Just curious to ask you east coasters now digging out from the storm, if the Countryman is a decent enough snow car without the All4 option, or if this option is something you'd recommend considering. I once owned a Saab 900 in Colorado and found that FWD, properly designed with decent snows, was almost as good as 4wd.

For those of us who live in the lower elevations (with only the occasional run to the mountains to ski), it's a question worth asking.

 

This is the one thing I'm super concerned about in that it seems like everyone here went with an All 4. I live in Baltimore, where we currently just got another snow of about 6-8", nowhere near what they got in NY and Boston. But my Honda Element, which is FWD, has always been totally fine in the snow. I'm sure it would be great to have 4WD, but if I'm going out at all, in the conditions I would drive in, FWD driven carefully should suffice. I bought the regular S, and am really wondering whether I should have done the All4 (it's too late now anyway).

 

I'm in south Texas now - NO snow, but, I grew up in northern New Jersey. I did fine in snow in rear wheel drive cars with snow tires and all season tires for a long time. Last number of years in Jersey were with a Voyager Minivan. It was way better than the rear wheel drive cars. All4 would be good, but, certainly not necessary.

I opted for the All4 here so I could go on the beach at Galveston and launch the kayak in the surf. Last summer I had to get towed twice and once a group carried the car about 15 feet to harder sand. That was a 2007S.

Bill

 

Careful - you're inviting WW III to begin! Again!<grin>

One of the most interesting related discussions has been about tires on the CM.(All4 or FWD) If you opt for the 17's, you can choose performance or all-seasons. (Assuming you're ordering, rather than picking from existing inventory.) If you opt for the 18's, no option - YOU WILL GET PERFORMANCE RUNFLATS.

The tire choice may have a greater impact than the All4/FWD choice. Either tire size with performance runflats will likely be a disappointment in the snow.

And then there are the folks who will tell you that if you opt for quality snow tires, (swap snow tires on in the winter, performance or all seasons the rest of the year), either All4 or FWD will probably do quite well.

And if you think you can simply replace the stock performance tires with all seasons, go to a site like TireRack to understand your options. Runflats or traditional tires. Sizes, prices. It's not a straightforward decision to me! I like the 18 inch wheels more, but I am not comfortable running performance tires year 'round and I don't want to have a second set of wheels and tires.

I have an R32 with 4motion with high-performance all seasons on the standard wheels, and I do very well in the snow I see here in TN. Not as much as you folks, but 4-6 inches isn't out of the question.

 

Great question! Len, I'm in Philadelphia and we probably got a foot of snow. My wife thinks I should've went All4, but I'm assuming with a quality set of snow tires that I'll be fine. More thoughts?

 

We got 16" of snow last night on top of the 4" we got earlier in the day. Our All4 Countryman sits in our garage as we've nowhere to go.

Tomorrow I hope to take it out a bit. Being in the Northeast I really like having an all wheel drive vehicle for added traction. And for me, All4 serves an entirely other purpose - it completely mitigates any torque steer evident in FWD vehicles.

 

I have a 2009 hardtop S and thought fwd was fine, but was given a 328ix as a loaner.....whatever my next car (countryman or other) it will be all wheel drive. The difference was night and day in the snow. You loose on gas mileage, but worth it if you have upto 5 months of snow. I would also agree that type of tire will make a difference. Goodluck on your future purchase.

 

The first pic is "Jumbo Shrimp" under snow and the second is him liberated took me about a 15min. I dont know if you can see behind him on the second pic, there are a group of people huddled together. That was my amusement for the day. The dumb dumb spent several hours digging his self out the back of his house. Then he decided it was a good idea to try and take his rear wheel drive pickup truck out for a winter drive. Of course he was stuck for another hour and to make matters worst he almost slid into several neighbors cars, who in turn had some choice words to say. But Jumbo Shrimp had no trouble coming and going thru all that. Plus I had my 08 MCS during the first storm of the season and kept getting stuck leaving the driveway, this storm would have grounded me. I would have been in the Tahoe, which I hate driving. I say all that to say the ALL4 worked with out a hitch and I got around the City just fine, I even had to park in some spots I would have never tried to park and got out fine. I love this MINI and I got it just in time. I wish I could have stayed home, but it made things bearable not getting stuck.

 

Really good point. I took an All4 out with my wife when we had a 20" snowfall here and drove it right through the undriven snow. All season tires, All4, and it just went right through it. Traction control engaged once. I was completely amazed.

