Is it just me who's getting a little tired of red-angry-faced icons forewarning us about what we can and cannot say - and now we can't substitute characters for letters in swear words?

Thanks for all the tips on the MINI but this site is is a little over-moderated for my tastes. Not that I have ever attacked anyone or intend to and don't even feel the need to swear all that much (though sometimes another word will simply not cut it "Dang, I wrecked my MINI" does not relay the feelings one has when smashing their beloved. A moderators job is to enforce site guidelines, not make personal posts about people's behavior (I'm sure a response will be posted to this message if it doesn't get deleted first). And if the moderator indeed believed we were all intelligent persons why would his posts continue to prevail the site, and then be locked so we could not post a reply. "Here's the rules...there will be no discussion"

Everyone else enjoy as you are "...brought into compliance..." by the Thought Police (that title says it all)

***************
Profanity and personal attacks will be deleted. Both of these issues are serious threats to the character of MCO and as such will be dealt with swiftly.

Profanity includes any cute spelling with extra characters replacing proper lettering & ^ @ ! #

Attacks against other members of this site are likewise not going to be passed over lightly.

Be forewarned that I will no longer edit posts for these issues; they will be deleted. Any post referencing a deleted post will also be deleted. If the flame baiting is serious enough, entire threads may be deleted. If you participate in this type of activity I can go further and delete other posts of yours to dock your post count.

This will be brought into line. There is no excuse for it. We're all reasonably educated people here and this activity be corrected. Modify your posting patterns voluntarily or you will be brought into compliance.



Anyone who sees activity that may require moderation can CONTACT A MODERATOR Most of us have links in our signatures. As L.Mini said, "we don't bite. " We are here voluntarily to see that the place we like to visit and the place you like to visit are preserved and organized in an orderly fashion so that it remains useful and enjoyable for the vast majority of users.

Dave


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I suddenly feel like we're a bunch of kids in a playpen

May I suggest an "Obscenity Only" forum, and make us sign an e-aggreement, then Mark can get sponsors from Playboy and FHM (with the boob-job MINI).

_________________
Wisdom is not a function of age, but a function of experience.
*The April Club *

 

OK, I'm not a moderator, but I'll post a reply (which I'm sure will be one of many)...

I personally don't think that this site is over-moderated. It is indeed moderated - as opposed to un-moderated as some sites are - and therefore the moderators would seem to me to have certain responsibilities. First and foremost would be to set a particular tone for the site. Like it or not, the tone rules established for this site are no profanity and no personal attacks. Beyond this, it seems like pretty much everything else goes...and that in and of itself is frankly somewhat unusual. Last I checked, I didn't have a constitutional right to post on Internet message boards. Rather, I am allowed to post given that I follow whatever rules are inplace on the board I visit. If I want to create posts that do not fit those rules, I can leave for another board that fits my needs...or start my own.

I think the mods have made a pretty good case for why we have the "no profanity/no personal attacks" rules...and to a large extent this seems to relate to the need for making the board an attractive space for sponsors. I again have no personal problem with this as I doubt MCO could exist at all w/o sponsors.

As to why the mods need to lock down posts after making comments...well, I'm assuming that this is part of fulfilling the moderation role. If mods simply made comments and then proceded to allow further public conversation, then what would be the effect of that? More prolonged behavior that would need even more moderation. In the asynchronous environment, some things need to be resolute and immediate if they are to have impact...and I think that this is what is being attempted when a thread is locked down. It's not a task that I would relish undertaking, but I think our mods are doing the best that they can. IMO. :smile:

 

:smile:

-s.b.

