I love this idea !

 

guys.. I think what you're asking for is unreasonable. You want the salesperson to know everything about every car? Everything about MINIs? Then you're talking about engineers, not sales people.

 

Sad to say but two things are going on here:

1. I think many dealerships have high turnover rates for new cars salesmen. Its a hard job and I'm betting that unless they are selling high-end cars, they are exactly making a lot of money. They have a lot of pressure. Watch the "King of Cars" sometime (I think thats their name). Its a big car dealer in, I think, Vegas. Its ALL about making sales and quotas are real. Thats why the BEST time to buy a car off the late is New Years Eve. I suspect because of high turnover rates, salemans just dont know squat about what they are selling, nor care ... except for the training they get. A few enthusiasts for a car company might want to become a salesman but in reality ... its about Sales ... not any marque...
2. New cars salesmen probably do NOT want you to go aftermarket. Everyone knows that some dealers frown on aftermarket parts ... they want your business ... go buy JCW. Why should they be knowledgable of small-time vendors? What do they have to GAIN? They are in the business of selling cars to the MASSES ...

Now that said, I have found the opposite to be true of Service Departments. My MINI dealer told me not to go to a certain vendor for a pulley, etc. They would install it aftermarket pieces.

I see no reason whatsover for new car salemen to have any knowledge of MOTD or any other MINI ... or any other car social gathering ... they care about getting you to take that car home ...

Sad to say, in my last to car purchases, I know I knew more than the salesmen ... but that is OK. I just dont expect them to know much. However, I DO expect the service dept to know about the car and aftermarket parts.

 

And that VW dealership had $3K-4K mark up on every vehicle. MINI's MSRP looks better and better every day.

 

A few years ago, when we were shopping for a replacement for my wife's '01 Impala (which I liked better than either of our Monte Carlos, and wish we still had), we stopped in to a Toyota dealer. Talk about the worst place for a car person! You cannot special order a car from Toyota - at least you couldn't in 2004. You get to pick from a list of either already built, or soon to be built cars that they can have delivered to the dealership you happen to be in. The company, or the regional head honcho, or whoever, determines, after looking at pie charts and surveys and such, how many of each model, in which colors, and with which options, will be built for a particualr market.

After talking to the manager about why I couldn't get a car exactly the way I wanted it, we left and went back to Chevy where we got a car exactly the way we (my wife) wanted it.

And this 'you'll take what we offer you and like it' way of operating has made Toyota the second largest auto company in the world! Makes me sick.

Zip

 

Who said you can have any color you want as long as its black?

In fact, any competent Toyota dealer can find whatever you want. Its not like Toyota has a million different options to choose from. Toyota, like Honda, usually just has different trim levels. Some stuff can be added by the dealer. Like it or not, Toyota will be #1 soon. They must be doing something right.

Money talks.

 

I just love threads like this. Hey lets bash the salesperson because you happened to know something more than he/she does. I agree some salespeople have absolutely no idea what they are talking about but a lot do.

A little background about me. My father worked with BMW testing the suspension BMW 2002 tii, so you can say it runs in my blood.

I was working for a start up when the bubble burst in early 02. I decided since I am a "car guy" and love BMW why not give it a try. You just dont walk into a highline store and say I want a job. Unless you've been in autosales you are just going to get the door. The reason I got the job is that I have the product knowledge. I have been at the same dealership coming up on 5 years and ranked in the top third in the nation.

What people fail to realize is that there is a lot to know about each and every model with options and technology which differ from car to car. Most people who come in and claim to know more than the salesperson do so because they have been researching the one model they are interested in and thats it.

I've also worked auto shows where I get the "Cliff Clavin" who tries to challenge my knowledge asking me the lamest questions........."I want to know what the RPM's would be in 5th gear around 50mph" Who cares??? This is the same guy that won't be buying anything just going from booth to booth collecting brochures trying to prove how smart he is.

At one show I had a guy ask me what MPG for a 325xit. I told pointed to the window sticker and made the statement it will vary based on the type of driving you do. His comment "that doesnt answer my question?"

I am a car nut and have been all my life. However when you are selling to people who dont care about what they are buying other than the name and price you become numb, "I can buy an Acura TL for $6K less than a 335." So I dont know every detail about every model........so what, I do know more than the average customer needs to know.

Another reason you might encounter a salesperson who doesnt have a clue is that most of the competent people are leaving the business because its harder and harder to make a living. You can potentially sell a $90K 7 series and spend 2hours explaining the car and make $150 before taxes.......does that sound right?

I get paid 100% commission no base..........if you think its easy I suggest you try it before making comments about salespeople.

 

I work out everyday. 112 days of more workouts and my MINI will be here.

 

Rossi, there are exceptions to every rule and I regret if any disparaging remarks about car sales experiences are offensive to you - but unfortunately many people have had a bad time with car sales people, not just for want of knowledge but for attitude and poor treatment. And about the product knowledge, well yes there are a lot of models and sure it may be too much to recollect all the details, but I've not only been presented with almost utter ignorance of the options and features as well as being contradicted with misinformation that seemed to just be guesses and no attempt seems to be made to even learn at that point. And I'm not talking about geeking out on weird 'Cliff Clavin' factoids, more like the navigation being CD/DVD, or what interior/exterior combos you can get, option package contents, etc. And again, attitude and treatment is key and oftentimes that is simply cruddy.

