Gents,

Forge sells a dedicated FMIC for the R60, a picture of which I've attached. (It is the massive one next to the two OEM ones.) Unfortunately, it appears there was a re-design of the bumper on late model R60s. So Forge's R60 intercooler would not fit when we tried it. While we were trying to fit the Forge R60 intercooler, it became pretty obvious that a regular Forge intercooler for the R56 would fit. Well, as you can see from the attached photographs, the R56 FMIC fits just fine and bolts right up to the factory mounting points (as it would on an R56).

There are only two issues worth mentioning:

First, there are vertical air dam shrouds on the sides of the intercooler/radiator assembly which keep air from escaping to the sides towards the headlights. The passenger's side airdam fits over the Forge FMIC perfectly; the driver's side is another story and needs a bit of trimming to get it over the end tank. It's pretty simple and easy to do with a knife. A little whittling and the airdam pops right into place.

Second, the lower grille area (the one that services the intercooler) is smaller on the R60 than it is on the R56. Also, because the OEM intercooler actually sat a little bit underneath the bottom edge of the bumper on the R56, Forge actually offset the intercooler a little to account for this. The upshot is that, on the R60, a good chunk of the Forge FMIC is behind the bumper and not getting quite as much in-your-face air flow as it would on the R56.

I truly don't know how much of a difference this makes, as I imagine air is passing over and through the area of the FMIC that is up behind the bumper. Still, I may toy with the idea of putting some air diverters on the top and bottom of the FMIC to help channel more air through the intercooler. Now if only I could find some scrap plastic or aluminum to play with!

 

Awesome, thanks for the info. Glad to hear that the R56 fits the R60.

 

Did you ever speak to anyone at Forge about their R60 model not fitting? Do you know if they are working on anything. The intercooler is my next purchase. Thanks for the researching and testing this for the rest of us.

 

I never did. I bought the R60 FMIC through Way and he's the one that gave me a heads up that it might not fit based on a report by another customer. way was in contact with Forge about a redesign but they seemed somewhat apathetic about the issue. Frankly, I just don't see how it would fit without a radical redesign. The metal bumper has been moved so much closer to the radiator area that a boxy intercooler just won't go.

The R56 unit would be a perfect solution with two air dams, one on top of the FMIC to direct up-flowing air back down, and one on the bottom to direct incoming air upward. With the verticle, factory air dams on the sides, the additional air dams would create a box that would leave incoming air with little choice but to pass over/through the intercooler. Now, to find a machine shop!

 

Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but did you have any issues with the grill on your install?

I'm about to get my R60 tuned (hopefully if all goes well with ETG), and was going to get this FMIC upgrade as well. Forge provides a replacement grill, but I don't think that fits the Countryman. Any modifications to the car during install other than shaving an air dam?

 

Got your PM, but I'm glad you posted here so that others can benefit from your question:

There is absolutely no need to replace the grille on the R60 to accommodate the Forge R56 FMIC. I'm not sure what the purpose of the replacement grille was for the R56, but the FMIC does not come close to the grille on the R60.

The only "issue" with the R60 is that the lower grille area is not as tall (from bottom edge to top edge) as the one on the R56. As a consequence, probably the upper half of the FMIC is behind the bumper. This issue is compounded by the fact that the lower part of the FMIC is "offset" so that it is a centimeter or two above the bottom edge of the end tanks, presumably to help it rise above the bottom edge of the grille on the R56.

Why am I mentioning all this? Because, on the R60, the FMIC could very much benefit from a air diverter that would extent out from the bottom edge of the FMIC toward the front of the car, descending downward at a very shallow angle from the FMIC toward the lower edge of the grille opening. This would channel air that comes in the grille up into the FMIC, preventing it from going underneath the FMIC and missing it completely. I'm hoping to get a metal shop to fabricate a piece for me, I just need to take some measurements and find a place to do it.

I hope the above made sense. Bottom line: The FMIC fits into the car without incident other than a little trimming on the driver's-side air dam. But to really take full advantage of the FMIC it would help to have an air diverter to divert air coming through the lower grille up into the FMIC rather than below it.

 

Correct, the dedicated R60 intercooler is not blocked by any of the bumper. It is short and stocky, whereas the R56 intercooler is thinner and taller (and thus some extends up behind the bumper).

You might be okay with the R60 intercooler. I think the change occurred sometime in March or April 2012. (Mine was 04/2012.)

If you're mechanically inclined, you can probably check before ordering by removing the bumper and comparing it to the photos of my bumper. Perhaps someone with a 2011 Countryman can post a photo of what it looks like behind their bumper and you can have that to compare and contrast.

You might also consider sending an e-mail to Forge (or whomever else you plan to buy from) to ensure you can send it back if the test fit is unsuccessful.

 

Just e-mailed Forge... this R60 situation is getting weird.

I have a 11/10 production (November 2010) MY 2011 (one of the very first off the boat) -- my bumper turned out to look just like yours. Normal R60 FMIC didn't fit one bit.

So... this really changes the game a bit...

 

Pic

 

Man, that sucks! What the heck is going on? Very weird.

