I had very responsive brakes before getting them replaced. Now they feel very spongy and take a lot more effort to press the pedal all the way. Anyone know what's wrong? Do I need to flush the fluid or is it the new pads? They're ceramic Monroe pads, and I got all 4 rotors / pads.

Thanks

 

If you got ceramic they may feel a bit different. If the brakes feel spongy/soft, you may probably have air in the lines. Re-bleed the lines. You also may want to bed-in the brakes, this will help attain the best use of the brakes as well as prevent glazing. If you have already done a fair amount of driving without bedding, then it will take a bit longer for the brakes to wear in properly. You should have a very firm brake pedal and should not need to depress it far for you to feel the brakes bite.

Shouldn't be to difficult to fix. Enjoy

 

Whenever you install new brakes ( pads ,rotors ) you have to bed them, this process makes two things:
1) Adjusts the shape of the pad to the shape of the rotors in order to have the right pad material transfer to create the right friction to stop the rotor
2) Anneals the rotors, by heating up the rotor and let it cool down you anneal the metal, this prevents the rotors from warpage in the future.
So, if you didnt' bed your brakes, it is time to do it, pretty easy, drive your Mini at 35-45 mph and hard brake ( without engaging the ABS) do this until you feel that the brakes fade out ( takes betwen 5-10 times ) then let cool down the rotors by driving at constant speed for 20 min and then stopping the vehicle, don't apply your- e-brake, instead chuck the wheels, this allows to have the proper cool down.
Regarding the spongie pedal, just bleed the brakes, two ways of doing it:
1) Motive power bleeder
2) Someone helping you to press/depress the brake pedal, pump twice, open the bleeding valve and let the pedal to bottom down, then close the bleeding valve and repeat until no bubbles come out and the pedal feels firm.

Also check if the pads have racing compound, never use racing compound pads for street as they need to be warm up before they can brake. Use street performance pads or OEM pads.

Hope this helps,

Reards,

 

All of the above makes sense.

If you did not open the bleeders of the brake lines there should be no way air got in your brake fluid.

My money is on this.... Also make sure that the inboard pad on the rear brakes has the spring clip seated over the caliper piston correctly. If it is not the peddle will feel spongy.

 

Thanks guys, I'll take it to the shop that did my brakes and have him check out whats mentioned above. Thanks! And I cant wait to "bed" the brakes tomorrow

 

Just stopped by the shop and the mechanic says there's no way the break lines have air in them (didn't even look). Also said that ceramic brakes have a breaking in period, and they always seem like they're hard to press down. I think he's full of sh*t. I've driven them over 500 miles and have been braking somewhat hard. Still feels sluggish and unresponsive.

 

Unless he opened a bleeder or opened a brake line there is no way that air got in doing anything he did.

Did you bed in the brakes? From the sounds of it you have not. If not that could be your issue. Do a search on brake bedding.

 

Be careful bedding the brakes. If you get too aggressive you could produce vapor in the lines. Just drive it normally in city driving for a couple of hundred miles. That should do it.

 

I've driven around 500 miles, and also have done some 45-0 stops w/out abs, then left the ebrake off for 20 min in 1st gear. Doesn't seem to be getting much better, but I'll check back in.

I've never heard of a break in period for brakes. What's that about a rear clip? How do you know if its not in correctly?

 

Just out of curiosity, when was the last time you flushed your brake fluid? I realize that if the bleeders were never opened then you wont have air, however brake fluid does absorb moisture in the air, and should be changed every few years.

 

The brakes felt fine before the pads / rotors were replaced. I'd think the fluid would be a more gradual change, not so instant.

 

Now it is just possible that Monroe ceramic brakes are not very good.

I have Hawk ceramic brakes & they feel fine to me, but do not feel the same as the oem pads did. I'm wondering if you are just feeling the difference between oem & ceramics.

 

I thought OEM was ceramic... no? Are ceramic usually less grabby?

 

OEM is made from compressed coal dust. OEM are not ceramic. OEM do have a good initial bite, while ceramics don't have the same initial bite. It is a different feel, but IMHO ceramics are good brakes & better than OEM.

 

FWIW If your issues do not resolve:

I would have stainless brake lines installed http://new.minimania.com/web/Item/NMB1003/InvDetail.cfm

and have the system completly flushed out with new fluid.

It could be that he "hung" a caliper out of the way and kinked the factory brake line ... thereby putting a weak spot in the rubber line.

Just about EVERY aftermarket brake replacement kit HIGHLY RECCOMENDS putting on new stainless brake lines.

Note: MINI recommends having the brake fluid replaced every two years .... which the majority of us do not do unless racing/autoX and then we do it way more often than that!!

Bob

 

The people that sell SS brake lines & brake kits would love for you to buy a set $$$. I seriously doubt the OP has any problems with his brake lines. SS lines are nice & I have them, but I have to say they are low on the bang for the buck scale. If someone put them on your car & didn't tell you I think you might be hard pressed to tell the difference.

I think it is a bedding in issue the OP has & if he beds them in or just puts more miles on them he will adjust to the feel.

