Hey guys,

I installed a new post-cat ("Bank 2") oxygen sensor from BOSH 15379 OE fitment and I get a P0141 bank heater circuit error. Its brand new!

I tested the old sensor's heating unit (2 white wires) off the car and I get 6.7 ohms of resistance (155k miles on it!). With the new sensor I get 4.8 ohms of resistance.

I cannot find any info in the Bentley Manual and I calld BOSCH and they dont even recognize the part #. I couldnt believe it. AMAZON has it listed as the Manufacturers's part #.

Does anyone know the correct resistance for the rear O2 sensor or Bosch's part #?

The R56 doesnt have a fuse for the o2 sensors as far as I can tell from Bentley so I dont think its a fuse.

I appreciate you help,

 

As a tangent to this O2 sensor issue, Im gonna post some information that I got from a former BMW / Mini mechanic I spoke to who works at Bosch technical support. Imagine the luck, Im calling BOSCH and the tech support guy is a former Mini mechanic with 39 years experience.

1st thing, Bosch buys the O2 sensor from NGK. That's OEM oxygen sensor manufacturer. Not Bosch. He didnt know what the correct ohm values for the heating element were but he did say the values I measured made him suspect the new sensor was in fact faulty. (The retard I spoke to at Bosch the first time couldnt find the part#. Somehow AMAZON has a Bosch reseller's number for warranty support and not Bosch proper. I digress.)

The ex-mechanic explained that when you put on new O2 sensors or injectors you need to RESET ALL ADAPTATIONS using the proper software. In my case, using Autoenginuity with the Mini/BMW enhanced powertrain software. It allows you to reset adaptations to sensors or injectors as they change with age or start to malfunction. He explained that this is particularly common with new O2 sensors.

Assuming you have the correct scanner with enough capability you need to follow this procedure:

1. Connect to the car's OBDII port with scanner with engine on or ignition on and chose RESET ALL ADAPTATIONS.
2. Pull key out, wait 15 seconds
3. Key in, turn on car or just ignition on
4. Now clear all DTCs/CELs
5. Key off and let car completely go to sleep (no red light on at P on shifter, my car is automatic).
6. You're done.

Im not sure if old adaptations to the original O2 sensor with 155k miles was the cause of my CEL but he said its very likely.

Hope this helps someone else.

 

Just my experience but several years ago I purchased a Bosch O2 sensor for my 2005 Mini Cooper S from Amazon that said it was compatible. I took it to a Mini specialist to install (not a dealer). He tried to get it to work but had the same exact issue you are describing. If I recall, he said something about it not heating fast enough or something. He had a used OEM sensor he tried and it cleared my code right away. He gave me the used OEM sensor... just charged me labor and told me to return the Bosch unit.

It was years ago and you may have a different or updated Bosch sensor.

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I got another code for the same sensor even though I "reset all adaptations". They sent me a new Bosch sensor (same part #) and it has the same resistance across the heating element as the first unit. I havent installed it because I expect the same result.

Its bizarre because Bosch repackages the OEM manufacturer's sensor so it should work fine. Im gonna install the second unit and see what happens. Maybe its faulty and has nothing to do with the sensor's resistance.

 

FYI, after I cleared the p0141 code the second time, the malfunction indicator light (MIL) hasn't returned. I've driven over 1000 miles on the new engine since then. Why hasn't it returned?, I have no idea. Must have truly been an adaptation issue since both new Bosch (reboxed NGK) sensors had the same resistance in the heating element. The old unit had more resistance (153k miles and ten years on it).

For whatever its worth, I will say that after I installed the new engine it through maybe a dozen codes of all types such as throttle body codes, knock sensor malfunction, etc. Luckily I had a way to read and clear them all.

Fingers crossed.

 

Both my Bosch sensors (actually NTK in Bosch box) are giving me issues now. Initially it was just downstream P0141 (Bosch 15379) but now it upstream P2626 (Bosch 17112)

P2626 O2 Sensor Pumping Current Trim Circuit / Open (Bank 1 Sensor 1)
P0141 O2 Sensor Heater Circuit (Bank 1 Sensor 2)

I dont understand why these Bosch/NTK units are so problematic.

 

I had the exact problem 2011 Mini Clubman JCW, 62K miles. Even after re-setting adaptation on the PCM, the 15379 sensor creates the P0141 heater element code. Resistance on the heater is about 5 ohms on the 15379 sensor; 6.8 ohms on the old one NTK V7548961. My car had rodent chewed wiring which was the root cause prompting changing the sensor . Amazon fit utility is wrong, as well as the recommendation by Bosch. I returned the sensor to Amazon, cleaned the original OEM and reinstalled. Now there are no codes.

 

Where or in what location you had the rodent chewed wiring exactly? I have a friend with the same problem and he has already exchanged the O2 sensor for an NTK and still has the same problem and the same heater element code. I would greatly appreciate your help.