 

Given the ground clearance of the CM a good set of snows will get you through anything whether you have ALL4 or not. I drove my 2010 M3 on much wider than optimal Dunlop Wintersport 3Ds (performance winter tires) and only got stuck once and that was because of the reduced ground clearance.

Another thing to consider is the condition of the winter roads you drive on. If you drive on packed snow or plowed roads then all-seasons (Continental DWSs are AMAZING) will get you through pretty much anything. If you get a lot of accumulated snow then you'd want true snow tires.

In my village the roads are neither plowed nor salted until I get to a priority road. If we've had a LOT of snow they can get slushy but nothing an all-season can't get through if you're careful.

I totally understand not wanting to deal with winter wheels and tires and to be honest, until I moved to a place that actually got snow I never even considered it. Having been in Germany for a couple of years now I can say this, unless I live in a climate that doesn't drop below 40 in the winter, I will NEVER drive on anything but true winter tires during the winter again. I've seen FAR too many accidents because people were too cheap or lazy to put a set of winters on their car. Yes, that includes people that drive on all-seasons.

AWD doesn't make a car invincible, period. If you drive in snow, get snow tires. If you put them on another set of wheels it'll take you 20 minutes to make the swap in your garage and if you need to justify it to yourself, your tires will last at least twice as long.

Basically, just get winter tires.

 

In the CM even the FWD won't have torque steer either. You get torque steer when your driveshafts are unequal in length. The B5 Passats (98-05) were the first FWD car I know of that had equal length driveshafts and they didn't have torque steer either.

If all your after is the elimination of torque steer the FWD version will be fine. I figure, for the small price difference, and small MPG penalty, it's a no-brainer to add it. Better to have it and not use it that need it and not have it.

 

I hear ya. I'm looking at the JCW Clubbie (I REALLY prefer the interior color options, dark gauges, and barn doors) as well and although I wouldn't need it very often, the extra ground clearance and AWD would be nice.

 

One possible alternative that splits the difference is the Nokian WRG2 tires. All seasons that are actually rated for winter. I have run them on my wife's old Honda Civic which I inherited, and they have kept me going through crazy amounts of snow. Directional tread pattern and high speed ratings:

http://www.nokiantires.com/tyre?id=1...me=Nokian+WRG2

 

That was pretty much my experience digging out in center city. It was pretty easy to get out of a spot while others spent an hour only to slip on the un-plowed street! My last 4 cars have been AWD. for my driving needs I would not have a primary car without AWD.

Less, you live in the Northeast?

 

I'm in the middle, Oxford Circle area.....the land of absent snow plows.

 

I highly recommend a good set of snows. I've had them for 2 seasons on my '03 S and I can say they make a huge difference. There were places my traction control would have kicked in if I had my all-seasons on but with the snows it never did.
Whether you have a standard or an All 4, a big plus with the CM is that it has better ground clearance than any MINI siblings.
I guess it all depends on how much snow you have to deal with during the winter season and how well your roads are maintained. If you want the added peace of mind that you won't get stuck then go for an All4 and for extra security get a good set of snows.

 

If you go with dedicated snow tires, what do you put on your car the rest of the year?

There are those who really despise All Season tires, saying they aren't real good at anything. But if you put on performance tires, what happens in bad conditions, like heavy rains?

 

That's the 4th or 5th time if seen that comment on this board. Is it a Mini cultural thing to think summers are bad in the rain? Summer tires are usually leaders in wet weather Performance. The only thing you need for good we weather traction is the ability to channel a lot of water away. Every summer tire I've owned has been superb in this. The Continental ContiSport Contact 3s on my M3 (245/35 & 265/35) have been downright mountain-goat-like in even torrential rain.

So, I guess to answer your question, I'd run summers or UHPASs.

 

Your alley looks exactly like my brothers at Harbison and the boulevard

 

I run ultra high performance summer tires the rest of the year and change over as winter begins.
There's no sense having snows and all-seasons. I checked out tire rack for the best all around summer tire for my '03 that handle heavy rains. I'm very happy with mine. The have huge channels for water, larger than an all season.

 

Which brand did you end up going with for your summer tires? 17s or 18s?

 

Continental CS3s, Pilot Sports, Pirelli PZero, are all outstanding tires. If you want performance right up there with those but less expensive, look at the Vredestein Ultrac Sessanta.

 

I run 205/45R17 Bridgestone Potenza RE760 (ultra high perf summer) and Michelin Primacy Alpin PA3 (performance winter) non runflats on my '03