Ron Williams drove expectionally well in his new R56 to take the win in G-Stock this past weekend at Walnut Ridge Arkansas. He also won the Prosolo event on Sunday as well as the Hawk Super Challenge. Anyway, it sure looks like the R53 is toast. Keep in mind, Ron doesn't even have shocks or exhaust, it is 100% stock with only 16" wheels with V710's.

 

2nd Pic of Ron

 

So, he only had r-comps and wheels (what looks like the new SSR Comp Type C's) and he took the win in all his classes over the weekend. That's impressive but sill bitter-sweet.

Sweet cause, well, thats awesome.

Bitter cause that might be impressive enough for the R56 to be placed in DS. Gonna have to keep and eye on FastTracks now...

 

Never going to happen. That would mean that the top car for HS, GS and DS would be a Mini.

 

The R56, when fully developed, will dominate DS I'd guess. That thing is wicked fast. Especially with Ron driving it.

 

right, I thought this was why the factory John Cooper Works R53 was so unfairly placed in BS, so that mini's wouldn't win 3 classes, as it really belongs in DS with ITR's, SRT-4's and the like. If they put the R56 in DS, and leave the JCW R53 in BS, I'm gonna be pissed. . .

 

Did Ron have any issues with the DSC re-engaging? I've only read a little bit about this, not sure if it's applicable here.

Dudley

 

Be happy that's it's in BS, when it first came out, for the first few years it was in ASP!!

 

well, the dealer installed cars were, the factory car was classed in BS almost right away I thought, and its still only factory cars that are eligible to run in stock class, correct?

sorry for the threadjack

 

Ron's car doesn't have DSC. It does have ASC, and yes, it does reactivate itself sometimes. It did it once last weekend during the ProSolo competition. It also did it at a local event a couple weeks ago. At the ProSolo, he said that it did it when he let it hit the rev limiter in 1st gear. But he also associates it with the engine being cold. So he's been letting it run for a while before 1st runs. But even though he did that, it still reactivated. So its starting to look like, thats not when it does it. He also said that it did it once after he sprayed the intercooler down. So he hasn't been doing that either. But again it did it without spraying the intercooler. So its starting to look like its another fail safe, in addition to the rev limiter.

I drove the car a couple weeks ago at a local event, I can't say whether or not it happened to me. But I can say that it is not an easy car to drive fast. The R53 car is super easy, anyone can do it. I jumped in Ron's car and I was 6seconds slower than in my own car....YES SIX SECONDS! I'm a left foot braker, and I had a heck of a time keeping it in the boost. Everytime I drug my left foot, the engine fell flat. Like it killed the boost. Ron thought that the ASC may have been kicking on. Its really hard to explain, but I didn't like it. He and I are going to swap cars again at a local event to get me some more seat time in it. I also want to get him in my car, so we can kinda compare some things.

Hats off to Ron for making that thing fly! The closest I have been able to get to him was at a HPT event. I got within a tenth. I felt pretty good about that as that's about what I expected as Rons a great driver. But then this weekend in Arkansas, I got spanked. I was also having cone problems, but even without the penalties, he was well ahead.

 

Greg,

Thanks for the update. This may be making a little more sense now, at least to me.

First, some personal history from early last season: Donnie Barnes let me co-drive his Cayman S at the Ft Myers and Walnut Ridge Tours last year. One
of the things we learned at those events, and that I learned more about afterwards from Porsche guru Greg Fordahl, is that the Cayman S (in fact, ALL late-model Porsches) does not have a "soft" rev limiter as a lot of us have been used to. IOW, it won't let you "ride the limiter" for even a short distance to your next braking point like most older cars will. According to Fordahl, if the ECU in the Cayman sees you hit the rev limiter and not immediately back off the throttle and/or shift to a higher gear, it reduces throttle AND begins retarding the ignition timing. If you continue to hold the throttle open, it *doubles* the rate of ignition retardation. Driving the car at Ft Myers, when this occurred with me it was as if someone had reached over and turned off the ignition.

I would wager the Mini is programmed in a similar fashion. And in addition to cutting throttle and ignition, it *may* re-engage ASC. I never ran any of the R56's I test-drove all the way to the limiter, so I haven't tested this theory.

The left-foot braking issue was also something that occurred with Donnie's Cayman. Anything approaching heavy brake application with the gas pedal still held down would cause a throttle cut, although it seemed dependent on how much brake and for how long. It only did this on course with me once, at Walnut Ridge, when I was trailbraking deep into the last corner before the finish.

Although I've left-foot braked for over 15 years, most of it has been in RWD cars. I know a lot of FWD drivers use LFB to balance the car in slaloms and transitions (I've talked to some who use it everywhere, and never let off the throttle), but I've always alternated throttle and brake rather than pushing both at the same time. It may be that you guys that use the 2-pedals-down-at-the-same-time method may have to modify your style a little, if my theory holds water.

This is not to say that Ron's or your thoughts about engine temp and such aren't valid...that may well have something to do with it too, but what you're describing with Ron's car just sounds way too much like what Donnie's Cayman was doing a year ago.

GH

 

It might have the type of setup in the ECU that kills the power when the brake is applied. Not sure where I've heard of that before, I want to say that the new BMWs do it but I can't say for sure. Kudos to Ron for some greats times.

Dudley

 

If the R56 does so well stock with only the benefit of SSR comp rims and R compound tires then it's reasonable to ask:

With allowable mods in DSP class how could it be?
Fully suspension mods, brake upgrades, aftermarket Intake, ECU tuning, Wider rims and maybe wider tires.

With allowable mods in STX class how could it be?
Limited to street tires.

My point being adding suspension and handling mods but not needing as much for power mods might be interesting. Granted you don't have as much handicap PAX advantage in other classes that are non stock.

 

The funny thing is, the R56 is quicker than the JCW in BS. lol They need to now move the JCW up to GS considering it has quite a bit less torque and no camber compared to the R56. Oh, and, its heavier too. I would predict, the R56, without even a JCW kit thats coming in 2008, would be quicker in DSP with suspension, exhaust and ECU. Not sure about STX, it may be a bit hard to drive on the front wheels with that much power, although, it would do well with the Neova 245/40/17's with the gearing and torque.

 

What kind of camber adjustment you get for R56s?

If R56-S are moved to DS, I wonder how it would compare to the
Mazdaspeed 3s...

 

I think Ron got roughly 0.8, but, I have heard others in the 1.0 range.

The R56 would dominate the Mazdaspeed 3 for sure IMO.

 

Just to confirm what has been said regarding left foot braking: the engine definitely cuts power if you brake and throttle at the same time. I have tested it over and over again with repeated results. Kind of lame.

 

Man, that blows, do you have DSC or ASC?

 

Craig,

What do you know about the '08 JCW kit? Any real information out there yet? I would imagine the JCW car would be classed in DSP with the regular car and be able to give the BMW guys a challenge.

 

yeah, isn't the Integra type R still the D-stock car to beat?

 

I've got ASC.