I am very sorry that you do not get a base pay or necessarily make a good amount on sale, that really sucks and I sincerely hope you do well and prosper for being one of the good guys.

 

Congratulations for your choice and enjoy your MINI!!!

 

That's not the point. The point is that you cannot custom order a car. To me, that is part of the fun of buying a new car - speccing iit out, and 'building' it yourself. Before online configurators, you did this at the dealerships from the books/brochures. It was exciting.

Yes, they will most likely be # 1 very soon, at the rate that GM is going. Many of us here, and on other specialty Inet BBSs that I have been a part of for a dozen years, have observed, and commented on the sheep-like nature of the masses these days. If that many people wanna just take what's offered, that's fine.

I don't care how many mill-bill-trillions of cars the big T sells. I couldn't get what I wanted, order what I wanted to be delivered at a later date, or get any assurance that exactly what I wanted would even be available sometime this century. For me, that was unacceptable. =op

Zip

 

Another way to look at this thread is that it is about how dealerships are failing to make sales because they are not spending enough to have effective salespeople. We are telling stories about how a dealership lost our business because of the skill level of the salesperson. You could take threads like this to the owner and show him that if he wants to do well, he needs to provide people like you with enough financial incentive to keep them.

 

You ask ... So what? I think maybe most sales people might hate a knowlegeable buyer or maybe not. But, for the knowlegable buyer, if you know more than the salesman ... it leaves a very sour taste in your mouth. After all, your in their showroom and you might expect they know more than you (and clearly some don't).

If I went to a doctor for some operation, I EXPECT that doctor to know everything about whatever he/she specializes in. If I go buy a new house ... sales, their sales dept BETTER know everything about that house ... or be able to find out REAL quick.

As johnnieoh said ... they do not read the forums and some don't even read their email.

If your trying to sell something to me ... and I will admit this includes many retails stores, if I know more than you ... I have walked out of retail stores when buying expensive items and the sales people knew squat. Your on commission. I feel for you, I really do. But when a knowledgable person walks in and you dont have the answer ... do you think you ever lost a sale?

... try getting "real" information from a TV salesman ... some kid they hired who works weekends. But go to a high end store ... the price is higher but they tend to know more about what they sell.

I really wish you well in your sales. And perhaps for the masses its fine. I hope you dont lose sales if you dont know the details about a model. The fact there are lots of models doesn't hold water, IMHO. Since selling the car IS your business, I would hope you did. Where else is the average consumer to look to? If I came into a BMW dealer looking at a new 08 M3, I would expect the salemen to absolutely know more than me ... even after reading Ieverything in M3Forum.

Alas I know this isn't true as expectations of new cars salemen is not high. I found out far more from Internet resources BEFORE the sales force even knew things were coming down the line.

Best of luck and I hope you continue to do very well. Its a hard, thankless job under, I presume, a lot of stress.

OK, I dont get it.

Lets suppose you want to buy a Solara Convertable. Just like Honda, they come in different levels of trim ... in this case, SE, Sport, and SLE. All Toyotas come in different trim levels. You already know exactly what your getting.

Option? Lets pick the middle option, Sport. There are FIVE, exactly five options: upgraded stereo, leather, power seats, moonroof, and ESC. Whats to spec?

Like I said, there are so few options, you can find whatever you want. Toyota simply does not have a million options to spec the car. If the thrill is to spec it exactly the way you want it, then I'm guessing a Japanese car is not for you because they package the cars by trim level, unlike MINI. There is nothing wrong with that marketing approach and thats how its been always done for many, many years.

 

I was very impressed by knowledge and friendliness of the salesmen at my dealership (mini of woodlands). I think the main difference between many salespeople for other dealerships is that they don't actually own the car they're advertising. When I ordered my new mini, all three people who had assisted me were mini owners.

 

We're essentially arguing the same point, but then again, you seem to like to argue for the sake of arguing. ;o) So, I'll just say that I could not find a car the way I wanted it, there was no guarantee that one would 'come in' the way I wanted it anytime soon, and leave it at that. I like to custom order a car, but, if there is one that just happens to be available exactly the way I would have ordered it, I would take it (my '03 Monte Carlo SS), as I have done in the past. But the ability to order one was always there (obviously not Toyota).

Most of the general populace seems quite content to take what's available these days, and that's fine. It's just not the way I want to do things, especially when laying out the kind of money needed for a new car. I don't buy cars just for transportation. I am an enthusiast, and a car purchase is important to me on many levels.

Zip

 

Great thread!

 

Don't forget, also that MINI essentially sells one car. Yes, I know there's the Cooper and the S, but they're basically the same - sort of like the difference between a Mustang with a '6', and one with a V-8. There are other differences in the cars besides the engines, but they are essentially the same 'model' of car. Ford salesmen, of course, also have to sell a bunch of other completely different models of cars in their catalog, as well. There's more to know.

Zip

 

When I grow up I am gonna become a MINI sales person so that I can have several MINI's at invoice price... but I am done growing up. :(

 

you bring up a very good point, but I'm a mini fan so what can i say