 

>>OK, I'm not a moderator, but I'll post a reply (which I'm sure will be one of many)...
>>
>>I personally don't think that this site is over-moderated. It is indeed moderated - as opposed to un-moderated as some sites are - and therefore the moderators would seem to me to have certain responsibilities. First and foremost would be to set a particular tone for the site. Like it or not, the tone rules established for this site are no profanity and no personal attacks. Beyond this, it seems like pretty much everything else goes...and that in and of itself is frankly somewhat unusual. Last I checked, I didn't have a constitutional right to post on Internet message boards. Rather, I am allowed to post given that I follow whatever rules are inplace on the board I visit. If I want to create posts that do not fit those rules, I can leave for another board that fits my needs...or start my own.
>>
>>I think the mods have made a pretty good case for why we have the "no profanity/no personal attacks" rules...and to a large extent this seems to relate to the need for making the board an attractive space for sponsors. I again have no personal problem with this as I doubt MCO could exist at all w/o sponsors.
>>
>>As to why the mods need to lock down posts after making comments...well, I'm assuming that this is part of fulfilling the moderation role. If mods simply made comments and then proceded to allow further public conversation, then what would be the effect of that? More prolonged behavior that would need even more moderation. In the asynchronous environment, some things need to be resolute and immediate if they are to have impact...and I think that this is what is being attempted when a thread is locked down. It's not a task that I would relish undertaking, but I think our mods are doing the best that they can. IMO. :smile:

agreed.

 

>>..edited..<<

 

I called somebody a '******' on mini2 and it was deleted.
I'll call myself a ****** here and see what happens. Personally,
I really don't give a .

 

It has gotten a bit ridiculous. The mods seem to have little or no sense of sarcasm or humor. I've had posts deleted that were clearly (to anyone with a modicum of sense) a goof.
It seems that a lot of the spirited posting that took place on the brink of "Gulf War II: This Time We Mean It!" would be off-limits now. Too bad, because I learned a lot about a lot of you in the midst of those 15 page post wars.
But from now on, we'll keep the talk to MINIs and Pop Tarts.
I like Brown Sugar.

 

>>>>, I didn't have a constitutional right to post on Internet message boards. Rather, I am allowed to post given that I follow whatever rules are inplace on the board I visit. If I want to create posts that do not fit those rules, I can leave for another board that fits my needs...or start my own.
>>>>

its not about constitutional right, its about respect. and since when are you not allowed to say what you want on the internet? (not meaning this site) if i wanna make my own website that bad mouths the president, i can do that. this whole issue deals with respect and frankly the lack of it.

 

>>I called somebody a '******' on mini2 and it was deleted.
>>I'll call myself a ****** here and see what happens. Personally,
>>I really don't give a .

Somehow the prohibition on using special characters slipped right by the moderators. That period at the end of the last sentence is obscene, and I want a stop put to it

 

>>Last time I checked "!@#$%^&*()" those characters are not listed as profanity in any dictionary I can find.<<

Come on, man. What's the difference between cursing and cursing-but-substituting-a-$-for-one-letter? You feeling clever, that's the only difference. It's still profanity and it's not allowed, so fine, go elsewhere. Them's the rules.

 

As I see it we are here as guests of Mark. It's his site, and he can call the shots. If there are members who have an urge to use profanity or personally attack others, may I suggest redirecting those energies towards creating more original posts, as satire when properly used can adequately express just about any thought or emotion without raising the other party's ire. Think of it like a good parry in fencing. Explatives do more harm than good to MCO's image, both to outside visitors as well as insiders like vendors and posters. Sometimes the thought police do seem a little draconian, I've had posts deleted that I thought didn't deserve to be, but hey, to err is human.

 

>>..edited..<<

 

Unfortunately, I doubt some of the mods could recognize satire.

 

>> Think of it like a good parry in fencing.

FENCING! Hey watch it buddy...just what are you trying to imply? :evil: Next thing I know you'll be taking about dressage...and them's fightin' words.

I like brown sugar. In moderation.

 

>>>>to err is human.
To forgive divine.
I forgive you.

 

There are quit a few people on this site that I would like to see kicked off for their attitude's and critizing other tastes. If you don't like it just keep your mouth shut. No reason to blast someone elses taste. And finally for those who like to attack others on this site. Grow up or go to this site until you do.NICK

 

 

>>>>Last time I checked "!@#$%^&*()" those characters are not listed as profanity in any dictionary I can find.<<
>>
>>Come on, man. What's the difference between cursing and cursing-but-substituting-a-$-for-one-letter? You feeling clever, that's the only difference. It's still profanity and it's not allowed, so fine, go elsewhere. Them's the rules.

