Oh, that part is easy. The objective in driving around cones in a parking lot is to have the shortest time over the course (timed event). Every race that I am aware of awards the one with the shortest time over the course the designation of "winner". As Skiploder notes, once BMW/MINI decide to fight you, it comes down to whether you have the resources (and more importantly the will) to outlast them.

 

I guess I'm naive, too, because I do not see how driving around cones in a parking lot could be considered exciting enough to risk shelling out $5k for a new transmission. I did a track day, which was definitely fun, but after seeing two cars suffer serious damage on the track that would not be covered by insurance, I realized that it's just not that fun. For some reason I'm more comfortable risking life and limb for fun than risking life and limb and $$$.

 

I guess I am naive as well. Risking being shark bait just doesn't strike me as fun. But whatever floats your boat (or windsurfer....).

 

How can staying in first and second gear ruin one's transmission? I mean, aren't the top speeds in autocrossing about 35-40 mph? I really don't see how that could wreck a transmission.

 

I feel your pain, but I have to agree with MINI and the others. You put you car on a track (weather it is a made up track in a parking lot or Nurburing) and the car failed. You gave them the ammunition to deny your warranty. Besides, the tranny could have failed due to your driving, it is possible.

 

Running in a gear near or at red-line for a long period of time can eventually takes it toll on a tranny that was not designed for racing.

 

I just want to clarify.

They are not denying warranty work due to "racing"

The warranty is being denied over the supposed over-revving.

Steve

 

This is what one of the folks here considered me, because I said I think she will have a tough time collecting. Transmissions aren't that hard to install, but I'd probably get it out of the dealer shop. Warranty is set to expire anyhow. Buy used with low miles and you'll probably get at least another 50K out of it, or 100K without the competitive timed events, (sshhh, that's racing).

 

Not that CDMINI needs my help, but why is he an antagonist...because he's stating the reality of you raced the car, caused an overrev, you lose...that is the gamble you take, isn't it? Same with modding...you gamble that everything will be ok. AutoX is a timed event...whether in a parking lot or on a track, if it is a timed event, it is considered a race.

 

See post #13 - the dealer is aware that the car is autoxed. The excuse for denial and the real reason for denial may be different.

It's easier to claim owner abuse than to confront someone who had attended a dealer or Mini-sponsored event and sheepishly admit that taking part in the "event" led to warranty denial.

 

You guys are a real tough crowd. If the car was tracked or auto-x'd doesn't matter in the scope of the original post. The tranny should not of self destructed like that. Offer relevant advice not the associated scolding this board usually gives. MY advice is go to another dealer and see if they will work with you, go to an indy shop or source a tranny (good luck) and do it yourself. Litigation through BMW/MINI sucks. It's definitely not worth the trouble. You can probably get a tranny for $1000-2500. I wish you the best.

BTW, FWIW...I run my 03 MC at redline power-shifting ALL the time. I have 59,683 miles on the odometer as it sits. The motor/tranny is still running STRONG. Maybe it's just a matter of time...but I suspect the first thing to go is the motor NOT the trans. You guys are jokers.

 

Understood.

But knowing the guys at MINI of Pittsburgh, from the SAs to the techs, I know they are not in the habit of denying warranty work, they will do anything and everything they can to fix the problem. They are really good guys! But if they get into a situation where MINI USA says "NO" then their hands are tied.

99% of the time the denial of warranty work is not the dealers decission, it is made for them.

Steve

 

Do you think the dealer will apply the "pen test" and disallow it? Unless they can establish that you were consistently over-revving, it should be covered. After all , these cars are promoted for spirited motoring, aren't they?

 

I would guess to say that the decision never made it to MiniUSA. I do agree that when MiniUSA says no...the dealership will not get reimbursed for performing the warranty work. BUT, I have seen dealerships go above and beyond to do the right thing and eat the claim. THAT is a good dealership (Mini North Scottsdale ) ....but, I think you have your percentages backwards. Most claims don't make it up to corporate. I think this is one of them.

 

There are two worlds, "Real World" and "Warranty World". In the real world, a transmission should last the life of the car. Parts showing premature wear and subsequent failure should be covered under warranty. Ah, but in Warranty World the dollar is king! Costs have to be minimized. Warranties are subsidized by the price of the car. Everyone pays for warranties when they pay for their car. On an individual basis, how do you minimize the costs of an expensive repair? You deny the claim. It doesnt really matter what you tell the owner the reason is, this is informal and hopefully, if plausible enough, the customer will shut up and pay, but if it isnt, then the next step is up to the customer. The customer can sue and then the manufacturer has to show why they are not bound by the contract. If they can show that the owner violated any of the provisions of the contract, then the burden shifts back to the owner to show why the repairs should be covered. It should be emphasized that the driving force behind this entire procedure is not "whats right" or justice, it is MONEY. What is the least expensive way for the manufaturer to make this issue go away. If it is cheaper to pay for the repair than go to court, they will pay. If it is less costly to go to court, tell it to the judge. If for some reason they decide to pay, theywill probably require that you not disclose the terms of the settlement so as not to give anyone else ideas. Sad but true.
Good Luck!

