Do our mini coopers have a duplex timing chain??

I never knew why companies used single style timing chains, but historically its a primary engine failure with Mercedes; who when from duplex to single timing chains back in late 1980s.

 

Do the R56 engines even have a timing 'chain'? I thought they had a timing 'belt'. Big difference.

 

They use a chain, should last the life of the engine.
Engine readup http://www.motoringfile.com/2004/12/...nge_in_detail/

 

i just heard from mini that(in for the second time for cold start issue) The reason they are telling me the noise is coming from the cam chain itself was too long, clattering on the side of the engine. this is the first i have hear of this.

they replaced the cam chain tesioner and now it's the chain. well supposedly there was a few recalls on the car that needed to be fixed and will have it a few more days to get the parts from Germany.

Anyone else had this issue with the chain being too long? you would think the whole car would be running differantly, the timing being off and such.?

thanks for you guys out there with the determination finding the root of the problem, keep it up!

 

yes big difference. Good thing we have chains.

 

Mine has done this twice in the year since I purchased. Both times was just after washing the vehicle, pulling it around the house and parking it nose down for the night. Next morning, I get the sound. The first time it went to the dealer and they stated that this "noise" was normal, and that they "all do it". I was sceptical and started reading posts here about others seeing the issue. The next time it happened, I noted that I had repeated the same steps to reproduce the issue (short move of vehicle, parked nose down til morning). Called the dealer again and went in for the same BS story about it being normal. I have ever since been parking in either nose up or level parking areas, and I have not had the noise at all. Until BMW comes with a "real" fix, I will continue.

Peace-

 

Rather than adding your own rant about how this thread has become worthless ranting... maybe you should read through the thread a little more carefully. You would have then learned that the oil level and consumption question you had has been asked and answered... TWICE .

You would have also read that MINI's initial point of focus has been the timing chain and tensioner. When replacing that doesn't work, they turn towards the valves, lifters, VANOS system. When that doesn't work they rebuild the head. This is not new news. There's some useful information within these 20+ pages... you should try reading some of them and catch up a little bit with the current status of this particular issue rather than adding to the useless whining. Seems that you're going down a very well-worn path on a pretty high horse.

The other question about running with the oil cap off was somthing you could easily try yourself and report back (which you did... so thanks ).

Like two chains running side-by-side? Check www.realoem.com. You can probably see for yourself. But looks like a single chain to me.

You're buying this? "The timing chain installed at the factory was too long"? I'd call BS on that one.

Also... recalls? No recalls that I'm yet aware of. What parts are they ordering for you?

 

CHain length has nothing to do with it

If the chain is too loose, you cant just remove a link or anything as it would put the timing off and vavles thru the pistons.

It kinda makes a bit of sense to me: youve got the gears and cogs all numerically in sync with the number of links of the chain; excess looseness needs to be properly tensioned and unslacked for smooth operation. If the chain is just a bit too long then either more tensioners need to be used or all the gears/cogs and chain length must be recalculated (shortening the chain).

Also, the chain could be too tight! Depends on where it may be rubbing, if in fact thats the whole problem.

BWM may just need some more aggressive chain guides as a quick fix.

Example from a GM Quad 4 timing chain design: If the chain is too long or too short anywhere in its design there may be potential for scrubbing at numerous points. Notice how many tensioners and chain guides are in this design:


BTW timing chains are more expensive of a design than timing belts.

 

In a technical sense, it is ulikely the chain is "too long." It should be manufactured to the same length as all the other chains. More likely, if that is the problem at all, it was not tensioned enough. While the length of the chain should be fixed, tensioners can be mis-set or move out of alignment.

 

mash4441:
as far as I know there was a recall on something in the gearbox and the cd face plate (a little door was missing) but it could be that mine is one of the first production weeks...

 

my teeth often chatter when cold. My car's better not.

 

I had to replace the belt every 80k miles or so on my VW. Even though I did it myself, it was still not cheap. Plus, there was wear and tear on the aluminum motor mount via the steel bolts, which led to stripping out the hole. Hey, I wonder if a new chain can be broken and rejoined around the motor mount on the MINI, when it does come time to change it?

 

To do it right you need a new chain, sprockets, guides, and probably a tensioner. Who knows how long our single design chains will last, I'll most likely not own the car by then (Im gessing 100-200k miles)

 

so, my car went in for it's serivce- they let it sit for three days, and it was cold, so they heard the noise. only thing is that they said it was due to being a little low on oil, and that after topping it off, that it ran fine. of course, the car never got to sit again, and they started it hot. having followed this issue here, i know that there is a greater issue than oil level, and am assuming that next time i let the car sit overnight in the cold, the issue will reappear.
i was told if it happens again, to bring the car back. guess i'll be seeing more of them soon. sigh.

 

I'll add my voice to the list of concerned owners. Mine has done this a few times on cold mornings, but has gone away quickly until today. It lasted a couple of minutes during warm-up. I had assumed it was turbo clatter because it sounded like the super charger I added to my bugeye during the first few seconds of warmup. I can see that from this thread that is not the problem.

I will call today to report it to the dealer. I join all of you in pressing for an answer/solution.

 

April 2007??

Mines July of 07.

 

Like I mentioned earlier, my noise is present all the time, not just on cold start, so it's probably a different problem than you guys, but thought I'd update you anyway. Took mine into the shop and they said I need a new timing chain. It'll be here in a week "from Germany," they said. I bought my car in March 2007, if that helps. I'll keep you all updated.

UPDATE: I just talked to the guy when I went to pick it up. It was in fact the chain tensioner that was the problem. Same as you other guys.

 

+1

Any update abt cold start chatter, referring to so called "new parts" (most recent ones)?

Could someone post names of parts changed + codes?

Thanks

 

Interesting. I searched for a thread on this problem before the end of the year and saw nothing.

So our Cooper S started to exhibit this in maybe November. Low miles, about 5000 at the time, bought in May '07, build date I think in March '07.

Now I live in SoCal, and it doesn't get too cold around here. Maybe coldest in my garage would be low 50s at night.

Anyway, brought it to dealer and explained a "diesel rattle" on cold start that quickly goes away. In my case, about 10 seconds and its gone. Just the "normal" loud engine after that.

They kept the car and basically said the bled the engine as described in the TSB. This was back in Feb when I finally brought the car in (we were out of country) .

Car still does this. I guess I'll stay on them next service. I need to bring it in for a squeaky front left suspension.

I look forward to a real fix. This noise does not sound good.

 

not that this is any surprise, but after my dealer visit, and several days of no noise, it's back...

 

Hi , I tryed a search but with no results so do not crucify me.

Is this a issue with only the MCS engine. Does it relate to the basic Mini cooper also.

Thanks

 

I've looked for the MC question too. NAM seems to have mostly MCS owners, so the opportunity for this to happen to a NAM member with an MC is a lot less. So far, I don't think I've seen any reports on the MC, but the dealers proposed solution to bleed the tentioner would indiciate that it could be on MC since it's the same tensioner system (of course no one seems to really beleive the tensioner is really the issue other than MINI).
One of the other theories is that it's the hydraulic lifter, which is the same part # for MC and MCS too, although the cam ramp angles are different....maybe enough to limit the opportunity for the problem on the MC.

 

I noticed that the "cold start" thread has decreased new entries, during last month.

What is the cause?

1) warmer climate

or

2) new updated components for MCS at the Oxford plant

What do you think abt this?

 

Probably people not just bothering to repeat what's already been posted and waiting to hear of a solution.

 

Mine had definitely been better since the weather has gotten warmer, no 'new' parts required.