The R56 intercoolers are not a bad solution, they just need an air diverter to maximize flow on our car. I am working with a performance fabrication shop to build one out of sheet metal (aluminum). If other people are interested, I will post their info and I'm sure they will be happy to ship units to whomever. They do a lot of mail order stuff.

 

I was previously decided on getting the Helix intercooler until I saw that Forge had an R60 specific version. But with these fitment issues I don't know what to do. Is it the intercooler depth that is the problem? Can you tell if it will fit without removing the bumper?

 

I'm in contact with Forge at the moment, but it looks like the rumors that were going around were completely false -- there was no 2012 change. Some R60s had this type of crash support from Day 1.

There will be no way to tell without removing the bumper fascia. Once that is off, you will be able to see if you have the higher support with the foam, or the other one like we have.

Hujan, did yours not have any foam, either?

There is no easy way to solve this... I have (painfully) removed the crash bumper (takes about 2 hours) and tried to come up with a solution to make this fit.

Bottom line, there's cutting and welding involved to get this to fit correctly.

 

Be warned, everyone -- this is the bumper type the Forge R60 FMIC was designed for:



You can buy this crash bumper, itself, but not the foam inserts, in the US for around $250 plus shipping.

If you have one like ours previously pictured, this will NOT work without extensive modifications (which is where I'm at right now).

 

I had my bumper about halfway off a few weeks ago to fix a fog light and didn't see any foam on the bumper. Mine was built around 09/2011.

I'm not planning on buying a FMIC for another 6 months, so maybe someone else will make an R60 version by then.

 

This really brings up an interesting point...

Do ANY of us have the other bumper with the foam insert? It's looking like it's an EU build trait.

Perhaps this R60 FMIC doesn't fit ANY US R60s.

 

Great question and nice job tracking down the disparity. I believe I got the idea that there was a bumper redesign in 2012 from Way of WMW, but I might be mistaken on that. In any event, it does make sense that there is a different bumper design between EU and US Countryman. If memory serves, EU crash standards often seek to minimize injuries to pedestrians hit by cars, whereas the US crash standards are concerned with maximizing safety in vehicle-to-vehilce collisions.

Like I said, though: The R56 intercooler will work pretty well, except that you need an air diverter to really maximize its performance. I don't know how the profiles of the Forge intercooler compare to the Helix, but whichever is shorter and thicker would be the ideal one for the R60, in my opinion. A side-by-side of the two intercoolers' profiles would be nice. I think the Alta one would not be ideal because it is taller and narrower than even the Forge and Helix models.

 

I had heard the same from Forge and several users here. This may be an example of a rumor spreading like wildfire with no basis (unlike the 02/12 ECU issue which is very real).

You are 100% correct on the crash regulations. My belief was that the bumper "change" was to facilitate new EU safety laws, but perhaps there's just always been that difference.

I'm not meaning to side-jack your thread - I just figured that having the fitment (or non-fitment in this case) issues in one place would be helpful.

 

Not a side-jack at all. My whole goal was to (1) let people know that the Forge R60 intercooler is a no go for some (apparently all) of our R60s, and (2) help people find a solution. Your posts have only contributed to that effort, so thanks!

By my count, only four "levels" of fins on the R56 intercooler are "blocked" by the bumper on the R60. There is ample room below the bottom edge of the R56 intercooler on the R60, so an easy design modification would be to keep the design the same, but shift the face of the FMIC down so that it sags more relative to the pipes than on the R56.

If people are interested, I'll snap some photos.

 

Wow, that's great to hear -- only four rows should be an easy 10 degree piece of flat metal with a few front bolt tabs. That would actually be pretty easy!

Sounds like this may be the way to go for plug-n-play once we can get a shop to do a rough template. Sounds like a piece of 2mm aluminum would work for the material. Cost would be pretty minimal, too!

 

Just wanted to give an update on the R60 FMIC battle. It's complete, and completely functional (the way it should have been the first time).

It requires cutting 1.25 inches off the lower section of the crash bumper as you will see in the pics. If you do it correctly, no rows of fins are blocked!

This was not an easy task... Hope it was worth it.

 

Wow. That's dedication.

Forgive a silly question but would this not muck with front impact safety of your car?

 

Extremely good and valid question. I looked at how the front brace was designed to crumple and found the general stress ratio from looking at the rest of the front carriage frame.

By my estimates, that 1.25 inch section should weaken the link by around 5%. Certainly a factor, but this is still fully street legal and meets the crash requirements. The main force will impact here:

Still a pain in the ***!!

 

Still very impressive. I wish there were an easy way to tell the difference in performance between an R56 Forge intercooler and the R60. I don't think a dyno would be able to tell the difference because it's so heavily dependent on proper simulation of air flow.

 

New shot of it painted to show how minor the actual cutting is to the safety aspect of things.

Thanks, by the way!

 

i am now totally lost ...

which FMIC is this?

which bumper is this? Euro or NA?

was the cut necessary for fitment or airflow?

in the photos it looks like there is physical contact between the A/C coil and the FMIC ... that can't be good long term

scott