 

Hi Sub3622, The wires were chewed between the connector on the harness side and the PCM. On My car both black and yellow wires were chewed completely through completely. This is the power and ground to the sensor heater (white wires on the sensor plug position 1 and 2) I disconnected the other plugs and pulled the entire harness up on top of the engine for good visibility. Make sure the harness connector is fastened correctly to make a good "seat" with the sensor plug. As you push the Red latch, hold up on the sensor plug so it is grabbed by the latch and drawn in to the connector. When in position, Its not the easiest place to work in the engine compartment. Also, if the sensor is new, he may have to reset the PCM adaptations to allow the sensor properties to be "learned" by the computer. Attached is a photo of the chewed harness.

 

OREM, thank you very much and appreciate your help, i will let my friend know.

 

I actually took both "Bosch" sensors off and returned them to AMAZON. The upstream lasted a year then created constant CELs. The downstream caused issues intermittently and then constantly after 6 months. I reinstalled the original sensors with 145k miles on them, cleared the CEL and now Im not getting any CELs. Great. Except they are old and I don't wanna pay for OEM sensors at $300 each. That's CRAZY.

I called Bosch and Amazon and here is what went down: https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ts-dealer.html

Amazon says they are authorized (!!!), Bosch says they are not. They claim Amazon is not authorized and they will not warranty and I cannot trust Bosch sold through Amazon. WTF!

But if the connectors are specific to our cars why are these re-boxed NTKs by Bosch causing CELs?

ECS Tuning sells the same NTK units and Bosch units. I know ECS Tuning is not an authorized Bosch dealer. Will their's cause CELs? How about RockAuto? They aren't Bosch authorized either I was told by Bosch. Will their units cause CELs?

Why do AMAZON's Bosch 15379 and 17112 units not work? Are they perhaps for another BMW or Mini?

 

Lex2008: My thoughts are Until the OEM sensors cause problems, dont replace them. Bank 1 Sensor 1 is not really not an oxygen sensor, it is a fuel ratio sensor or AFR, sometimes called a wide band O2 sensor. The one that causes the CEL for emissions purposes is Bank 1 Sensor 2 which measures O2 levels. So, if MPG drop, sensor 1 could be suspect. Wait for the CEL before suspecting the sensor 2 is bad. OEM recommends replacing at 100K miles, but if still working, there is no need in my opinion. By the way, the part number on sensor 1 on my car is Bosch 17112. Sensor 2 is NGK. The replacement by Bosch, sold by amazon is niether NTK nor NGK, nor Bosch. Amazon packaged in a bosch box as Sensor #15379, but the sensor itself is marked made in Japan with number 250X1330, unrelated to NTK, NGK, or Bosch. I dont get it, but if the ohms dont read around 6.8 ohms across the heater, it will store the code P0141, and I have deemed it the wrong sensor for the application. My car just passed emissions with the original sensors installed from BMW factory, Mileage 64000.
One thing I hate about Amazon, is you cannot rate their resale warehouse products badly. The rating and review will be rejected. This is, in my opinion not correct and really should be investigated by Dept of Commerce. Seems they are manipulating the ratings and seems a anti-trust like violation to me.

 

OREM, thanks for your thoughts and info, especially the part #s. What year model is your Mini?

What Bosch sent me was either an NTK or NGK, cannot recall but I talked to a BOSCH tech support guy who was a retired Mini Cooper technician (!!!) about my Amazon sourced Bosch O2 downstream sensor last year and he told me it was reboxed by Bosch for Mini, he never told me it was the wrong application and he told me to reset all adaptations.

Clearly its not the correct application. But who screwed up? Bosch, NTK or Amazon?

 

Lex2008, Mine is 2011 Clubman, JCW. Somewhere else in this topic thread it reads the current Bosch, (former Mini Tech) said he didn't think the one with a reading about 5 ohms across the heater would work correctly. I had tried after resetting PCM adaptations and the 4.8 ohm one (bosch 15379) still would not work. The one that reads around 7 ohms works like a charm. I think the problem is the indirect method of determining the oxygen level as the oxygen zirconium reaction results in a change of resistance as a function of temperature and hence oxygen level. The wrong base comparison level on he PID readings is consistently out of tolerance and generates the code P0141. When I look at the data, it is expecting a base value minimum of 700 ohms and maximum of 1.500 k ohms, and the sensor reports (erroneously because it the wrong sensor) 1.546 k ohms, thus fails and sets the code. No resetting of adaptations will correct this mismatch. The correct sensor routinely runs in the range as it should between 700 and 1500 ohms.
As a side note, In the past, I did a lot of work on cars from the 60s, 70s and 80s. Most frustrating to me was going to the auto parts store and obtaining the wrong part, only to hear the clerk say "thats what the book says fits your car"
Amazon and Bosch are doing the same thing.
Hope this all helps and does not lead to more confusion.

 

Well, its a great discussion but as per your last statements, the auto parts store (Amazon) is selling the wrong parts. Luckily these 02 sensors are super easy to access.