Anyone using or know of someone using an APC racing seat? I had one on my last car that was never tracked but I loved the feel and comfort of the seat (I'm the only person I've met ever comfortable in that seat guess its all prefereance) I've cehecked the measurements and it will fit in the MINI and may even go into the stock sliders which would save me from having to do any fabrication. My biggest concern is the lack of info on it and not know if it is approved for racing, though I haven't seen anything to say it wasn't.

 

J.C. Whitney sells them (the other JCW), so you know the quality is up there.

 

lol, i hope your being sarcastic.


never buy anything vital or is needed for your car to run from JCW, just incase it decides to fail...


Those 99 dollar total engine overhaul kits arent as good as they sound

 

I actually still have my seat I ordered it from jegs and it listed along side SIMPSON seats, and from what I can tell reading all of the rules and regs I'm in the clear, but I'm hoping I'm no thte first to use one. Also they go for 150 instead of 5 6 or 9 hundred a piece, but I know they aren't comfortable to the general public ethier. and APC doesn't have quiet the same pedigree as Sparco or Recaro; so if someone could help me confirm they are at least NASA legal (think along the lines of TT and Spec MINI) that would be a big help cause I'd hate to get to a track only to be turned away cause nobody had ever seen the seat before (not sure about FIA cert on this as part of lack of info availible on it).

 

Dead serious.

 

the only thing i have heard about APC seats are they the break welds easily around the mounting bracets where the seat botom is welded to the frame.

there were 2 of these in blue at Summit in the scratch and dent area for $200 bucks for the set. i didnt buy them because i had heard of the extemely low quality of everything APC.

Corabou (SP?) are the best bang for the buck. they are what I plan on getting eventually.

 

More than two year on the last car biggest issue was making my own brackets to fit the akward stock floor, definately didn't have any quality issues. My only other complaint would have been the fabric was like a micro fiber towel and so it caught every bit of dust, pet hair, etc. so I had to take alittle more time detailing, no biggie as far as I'm concerned.

Where are exactly are the welds what source. If i remember correctly the seat had the sliders bolted on then that bolted down to the car or you could do a side install if needed.

 

I just checked out Corbeau and they are running at least 2x the cost and the seats dont look anywhere near as supportive.

 

These seats are unsafe for track use,

personally I would not even use them on a street car.

For your own safety, please buy a seat from a reputable seat company, the kind of company that can actually afford to do the testing required to make their products safe.

There is only a few companies out there that can be trusted, Recaro, Sparco, Cobra, Momo....

Your safety is our main concern

Victor

 

Thanks for the input, do you happen to have sources with data comparing the safe seats?

 

Absolutely,

regarding racing seats:
in order for the seats to have the FIA certification, these seats have to go thru a crash test, the dats is available.

regarding the street seats:
the reputable seats companies also put all their street seats thru some rigourous testing.

Please let us know what type of seat and what brand and I will be happy to forward you some information.

 

All right I've looked all over the internet and the only claim I see any manufacturer make as to meeting US saftey regs is Sparco. I am yet to find anything that says why any one seat is better than another aside from proper fittment and ggeneral good condition. This to me means that APC and Corbeau and Recaro and MOMO and Bride and Jeg's are only separated by price and comfort. And that leaves a large unawnsered gap. What are the standards that NASA and SCCA use to determine a "Race Seat" and out of everything listed are there any that don't meet the NASA standards? I have read through the NASA rules and it is my understanding a "Race Seat" is never truly defined, beyond saying race seat, for the Spec MINI or HDPE or TT rules. I want to be sure I am not missing anything, and as this is the road racing forum I ask that someone with understanding of and experiance with NASA rules please respond.

 

Here is NASA CCR section 15.16.1 on "race seats"
BTW, this APC seat is not a "racing seat".

15.16.1 Racing Seat
Some series require and approved racing seat. It is strongly recommend that a racing

 

hahahah this thread is hilarious!!! someone actually wants to use an APC seat (and as a racing seat)?!?! bwahahaha

 

when it comes to seats... be a brand *****! please! do not make the same mistake i did...

i once had decent quality SPW seats (at least i thought it was decent), good price, good fit, and looks great, but 2 months later on my friend's driveway, the welds on the back all broke! the seat back fell flat onto the back seat and i fell along with it! after dealing with SPW, and the local seller, i had absolutely no luck with a claim either! (they basically said once the seat's sold, it's sold out the door, there's no warranty ever).... i took a HUGE loss to sell them to someone who is going to reinforce it and use it in his car (paid 900 + another 300 to put them on with custom mounts, sold them with the custom mounts for 250!)... but overall... i lost a good amount of money that combined with my new sparco's price.. i could've gotten the ones i REALLY wanted... but i didnt.. i went cheap...

ill put it in simple math:
SPW seats: 900
Sparco Rev: 800
=1700 = Sparco Torino x2 or even Recaro Speed X2

 

Could you use that seat for NASA TT or HPDE? Yes Would I? NO

Could you use that seat for NASA MINI Challenge format? NO

A proper race seat should be FIA certified. And then they need to be replaced every 5 years. Some race seats are not FIA. Those then need a seat back brace, per the rules if racing, W2W. If HPDE or TT they wouldn't have to be but would be recomemended.

Here's additional CCR from NASA. You need to read the whole CCR as mention of seats is in several areas, just like what kmickey quoted before.