 

All warranty claims are seen by coporate. The dealers know what will be kicked back by corporate, besides, it's a simple phone call.

Dealer: "Blown Tranny"

Corporate rep: "Cause?"

Dealer: "Over-rev condition" maybe even "Over-rev while auto crossing"

Corporate rep: "NO!"

20 seconds and the decision has been made. A dealer willing to eat a $4000 warranty claim is crazy, it's a business after all, not a charity.

I have heard tales, and been on the receiving end of MINI of Pittsburgh doing the right thing and going above and beyond in most cases, suffice it to say we probably do not have all of the information, we are only privy to one side of the story.

That said, I do hope that everything works out!

Steve

 

d

My bad, over-rev caused by racing...

The point is that it was put on a track and an over-rev occured. I assume that the MINI dealer knows this as well as they have denied the claim. Like I said, I feel your pain, but the over-rev may not of happened if the car was used in "normal" driving conditions. Instead, it happened on the track and a failure occured.

You guys are arguing a moot point. I'm getting ready to break out the popcorn.

 

But it does matter.... People that try to slide things thru warranty when they are at fault often cause us to pay more in the long run. Actually a good word for it is "theft". The book states that the warranty is void if the vehicle is tracked. Well, it was, so what is the argument? Come on here and bash a dealer for being honest and fair? Please, the dealer is not here to represent themselves and in this situationI have no problems backing them.

As others have said... You wanna play, you gotta pay.

 

Sorry Steve, didn't see this post until after the other. Anyway, I agree here. They are definetly in it to make money and this is a case of losing money.

 

The other thing to keep in mind. If it was an over-rev, and they replace the tranny under warranty, there may be an issue further down the road with the engine, it could have been damaged during the over-rev and that damage may not show up until much later.

Then what? Where does it end?

Steve

 

"I WANNA NEW CAR", is where lots of folks will take it to the "end".

I still say see if they'll make you a deal on labor and have them find a low mileage used tranny. Plenty of wrecked MINIs out there I am sure. Mine was totaled.

 

wow... regardless of the fact that she may have tracked her car. You guys are being fairly un-reasonable.

I look at my relationship with my dealer as a long term thing. I have a problem with my car, they think it's because I drive it too hard.

I then explain to them... you have pleased me with your services and prices so far. There is no reason why I should wan't to buy a car other then the bmw, porches, mercedes, infinities, mini's that they sell. They find it in their hearts to fix the car or split the cost with me.

Regardless of the fact that the car was tracked it seems as though it was damaged due to fairly normal conditions. I don't track my car often if at all, but you can bet that my normal spirited driving does just about the same wear and tear, and judging by the list of some of the mods of teh people chimming in, you folks are the same.

Sure this is a grey area that could go either way, but realistically the dealer can help you and help themselves in the future.

good luck and I hope that it works out of your in the future.

 

So if I autocross my car once, the warranty is done, void, kaput? So if I bring it in six month later for a warranty claim because the stereo stopped working, that's "theft"?

By the absolute letter of the warranty agreement, that would be the case. If you've used your car in a competitive event at any time in the past, the agreement says that the warranty is void.

But what a lot of people don't realize is that manufacturers often insert broad, Draconian exclusionary clauses to scare customers into line, all the while realizing that those exclusions may not actually stand up if challenged.

I'd like to see a dealer deny a "rust under the door sill" or "washer-fluid stained boot" warranty claim because the car was autocrossed once. I think we'd find out then how legal the blanket exclusion is.

Scott

 

I think it is a bit more narrowly focused - it was put on a track. At that point, the line was crossed into an excluded area (where warranty coverage does not apply). The only way that you can compel coverage is to be able to argue successfully (initial litigation and any appeal) that the exclusion for racing was barred by some statute. I am not aware of any law or regulation that would get you there (exclusion of warranty coverage for racing).

But based on the degree to which people's egos seem to be getting involved in this thread, it might be a good idea to break out the popcorn....

 

True, but are you willing to foot the cost of being right? And just for informational purposes, in California, a garden variety denial of warranty claim would cost you somewhere between $120,000 to $200,000 to get all the way through appeal.