I agree changing the fluid is a very smart preventative measure.

 

One point to note on replacing the rear pads. After you are done, engage/disengage the e-brake a few times. This will help the screw-in pistons to readjust themselves. Only thing is you may not really be using them. I believe the brake pressure is set up 70/30 between front and back.

 

Good point on using the e-brake to adjust up the rear pads. It is also a good idea to be very careful after you have just changed pads. The first few brake applications will give you a long brake peddle.

I'm sure there is more front brake bias than rear, but with EBD we are now seeing rear brakes wear at a rate closer to the fronts. That wasn't the case in the past.

 

What type of shop is this?

I'm guessing here but it's very possible the mech/tech (or doofus?) unscrewed the bleeder valves to compress the calipers. In doing so, air might have gotten into the lines. If the brake fluid hasn't been flushed in the last 2-3 years, it should be done to clean out the system and protect the ABS unit. And if that doesn't help, I would dump the Monroe pads.

 

I read a thread yesterday or day before, by someone who complained that the Hawk ceramic pad he installed felt like "soap". Alex at Tirerack said that they have much less initial "bite" than say the Hawk HPS. This is likely the difference you are feeling. I doubt the machanic opened the bleed valve to compress the brakes. That would take too much time vs just using a caliper compressor. With 500 miles on the set, I would say you are just feeling the difference in the pads from what you had before. However, if you don't use your e-brake, pull it on and let it off about 10 times, like you are jacking up the car. That is the way the rear brakes are set. Don't pull it too far but just like you would if you are setting it to park. Definately get the fluid flush. This should have been done whether or not you changed the brakes. As for SS lines- - They will make the brakes feel better but not a substitute for pads you like. As for race pad. I run them 24-7 and the work fine for me on the street, if you don't mind the dust and noise. The first time you use them when they are cold takes a little more effort than when warmed up but not uncomfortably so. I actually like the Hawk HP+ for the street, but these have a lot of bite which may be too much in the other direction for you. But they seem to be linear and will plant your nose on the windshield with little effort. A lot of dust but little noise. These are actually very similar to the stock R56 pads but with a little more bite. Good luck with this. I am on my 3rd set this year trying to work out the best combination for HPDE (track days). BTY - The Mini pads are easy to change yourself and there are a number of posts on NAM showing how it is done.

 

^^^
Thanks, Im def going to crank the ebrake in the AM. I wanted to change the pads myself for the first time, especially since I'm sick of trusting whatever ***** pads the mechanic wants to use. Waaaaay too expensive as well. I just started a new job and have been too busy to do this project - maybe in the fall, but thats too long to wait.

Thanks for the help!

Side note, I noticed that my ebrake handle was loose after getting my car back from the brake shop (pretty reputable place - local but not a hole in the wall uncle wallys type). The end **** came off of the ebrake and the rest of the handle wont seem to click back into position. How does this thing come on / off?

 

FYI - here is a good link:
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...beginners.html

Have a small box or bucket (upside down) handy to rest the caliper on so the brake line is not stretched tight.

The R56 is pretty much the same but easier. I know, '04, Gen 1; I just thought I would throw this in. A few minor differences. There is no spring retainer for the pads. I remove the caliper by the 2 -5/8s bolts (metric/SAE works the same on these) on the back of the steering knuckle; not the 2 on the back of the caliper... Buy the Harbor Freight piston compressor kit that is shown at the NAM post above. This is a must for the rear rotors that can only be compressed by screwing in the piston.

If you just on the street the Mini pads are fine. For more bite or autocross, the Hawk HP+. For the track - Carbotechs (try AutoXcooper). As for rotors, I just bought a pair from NAPA ($45 ea) and they look good. No real time on them as they just went in, but they are flat and round


As for the hand brake - that sounds weird. Maybe someth broke In most cases I would say mechanics are honest and trying to do a good job. That is how they stay in business. You think this happened at the shop? After 500 miles, if I owned a shop I would likely not agree that it was my fault. So you might be on your own on this. If you noticed it the day you picked it up, then you might have a chance. Still, give it a few pulls to make sure the rears are set. It should get tight at about 1/2 way up (~45 deg). BTY, you should use the e-brake all the time to make sure they stay set and for extra assurance when parked.

 

I had a situation once, where I changed all the pads on a car (it was an RX-7, if it matters), and it turned out that one of the pads was getting hung up in the caliper slider, due to the paint, or powdercoat, on the back of the pad being too thick. It was only one of the 8 pads, but it caused the same symptom...spongy pedal. I could see which pad it was because it wasn't leaving an even amount of material/wear across the rotor...only about an inch, close to the "hat". I went back in, removed the offending pad, and filed it down. ...Re-bedded, and problem was fixed.

 

In the future, I suggest going with OE brakes. Ceramics feel like crap on these cars.

 

That is an opinion not a fact. I've been using ceramics for almost 4 years & for me they are fine. Have to love the light brake dust. No oems for this old fart, they are the carp for sure.

Just my opinion & not necessarily fact, your mileage may vary.