, and pit for 10-15 minutes to bring all the temps down to normal. The brakes though, never did come back normal. Till today, it still felt mushy.

The car is bone stock. I haven't replace anything. What are the cost effective way of solving all those problems? For the brakes I thought of:

1. EBC Yellow stuff 'R' pads
2. Stainless steel lines
3. Metal caliper bushing (how does this thing work anyways?)
4. Better brake fluid

but don't know which one to go first (I don't have a lot of money to spent, or else I would've bought them all at once ).

And does anybody know since Mini's maintenance program covers brake pad and rotors (if I am not wrong), if I replace the bushing and all, will they void the warranty or something?

And how to deal with high oil temperatures?

This is also a daily driver, and I wanted to keep it legal in SCCA Solo2 G-stock class.

Someone please shed some light on me~~ I'm so troubled~~~~~

 

Oh BTW,
We were so impressed with the Mini, we end up driving a whole lot more of it, than the E46 M3 we brought out...I think we were just more confortable pushing the limits of the Mini than the M3, which is too much car(motor?) to handle for my skill level.....

 

Not yet been to the track (2 weeks til that slippery slope starts) but as far as changong feel the biggest difference is found in the pads you use. I just swapped to cermaics, the pedal feels more mushy, but the wheels are actually locking up a lot sooner and I have much better stopping power esp. with warm/ hot brakes.

 

Pads, bushings, fluid...

The pads have to be able to take the abuse you give them the stockers aren't really up to it. For me, EBC greens faded without the bushings, but didn't with. But I don't brakes as late as other (better) drivers.

The bushings work by keeping the caliper in better allignment. This results in more even pressure, lowering peak pad temps, and improving wear.

Get a fluid with a higher boiling point.

With all of these, you should have a better experience.

The biggest advantage of larger rotors comes from increased heat capacity, and if you search there are some folks who have made low cost brake ducts.

Matt

 

Start with the cheap stuff. You definitely boiled some fluid so that should be first on the list. Motul 600 or ATE Superblue seems to be the preferred brands. If it continues, then you might have to replace the pads.

As for warranty... you probably will void the warranty if you install those metal bushings. Your dealer might not want to honor the warranty in the first place if he suspects you had it on the track.

 

This coming from the the srvice dept. of a company that encourages racing their product, straight from the show room.

Sorry for the rant, just ironic and frustrating, there is a good Don't be stoopid WhiteRoof Radio episode

 

can we have a link to this?

mb

 

first, definitely upgrade your fluid. i use it and it works great at the track. you need to change your fluid now anyway since you boiled it.

get a set of brake pads for the front to use solely for the track. i believe randy web suggests pagid blues are the ones to get.

 

Hmm....I think I should have some ATE super blues sitting around....is replacing brake fluid a difficult task on a Mini?

 

Sure, they encourage you to race it. They don't say anywhere that they're happy to provide full warranty service to track cars.
I'm as irked as the next guy when someone reports a 'voided warranty' because they put on different valve stem caps. On the other side, it's not really reasonable to expect MINI to replace your brake pads if you track it often (or even once, if you destroy the pads.) It is (IMO) reasonable to expect them to replace a failed window motor under the same circumstances.
If you want to play, you have to pay.

 

No, but it helps to have a pressure bleeder. If you don't know what that is, it's basically a pressurized container that constantly feeds fresh brake fluid throughout your system. When you bleed your brakes of the old fluid, you simply set up the pressure bleeder, release the bleeder valve at each wheel, and drain the old fluid--watching until it's completely replaced by the new fluid which in this case is blue.

Here is an inexpensive one
http://www.promini.com/product-exec/...earch_model/99

I built my own before seeing this. You won't save much money by building your own.

 

If you want to stay in SCCA Solo II G-stock class and be legal then for brakes you can change the pads and the brake fluid. You cannot replace the bushings nor change the brake linings to stainless steel. Pads and fluid should help.

To deal with hot oil/engine temperatures and hot brakes as well you need to learn how not to overwork your engine and brakes. This is part of being smooth while driving at speed on the track. If you accelerate hard and brake hard in each corner and straightaway then you will generate quite a bit of heat. Get a good instructor to drive you car and see how smooth they can be with each part of the track then you try to do the same.

