I totally agree. Once i got used to the instant responsiveness of the Koni/HSport the Bilsteins felp way to "Buick" at 9-9. I too one of my car enthusiast young employees for a ride today and he commented how stiff the ride was. Maybe I have it? I might back it off to 3-3 to smooth it out a little but I am concerned about the "rotation" and the sway bar setting. I am way over my head withthis for I am still learning. There are a couple of guys in Atlanta who have a lot of experience AutoX Minis and they are going to drive it and give me soem tips on set up etc. I'll post results etc in a few weeks.

 

I thought 9 is the softest setting on the PSS9 That is what said on the manual anyway.

 

9-9 is the softest setting. I am currently at 2-2 and the body particularly in the rear is rolling too much.......

 

I recently removed my Koni shocks/H-Sport springs and installed PSS9's. They are set on #9 for the break-in/settling period, after which the car will get realigned. However, I am noting a definite popping noise when I turn the wheels to either side, especially when I am starting to move. It seems like something (? spring) is catching then releasing.

I happen to have H-Sport camber plates, and this noise was not a problem with their springs and the Konis. I talked to some technical folks at H-Sport and they suggested that the cut end of the spring might be catching or that a spacer (e.g., of delrin) might be needed. My installer is removing the front Bilsteins to look for any marks on the under surface of the spring seat. Of course, I don't want to change camber plates, unless absolutely necessary, because of the money already spent.

Any suggestions from the experts and/or those with PSS9's and H-Sport camber plates? If there are no ready solutions, what camber plates should I get? Thanks in advance for any help you can offer.

 

Recoop

The poping noises also happen to my PSS 9 when I first got them. I got the JLM Camber/Castor plates, I thought it was the plate that make noise but it wasn't. The noises are gone after a few weeks though. I think the noises are only there during the break in. Just my 2 cents.

Thanks

 

Here's an update. After taking down the front Bilsteins and examining the spring seat and adjustable H-Sport camber plate, my installer (Fabrizio Aldratte at EF-1 Motorsports in Signal Hill, CA) concluded that the upper surface of the spring seat (? correct terminology) wasn't mating to the camber plate correctly. The conical surface of the spring plate was rubbing on the concave portion of the upper plate (? correct terminology). He put in a stainless steel washer (? @ 1/16" thick) that was the exact diameter of the very inner receptacle on the upper plate. This created just enough space so that there was no more rubbing. I apologize for my vague description, but the basic idea was to use a fairly small and thin spacer to allow the respective parts of the camber plate assembly to mate up properly (whew!). Why this problem occured is a bit unclear, at least in my mind. If I can get hold of an H-Sport camber plate schematic, I may be able to present a better description. Bottom line --- the small spacer eliminated the popping sound, as well as minimizing some of the other noises when going over bumps in the road :smile:.

 

Reviving this thread one more time...
Looking to order an '05 MCS next month that will be my daily driver and weekend AX car, with an occasional DE thrown in. Now that all of you have had your PSS9's for some time now, how do you feel about them?

I'm trying to decide whether to go with something a little less expensive like lower springs and Koni's, or to go for broke on the suspension and go with the Bilsteins and all of the related/required hardware. I've ridden in an MCS with Ledas and found the ride to be a little too harsh for a daily driver.

Since I'm a noob at suspension mods, perhaps you can answer a few questions about parts also. If I go with the PSS9s, what else will I need? Recommended camber plates? Adjustable control arms for the rear (2 or 4 required)? Recommended drop setting? I also plan to add an adjustable 22mm rear sway and Alta endlinks.

Thanks in advance!

 

You get what you pay for. After having tried M7 and H-Sports springs, the PSS9s are far and away the best handling/ride change I have made to my car.


Cheers,

morefun

 

I agree that to up to this point I think that the PSS9s are they way to go. Great for the street and they perform GREAT on the track. If you have the $$ to spend, then don't waste your time with springs. Go with the PSS9s

 

Thanks for the replies! What about the parts to put this all together? Recommendations for adjustable camber plates, rear control arms (which ones and do I need 2 or 4)?

 

Depends on what you want to do. I've done just about everything with my suspension and the car is just glue in the corners.

 

Although the MCS will be a daily driver, I'm wanting a good setup for autocross and the PSS9 appears to be the best option for softening up the ride and then being able to tighten it up for the weekend fun.