15.6.22 Seat Back Support

A seatback support must be made to hold the seat from going back in the event of a
crash. A plate should be used to distribute the load. No bolts, corners, or sharp objects
should be placed is such a manner that could lead to a possible puncture of the driver in
a high impact crash. Proper design and installation is crucial to safety and it is
recommend that the driver employ the services of a professional race car builder for this,
as well as all other vehicle safety items. An exception may be made for those seats
homologated to, and mounted in accordance, with FIA 8855-1999 standards. Those
seats that qualify for the aforementioned exception must conform to the entire FIA 8855-
1999 set of regulations. This includes a mandatory seat replacement of any seat more
than five (5) years old. Please reference the FIA regulations.

 

Check the rules for what ever organization you are going "on track" with.

If you are using a Schroth Quick Fit harness, changing the seat away from OEM will "void" the install.

For almost every other harness you will need a harness Bar.

SOME harnesses, by some manufacturers are listed for use with specific models of aftermarket seats, with out a harness bar. Check the directions for the harness and the seat. (Generally the harness manufacturers rate the harnesses for some of their own seats.)

You will of course be losing the protection of the in seat side air bags.

John

 

Guys,

I thought that this was the road racing forum!!!!

There is only one type of seat that should be used for road racing:

A one piece shell, either fiberglass, kevlar, carbon fibre, ( or aluminum, not my best choice)....

And preferably FIA certified.

Victor

 

Find me a safer seat then the Kirkey 5300.

 

Oh, and yes, this is the road racing forum and Victor is quite right. Discussion of such seats as the above one belong in the Interiors or DEs threads. That is in no way any kind of "Racing seat". If you were my kid Drew, there is no way I would let you put that thing in your car, even for daily use.

 

All right, Onasled,

Here are my thoughts on Kirkey seats, and why I do not like to use them or recommend them to my customers.

I have sold over 400 race seats in the past 6 years, all fiberglass, kevlar or Carbon fiber(mix).

The reason I prefer these seats is because in case of a hard crash, these materials absord the energy, The seats flexes to absord the impact, and than goes back to the original position. Most of the time you can reuse the same seat.

Now, in case of a hard crash, aluminum seats will bend and will not go back to the original position, Your seat will have to be replaced.

Also aluminum seats are not FIA legal, the FIA has some very rigourous testing, for both rear, side and front impact.

All the following seat companies Momo, Sparco, Cobra, Recaro, they all had their racing seats certified by the FIA......So how come Kirkey does not want to make seats that meet the same standards.

On Kirkey own website, they state that their 53000 race series seat uses the latest racing seat technologies? there is nowhere in the site where they give testing info or wich standards they meet.

Would you consider using a driving suit that is not FIA or SFI approuved? I dont think so,
We should look at seats the same way.

Please find attached the FIA norm and regulations including testing for competition seats.
http://www.fia.com/resources/documen...ition_seat.pdf

Victor

 

Thank you for the responses, I'm trying to keep this much more in line with the road racing because that is the inevedable goal and what I'm trying to prep the car for; this is NOT intended as a cosmetic upgrade and WILL be used at the track. Unfortuneately the information on this isn't terribly forthcoming, I have found and read the FIA testing guidelines and the only company as aI said before that I can find evideance of claim that certification was Sparco. Leaving me at a guess with the other brands on the market. the reason I asked this is because I don't have experiance of some of the others out there and want to do things properly the first time, so I ask if your not going to be offering constructive advice you refrain from flaming.

Thank you for pointing this out, I am aware of the consequences and would put in a proper harness with the seat, as it is only what seems safe and logical to me. I was however onware that Schroth was no longer ok with a non OEM seat, but thats a different thread.

 

Victor,

These are all things that I knew you would bring up.
Kirkey has never submitted their seats to be approved by the FIA , IN EUROPE. They have never had the need to do so as they are quite small compared to most manufacturers. Let's just say that a European wouldn't be seen an aluminum seat, though Europeans don't have as many concerns with their safety either.

Energy absorbsion? Would you rather be sitting in a ball of clay or a sheet of elastic? In plastic seats what gets absorbed is then slammed back into the body sitting in it, even as the body is now going in the direction that the seat "was" going in. If the body is pushed away from the seat during that impact, by the time it has returned, the seat is not there waiting for it, as it's now returned back (or close to back as CF has poor memory) to it's original location.

Head and shoulder restraints? What plastic seats have this? I'm not sure any do, but I may be quite wrong. They may have a head restraint, but who wants to get pushed sideways out of their seat and leave their head behind?

Anyway, you comments may have been more accurate on most any other aluminum seat, but not the 5300. I would strongly urge you to check one out in person before you come to those conclusions. It's not like any other aluminum seat on the market.

Added this;
Also, I like the fact that aluminum seats must be fastend to the cage, not the floor. This is one of the requirerments, if I remember right, which makes a seat FIA certified. It must be able to be bolted to the floor only.

Here is a picture of the back of my seat. More then one would expect.

 

Can anyone provide me with non manufactureer independent infromation on Corbeau TRS and A4s. I'd like to be more knowedlgable before visiting a local dealer.

 

I thought you stated that you wanted to go more into the racing direction? These are not seats you want to buy if that is the case. You should be looking into Sparco Evos, or something along those lines.