Driving smoother allows you to be easier on your car and your brakes so that lap after lap they can perform for you and not overheat. How do you think race cars do it?

Some owners have reported that MINI will replace stock brake fluid after 2 or 3 years and will replace worn rotors and pads in some cases. Not all dealers will allow for tracking your MINI- that would excessive use to them. Adding bushings would void your brake warranty.

At this point most likely your brake fluid boiled and needs to be replaced and your pads are worn (possibly your rotors are worn as well). Check the rotors and you might need to replace them if they are worn by damaged pads.

The brake work doesn't need to be done by the dealership if you are replacing the parts on your own.

 

I removed the dust shields and fabricated some duct work. Seemed to help alot. Also changed to Castorl SRF (over kill?) fluid. I just didn't want any excuses for the brake fluid.

I am getting ready for a track weekend in May at The Glen. I have been running Frodo 2500's. They worked "ok", but seemed marginal at the small track (SLMP) I run at (short straights with not enough cool time). I'm undecided about the pads. HMS Motorsports (they have 2 MINIs) recommends Performance Friction or Carbotech in some pretty aggressive formulas. In the case of Carbotech 10 in front and 9 in the back. Does anyone have any experience with Carbotech??? Oh, I will be running Toyo Ra1's at The Glen.

 

I upgraded to Hawk HPS pads and motul for two DE events last year on an otherwise bone stock JCW. I still feel the brakes are deficient, but not seriously so. I'm installing a BBK very soon.

Flush your brake fluid after each event and use a really good fluid like Motul or the Blue stuff.

Make sure your engine oil is changed before each event. I prefer Mobil 1.

Change your coolant at least once a year if your tracking often. Clean the radiator and IC as well.

When you are finished with each session, park the car - no e-brake, and open the bonnet.

Oh, don't follow too closely, this interupts air flow to the radiator and IC.

 

I agree with some of the other folks thoughts.

1. Replace the brake fluid with Motul or ATE Super Blue/Gold. I track several times a year and before each event I bleed off some fluid to remove any degraded fluid- the fluid in and near the calipers that has been heated up at the last event. A couple of times a season I do a FULL brake fluid change. Alternating between ATE Blue and Gold makes it easy to be sure you have replaced all the fluid. (color change) Otherwise Blue and Gold is the same mix.

2. I have stainless lines and can feel a stiffer pedal under braking. This will not affect your brake fade issue, however.

3. I install track pads (front) before each event. Actually I do so a couple days prior to get them bedded in each time. I use Pagid's for track days and switch back to EBC Greens for daily driving. The switch takes 20 minutes tops.

I have Hawk HPS pads permanently mounted on the rears. They are an upgrade from stock: better performance rated but don't squeal in daily driving. They dust less than stock, too.

4. I don't have the bushings and would not recommend them. They do stiffen up the brake but the feeling was VERY slight. They also increase noise/vibration feedback which I definitely do not like.

5. Get some slotted rotors. I have been through a couple of sets and find the PowerSlot Cryro Frozen Rotors the best. Do not get drilled rotors, they will warp on the track.

6. Can't help you with the oil temp, as much driving as I have done this has never been an issue. Tell your dealer the car is overheating at the track. He'll fix you up!

 

Thanks guys for the info! Seems like brake fluid is the first to go. I am still working on the smoothness part of my driving, hope it'll help the oil temp issue.

Dealing with the dealer's service dept is a pain in the a$$. This particular dealer I bought the car from is probably more so (the one SW of Houston, TX). The car actually almost overheated the day I picked it up, and consider I was soooo gentle with the car (didn't rev past 2500!), it shouldn't have happened. I sent it back to the dealer and they told me nothing is wrong, it is SUPPOSED to be like that....And my second visit proves the dealer's service quality is just way below substandard....

Anyways, that's off topic. I've never worked on my car before except changing tires, are there any write ups that details the steps and tools needed to do all those brake jobs?

Thanks a mill guys!!

 

First I would change to Braided Lines. I suspect it will go a long way to curring your problem. Having Motul or any high temp fluid is of little value if it is running through stock lines.

Also if you go with a big brake kit, braided lines will be included in the kit.

Good to hear you have your car "on track"!!

 

Oh i cant cant till I get to go to the track!