I'm wanting to do this right and up front as soon as I get the MCS - trying to roll the costs of the upgrades into the financing with a PO to a local shop so trying to get my selections and pricing nailed down. Stock tires and wheels will never hit the ground as I'm planning for lightweight 17x7 wheels and perf. tires for street, and lightweight 15" wheels and Azenies for AX.

Lots of options for the camber plates and the rear control arms so just looking for experienced opinions.

 

Are they auto-X legal in the class you will run? I don't know anything about auto-X myself.

 

Yes, they are in the BMWCCA. They use a point-based system to set the competitive classes.

 

Onasled,

I just looked at your Limerock video ["fawesome" --- conjunction of f***in and awesome] !! I found that I was gripping the arms of my chair and saying "Go, 'lil Mini, go..." How experienced were the drivers in the P-cars, and how did the white Mini perform against them? Have you posted this video on Rennlist?

 

I agree with your suggestion about the PSS9's. I really liked my H-Sports with the Koni shocks, but the Bilsteins are just the ticket, and they are so easy to adjust!

 

BidiMINI,
You have a new MCS cabrio with what mods- (tell all)
And you use your MINI mostly for street driving and some autocross for BMW CCA?

PSS9 are fine for street use and for autocross and some track use. dial the shock dampers to soft for street and firmer for autocross or track. I use 9-9 for street and 1 front and 2 rear for autocross on asphalt.

Camber plates in front (RDR or Webb plates) run about $500 and would be good to install for adjustable front camber of about -2.0 to -2.2 degrees.
PSS9s will allow you to adjust ride height which affects alignment (do alignment last only after you have found the right ride heights either based on looks or with corner balancing (using car scales to determine optimal ride height at each corner to balance your diagonal weights with you in the car and fluids topped off)).

Since you are autocrossing you have to figure out how many mods you want which will affect which class you run it. If you choose only PSS9s you can adjust ride height and dampening rates but not change camber (except if you have have a little adjustment for the rear due to having an 05' model). The crucial camber setting is in the fronts- where stock setting is about -0.5 and you really are looking for about -2.0 degrees to fully use your tires and to get better grip in cornering. You can still autocross with stock camber and do well but your tire wear will be significantly worse if you drive hard.

I would say you can drive harder and at the car's limits with all of the suspension upgrades (camber plates and rear lower control arms) which allow you to pick and CHOOSE how much camber to run front and rear for your given driving style. Alignment settings for toe can be 1/16 to 1/8" toe out in the front and zero toe in the rear which is a compromise for autocross and street use.

The 22mm rear sway bar is fine- set it to the middle hole and try it.
The endlinks are only needed if you are doing corner balancing since the endlinks front and rear are needed to be set to lengths that are neutral and not bearing weight. You want to disconnect all endlinks to sway bars front and rear before setting ride height on all four corners to get accurate weights. Then after setting ride height then reconnect the endlinks at a neutral position using the adjustable length feature- this maintains the weight balance you just adjusted for. Then you do alignment and try it out.
The stock endlinks are stong enough for street use and autocross but the lengths are set and if you try to corner balance you may find that after you finish you cannot fasten the endlink to the swaybars without affecting weight on a corner.

If you are doing only street driving then camber plates, rear lower control arms and endlinks are not required with the PSS9s. Alignment would be good to make sure that toe settings are correct and equal from left to right and if you have a recent MINI you can set rear camber a bit to the stock range from -1.0 to -2.0 degrees.

 

Thanks MINIHune! this is the kind of feedback/advice I'd been looking for. The MC Cabrio in my sig is our first MINI - my wife's. I got hooked and will either order an '05 MCS coupe next month or wait just a little longer and place an order for an early '06. As such the questions have been directed to help me determine which mods to consider and still stay within a competitive class for AX.

The path I'm looking at puts in some of the mods I'd like and leaves others I'd like to have (like an intake) out to stay in the lower competitive class. It'll be a LY MCS, 15% pulley and MTH, factory LSD, PSS9's with adj. front camber plates (RDR or Webb) and rear control arms, 22mm rear sway and probably new endlinks. That leaves me only one spare point to remain in my chosen AX class so probably going to add a Schroth harness. Anything more than that and I am head to head with some heavily modified M3's and I'm not ready to go there.... yet

I'm working through a local performance shop that can do the installs, corner balance and alignment for me. Will be running Flik Wasp 17x7's on either Kumho or Yokos for street, and 15x7 TD or another lightweight wheel on Azenies for AX.

