First I'll say that I don't have PSS9's but based on my MINI and other coilover experiences I'll tell you that the PSS9's and many of the other coilovers available for the MINI use a tapered front spring to maximize travel by collapsing in on itself to some extent intsead of just stacking up like a tender or linear spring. This also has the added advantage of being able to use the stock top hat. It has two distinct disadvantages, there are usually no alternate spring rates or lengths available unless you get a different top hat and buy linear springs and maybe some tenders and because the top of the tapered spring is stock diameter there is a limited amount of room to move the top of the strut with camber plates to get more negative.

If someone will measure the inside diameter of the bottom coil of the front springs (please post here) and tell Bilstein or another company they want a top hat to run a linear spring they could almost certainly get one. It's probably either 2.25", 2.5" or 60mm. Not many compaines with 60mm id springs in U.S. KW has some but H&R seems to have more.

 

When you had your Webb/RDR camber plates installed did the installer have to notch the top of the strut tower for access to the mounting bolts? I got a look at a MINI with them installed (along w/ PSS9s) this past weekend. The installer had notched out the strut towers over the four mounting bolts for access to the bolts - surprised me that it was necessary.

 

With my PSS9 and P&D plates, I could have my camber set at more than 3 degree if I wish . However, my cambers are set at 2.75 degree L & R.

 

Pyugala,


Any install problems with those plates? Anything?

Michael

 

The only doubt I have is the caster. Max caster is set max at 4.01 left and 3.29 right. Not sure if it is the plates or the car that causes the different in caster . Anyone with other make plates experiencing the same problem?

 

Very interesting. I never realized a spring could do this. Sounds like such a simple yet effective way to get more suspension travel. This is also referred to as the barrel shaped springs, correct? Are the stock springs this way as well? Forgive my ignorance, but I do not have a Mini to check this, as mine is still on order. Also, is this why the PSS9's don't come with a top hat for the front, since you are expected to reuse the stock one?

Would it be possible to buy aftermarket springs that are OEM diameter to use with the PSS9? For example, using off the shelf springs from H-Sport or M7 just as an example. I am not saying those particular springs have the appropriate spring rate, but but if the size is correct then there may be a few options out there for alternate spring rates.

 

I have had the PSS9s for a full year now, about 9K miles and lots of autoxing. They are still great, and a good compromise for a daily driver. I have the RDR/Helix camber plates up front and get a little over 2 degrees of negative camber. I run them full soft on the street (occasionally on 8) and adjust them stiffer for autox.

I have considered trying alternate springs for them but have not pursued it. I was under the impression that the JCW Garage in the UK was selling the PSS9 damper with a slightly softer spring. I emailed them to inquire but never got a reply. I also spoke to Bilstein USA in CA and they said that the prototype PSS9s for the MINI were too stiff and they softenend them up prior to the production model (I assume they meant the spring and not the damper). It would not be difficult to use other springs with them, but I'm not sure how well matched they would be.

 

Do you notice any pulling left or right? That's not a huuuuge difference, but enough to tug on the steering wheel...this would drive me up a wall.

 

Not really. But should I set them the same, given that the spec is 4.55 (L&R), my max setting is 4.01 L and 3.29 R. Therefore if I want them the same they would be aprox 3.30 (3.5).

 

what the hell...the P&D plates allow you to set the caster as you wish and independently! You are the first I have heard to report changing the caster.

 

If the spec for caster is 4.55 positive, I'm a little confused, and only because my thinking is prejudiced by my own goals. I would add caster rather than reduce it. Now, my comments are without first hand experimentation. But, adding a degree, say 5.50 would add a little straight line stability, reduce tram-tracking a bit, among a few other useful things I'll save for another day. You'll need to move the strut towards the back of the car to accomplish this...I think you moved the strut forward reducing caster.

There are a few subtle drawbacks to lots of positive caster, but another day.

Yes, both sides should theoretically be exactly the same, or as close as is possible...I'll keep in mind we have rubber bushings, humans operate the alignment machines and a breath of wind can cause a change in readouts.

I definately plan to play with caster. Within limits, there are probably some benefits; the one mentioned above and a bit more feel or weight in the steering.

jlm, I'm surprised by your comment about caster...maybe I read into it.