I harken back to Almost Famous.

Anita Miller: **** YOU!
Elaine Miller: HEY!
Anita Miller: This is a house of lies!
Elaine Miller: Well there it is, your sister used the "F" word.
William Miller: I think she said "****."
Elaine Miller: What's the difference?
William Miller: The letter "u."

Words are words. Intentions are intentions. Trying to integrate, interpret and regulate the two is a slippery business.

It goes beyond regulating personal attacks. One thread degenerated when a poster didn't like the content and tone of a reply and responded with numberous personal attacks and comically veiled threats.

No personal attacks are fine. No cursing is perfectly understatandable - even the asterisk thing while amusing is understandable. The Almost Famous reference was just too good to pass up, but "You don't like it shuddya mouf" comments should not be tolerated if this is to be considered an open and impartial forum.



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I've found my distaste not with the moderators, but with those members that seem compelled to act like one.

However, I disagree with the fact that this website is one person's alone. A message board without members is just the ranting of one man or woman. Respect the owner, but provide your members with the ability to speak freely. Its like anything else on the net, if you don't like it, don't click on it.

 

I have edited my posts in the hopes that I don't offend anyone.

 

:smile: It is about respect. Mark began this site to facilitate MINI enthusiasts with information. It never was about the off topic forum. There are other places on the net that you can argue anything. While Off Topic is a place I spend a lot of time (while I wait for my car) it has offended me at times. And there are threads that I simply will not click on if I think it may be offensive.

I agree a simple exchange of ideas never hurt anyone as long as you can do it in a respectful manner. It is always better to try and win someone to your point of view while doing it respectfully. The opposite point of view may give someone the benefit of the doubt in discussing sensitive topics in polite ways. I have been a part of the 15 page War debates and was uncomfortable many times.

About cursing: A good friend once said to me "Cursing is the uneducated man's way of expressing his emotions".

Just my 2 cents. I applaud the mods. :smile:

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Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose

 

I am of the belief that you can get a point across quite well without having to resort to profanity. It's not as if I don't cuss like a sailor, which I sometimes do. It's all a matter of writing well, and if you are good at it, you can rip apart a subject without having to resort to the 'seven dirties'.

The other reason I try to limit my swearing is that many people (me included) surf this site from work, or some from public places, schools, or with their children, or let their kids surf this place themselves. One risks tripping 'profanity filters' and risk reprisals from their employers if they have such guidelines in place. I don't want that to happen. Plus, how hypocritical do us adults sound when admonishing our kids not to swear when they see it plastered all over the adult world?

I am more against the concept of 'thought police' than many people, and will do my part to stop it from happening, but it's all about context. Yeah, describing an accident where some fool in an SUV blathering on a cell phone takes out their MINI while they are stopped at a light does tend to make one use colorful language more than not, but you can make the point quite well without it.

Just my 20 millidollars worth, I hope I am not being a pain in the *** here.

 

***There are quit a few people on this site that I would like to see kicked off for their attitude's and critizing other tastes. If you don't like it just keep your mouth shut. No reason to blast someone elses taste. And finally for those who like to attack others on this site.***

Yes. That's the spirit. This will really be an interesting, engaging place when we all reply to one another with "Dittos."*


*This post contains sarcasm.

 

>>its not about constitutional right, its about respect. and since when are you not allowed to say what you want on the internet? (not meaning this site) if i wanna make my own website that bad mouths the president, i can do that. this whole issue deals with respect and frankly the lack of it.

Right On, NoMonster!

If people want to use profanity and attack other members, go somewhere else. I think that the use of profanity is okay in certain instances, but if the moderators even TRY to determine WHEN that is, they will just get themselves deeper and deeper into the mire. So the blanket 'no profanity' rule is a good one.

As for making personal attacks on other members, no one should be allowed to do that. If you feel a need to attack another member you should go back to kindergarten. If someone does or says something that you disagree with, then disagree intelligently and with respect, not with anger and lashing out.