As far as the rear arms go, are two (1/side) required or 4? I believe only 1/side if adjusting camber only, and 2/side if adjusting camber and toe - is this correct?

 

I've has my PSS9s since March and have autocrossed but not tracked the car.

It took a week for me to get used to the ride on the street, with front and rear set to full soft, but now I think the ride's just fine, albeit a bit firm. For autocross I set the front to two-thirds stiff and leave the rear at full soft (which is opposite from where I started).

The Helix/RDR camber plate set is very nice with no problems so far. I also have the Helix rear bar set to the middle hole.

I installed Helix lower control arms after my first event to take camber out of the rear; lowering the car puts way too much negative camber into the back end for autocross. I also lowered the front a bit more and got a little more than 2 degrees negative camber up there; you need more camber up front than in back by about 1 degree, I think.

At any rate, I'm very pleased with the PSS9s, and they work well with other hardware.

 

Thanks for the reply. My mind is made up - the PSS9s, rear arms and front adj. camber plates are a done deal, along with rear sway. How much did you lower front/rear from stock? Did you corner balance and re-align after setting ride height?

 

Lots of really good info in this thread - thanks everyone. This thread is really making me want a set of the PSS9. Are there any drawbacks or dislikes about this suspension? Are people still getting noises, or was that only during break-in?

How do you adjust the PSS9? I didn't see any adjustment ***** on the picture shown earlier, so do they adjust on the top or bottom of the strut? Wouldn't certain camber plates block access to the top of the strut?

Has anyone compared the strut body length of the PSS9 to stock? It appears that limited suspension travel is an issue with Minis, so it would be nice to have a shortened strut body.

Looking at the photo again... Why doesn't the front come with top hats? Or were they just not shown in the photo?

Lastly - Why does the only the rear come with helper springs? Why not also the front?

 

I can answer some of these questions. Others can chime in.

You adjust height with a wrench that usually comes with the kit but is commonly available.

You adjust rebound by twisting a dial at the BOTTOM of the strut, so access to the top is not an issue. Clockwise turns soften rebound, counterclockwise firms it up. There are 9 settings, but it's hard to distinguish them with great precision because the "clicks" aren't very discernable. At any rate, adjusting rebound on all four corners can be done in five minutes without raising the car. (You do have to turn the front wheels.)

The only downside is that the front springs are kind of wide, and this somewhat limits how far you can adjust your camber plates. Mine get me about one degree of negative camber. Ride height adjustment gets me another one degree.

My car is lowered about an inch at both ends, maybe a bit more.
You will definitely need a full alignment after install. Rear control arms are required to take some of the negative camber out of the back end. Ideally, your alignment will give you one more degree negative camber at the front than the rear.

Courtesy of David P, we weighed my car in preparation for corner weighting it. But the cross weights luckily were dead on without further adjustment.

 

This is strange. Firstly you shouldn't be able to pick up 1 degree of camber adjustment when only lowering the car 1". If fact you would be lucky to pick up ,5 degree if you lowered it 3".
Secondly, I don't know why you are only able to get 1 degree -camber with these springs? I get about 2.6 max on the driver side which is the least of the two. Could get over 3 degree on the passenger side.
Something is not right with what's going on with your camber adjustments.

 

Maybe I'm wrong about one inch; maybe it's 1.5 or more. I'm approximating here. The mere installation of the kit with its attendant lowering produced huge rear camber changes prior to realignment, though; less in front.

I'm not saying I have a TOTAL of one degree; I'm trying to decompose the camber changes according to their cause. The TOTAL for the front is a bit over 2 degrees.

I can't get my camber plates all the way in towards the center of the car, with the spring width being what it is. Can anyone else?

 

Whenm my Webb-RDR camber plates were installed, the pro installer put them on, as labeled, then went to align and set up the camber and couldn't get enough camber out of it

He had to un-install, switch R to L camber plates and re-installed. Now they are fine to adjust fully

? Maybe your set was mislabeled ?