 

I put a caster adjustment feature into the P&D plates, but as I mentioned, pyugala is the first I have heard to report he has used anything but the stock setting. It was my goal to be able to set each side equally rather than a new absolute setting, but that's what experimenting is for. Dpayne had a set for testing and was pretty thorough, so he might have...?

 

JLM, actually I would like to add more positive camber but I am now hitting the limit of 4.01 L and 3.29 R (which is less the factory spec). I'm not sure if it is the car that won't allow me to go any further, have you experienced this issue before, JLM?

 

John
I never played with the caster on your plates -- just camber.
David

 

Has anybody gone from H-Sport springs and stock shocks to PSS9s?

Can you tell me if there is a big difference in ride with the PSS9's over the H-Sport/stock shock set up? I know with the adjustability there will be an increase in performance.

Cheers,

MeanGRN

 

Hey Greeny...

I did this and I will tell you that I wish I hadn't waited as long as I did to do so. There is hardly a comparison between the two setups. The PSS9s are not only a much better riding street setup, but what you can do with them now in setting up the car also improves track handling greatly.

I recommend Turner if you end up buying a set.

 

Coool Beeens thats what I wanted to hear.

Turner is the best, they did my cylinder head, clutch and Quaiffe. As a matter of fact, mine was the first MINI they did the quaiffe on.

I have a guy that races NASCAR modifieds that will let me use his scales to corner balance my setup when I get it done.

Maybe I will see you at the track sometime.

Cheers,

MeanGRN

 

when I layed out the P&D plates, i chose the center of the stock mini support as the center of the caster range of adjustment. Camber was typically going to go only stock or more negative, so the camber adjustment range was skewed to the negative to allow for more travel.

 

great video. so, you are saying the ride on PSS9's are more comfortable than h-sport springs and stock shocks. my wifes back doesnt like some of the interstate bridge joints (for example) when i hit them at 80 or so. i am running vogtland tho instead of h-sports , and am considering the bilstein SP's d/t price considerations.

 

I went from-
H-sport springs, stock shocks, madness two hole rear sway bar-stiffest setting
H-sport lower control arms, RDR front camber plates, stock front sway bar, BMP front strut bar and autocross alignment settings with -2.2 degrees front camber and -1.6 degrees rear camber (17x7" rims and Bridgestone S-03 215/45-17 tires) to-

Same set up with PSS9s and adjustable front and rear sway bar endlinks. I did cross balancing and realignment to same settings. Ride quality with all "9" settings front and rear is much much smoother and with four people in the car actually is even smoother!

I changed because the H-sport springs were riding really pretty rough and my passengers were really noticing it. Otherwise the setup was OK for my street use and autocross.

Now I have adjustable ride height and I can balance the weight of my car with each upgrade I do to loose weight. I would count the PSS9s as a very worthwhile upgrade for those that don't mind the large investment in time and funds it requires.

Helix13 has the PSS9s on special now for about $1580 a set. If you don't want to cross balance for track or autocross you don't need the adjustable endlinks.
http://helix13.com/html/products/pro...ew.php?p=1&h=m

Turnermotorsports has the PSS9 set for $1599

 

OnaSled - your track vids are great fun to watch! Do you have some of them archived where they are accessible, or do you just swap them out after each track weekend?

I talked to Turner about a week or so ago. They told me their prices would be going up due to a price increase from Bilstein when their current inventory ran out.

Anyone care to reply to the camber plate install question I raised a few posts up regarding notching out the strut towers for the mounting bolts?

 

Dpayne

Do you remember the read out of your caster are they perfectly equal? I'm curious if my car have some sorth of deformation at the strut tower that causes the diiferent in castor.

Pyugala

 

Thanks for the comments on my Videos. I usually have to delete some from my web files in order to get space for the new ones. I may set up a page that will have them all.

As far as the camber plates go, check out the bottom of this thread were I posted coments about them a while ago. https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...&highlight=sol
I did cut away some of the towers and am wondering if it was mine that you saw as I have not heard of others doing this. I'd be interested if it is in fact a common fix for the Webb plates.
Greg V

 

Slightly off topic but what are your street and track settings? I also have the front sway bar

 

The only thing I change from street to track is rebound. Track is 2 in front and 3 in rear, but I'm still in the learning stages.
I set the street as 9 and 9. Don't really care too much about street as I don't want to push my car there much at all. The suspension setup I'm using is a bit too aggressive for the street and can get me in trouble too quickly.