Better hope a manatee doesn't cross paths with a wild percary?

 

....do you mean peccary,also known as the javelina??-many of those tusked beasties 'round Tucson.

 

I had the OMP before we designed and built our x-brace. We noticed no understeer with either - you probably have something else going on, since there's really no way that either brace could generate understeer by itself.

 

hmmmmmmmmmm. time to take it off and see what the diff is. thanks!

 

From my experience with the M7 USS, I'm a true believer that the braces can REDUCE understeer - by reducing chassis vibration and increasing front grip on rough pavement - but I don't know of any way a brace could INCREASE understeer, either.

 

Yes!!! I attend college at the UofA in the early 80's and our studio was covered with long stories on all of the walls about these animals...basically each Peccary characterized each one of our professors...was very funnny.

 

well from a completely simple point of view....you may have noticed less understeer/more oversteer when you put on a heavier rear sway bar. well, when you tigten the front, you will experience the opposite...anywho, i'm wondering if my experience is omp specific due to it's attachment points. btw, others on nam have noticed the same with the omp....thus my question about the tsw....sorry if too noobish for you.

 

please excuse the double post, but i wanted to follow up. the bar is off....too damn wet to push it though. the car is now less smooth and solid feeling...but "livelier" making turns around town. i am now open to the possibility that what i have called oversteer is a result of how "tight"/smooth the car feels with the bar on. anywho, i wouldn't want to track the car without the brace...that's fo sure. sorry for the thread incursion....btw, i notice that both braces mount at the same point on the a-arm bushing mount so their effects should be similar.

 

Sorry - I think the was a mis-picked emoticon.... pretty sure I was going for a Smiley... certainly not my intention to laugh at you.....

 

Ours has additional mounting points in the rear, too and is a true x-brace design. The OMP lower tie bar does add some rigidity - but nothing like our x-brace does. The X makes all the difference...

 

Installed my new V2 x-brace on Friday and spent the weekend at Eagles Canyon Raceway - one of the tougher and faster tracks in Texas. I can honestly say the x-brace stiffened up the entire car. Its almost as if I had adjusted the front and rear swaybars and I'm happy with the results. My MCS just "feels" much more solid and it seems to stay flatter in the high speed corners. I'm really looking forward to getting my car back out on an AX course to see how it helps there.

This mod coupled with the brand new TSW 12.2x.81 MDM brake kit I also installed Friday made the weekend a whole lotta fun, and are two of the best mods I've done to my car in the past year!

 

dang, the entire first page of this thread is a vendor war. i don't even want it now lol

 

Outside of the vendor, has anyone replaced an OMP lower brace with the X-brace?

I've got the OMP installed now, but I'd be really curious to hear any comments that might lead me to believe that the X-brace is noticeably superior...

 

As a point of reference, I replaced an OMP lower brace with an M7 USS and the improvement was significant. I have a cabrio where it may make more of a difference than a hardtop. At the time, the TSW was not yet available; otherwise I would have chosen it over the M7 because its design appeals to my engineering sensibilities.

 

If the USS works better than the OMP, I guess the X-brace would have to work a LOT better, as I am completely unimpressed with the USS. The USS is pretty poorly engineered, IMHO.

 

just wanna make sure i understand. you think the uss is significantly better than the omp, but you are completely unimpressed with the uss

 

I don't have personal experience with the USS, aside from seeing a few that have been removed from MINIs. However, I'm not impressed by the "engineering" of the USS.

However, rkw seems think that USS works better than than OMP (which I have), so I'm applying his comments and my belief that the X-brace is substantially better engineered than the USS.

Thus, the x-brace would have to be a substantial improvement over the OMP, if he is correct.

If X > U and U > O, then X >> O
Is that too complicated a train of logic because of all the Os and Xs?
6^)

 

i understand what you are trying to say. your equation hasn't moved me enough to ignore this one $379 > $125 so i'll stick with my omp for now. btw, i noticed the new batch of tsw x-braces have steel L brackets instead of the chomoly ferrules....a nice touch i must say

 

Rick -

I went from the OMP (which was a significant improvement from stock) to the X-brace. The X-brace provides a similar increase in perceived stiffness over the OMP as the OMP did over stock. I say "perceived" because I don't have numbers, only a "butt-accelerometer". (I'm sure it is as carefully calibrated as all those butt-dyno reports I keep reading about. )

I would expect the improvement to be measurable on the track with a sufficiently consistant driver and the right equipment. The X-brace (or its lower performance cousin, the OMP bar) should also be high on the list of improvements for cabriolet owners, who see signifiicant cowl shake on rough streets.

 

Thanks, Mini_Crazy.

Just what I was hoping to hear, as I've got the OMP now, and have an X-Brace on order to replace it. I really like what the OMP did - looking forward to reporting on the X-Brace soon.

 

i will be waiting to hear your impressions. fortunately, these things are very easy to put on / take off....so maybe you could go back and forth once or twice? i think that would mean more to me. earlier in this thread when i took the bar off and put it back on i was surprised at what i "felt"....of course coilovers and sway bars were put on around the time the omp went on....as did new alignment settings. so if you went back and forth, more than once, at say 2-7 day intervals, with everything else the same i think you'ld have a pretty informative (and unbiased!) post. just my 2 cent.

 

My considered hypothesis on gravity is, there is no such thing. The world just sucks.

 

I am confused by what is actually being compared to the TSX X-Brace. There is an OMP Lower Strut "Bar" which is just one bar across the suspension. There is also a Mini Madness Lower Strut "Brace" that appears to be made from an OMP Bar with additional rear bars (kind of similar to the M7 USS). It appears that some posters are calling the OMP Bar a Brace instead of a Bar.

How different in the Mini-Madness Lower Strut Brace at $199 compared to the TSX Lower Strut X-Brace at $379? I was think of going with the Mini-Madness brace because of the $180 price difference unless there is a huge difference. I can understand the huge difference between the OMP Bar and the TSX X-Brace because there is a big difference in the design, kind of an apples and oranges comparison. However, I would expect the Mini-Madness Brace and TSX X-Brace to be similar. I would expect the X-Brace to be better but is it $180 better (almost twice as expensive).

 

quickmni
The Madness Lower Strut Brace's bars actually go forward and attach to the front underbody pan. It is similair to the OMP with some added bracing. You will not be able to fit a TSW brace to your GP without altering the underbody paneling in the rear attachment points. That is the reason I went with the Madness.
Steve

[quote=quikmni;2644226]There is also a Mini Madness Lower Strut "Brace" that appears to be made from an OMP Bar with additional rear bars (kind of similar to the M7 USS). It appears that some posters are calling the OMP Bar a Brace instead of a Bar.

 

Steve,
Thanks for the clarification on the Mini-Madness Brace mounting. That does seem like it might be the better option for the GP even if not quite as beneficial. I was wondering if I would have to cut the underbody tray to mount the X-Brace, now I know yes I would.