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After some time with my 2012 MCS I find that I have more fun cornering rather than going fast in a straight line. So instead of getting all the mods to make it go faster, I have to decided to make a list of things that will make it handle like a beast (Daily driver/spirited drives).
My current mods are: All JCW upgrades (strut bar, brake kit, R112 17" Challenge Wheels, engine tune, exhaust...I think all I'm missing are the front seats ) Milltek Catless Downpipe Toyo Proxes T1R 215/45/17
From all the research I've done, my next mods are set on: Hotchkiss H-Sport Rear Sway Bar 25mm B12 Prokit (Bilsteins B8 Struts and Eibach Pro-kit Springs)
I'm not looking for track-only mods because in the end, this is my daily driver. However, I am looking for suggestions or other additional mods the community would recommend for better handling performance (bigger wheel/tire, camber plates, etc.)
Also, if you agree with what I have mentioned above and there is nothing more that needs to be done for my purposes (Daily driver/spirited drives/handling focused), please let me know!
From where you are aimed you can only spend more money and net better handling, but if you're looking for a great handling street car I would stick to these simple mods, priced right and you're outhandling near everything you're on the road with.
From where you are aimed you can only spend more money and net better handling, but if you're looking for a great handling street car I would stick to these simple mods, priced right and you're outhandling near everything you're on the road with.
Thanks for the input!!! And I forgot to mention its an Automatic
Originally Posted by kyoo
definitely want more camber
How would you go about getting more camber? Personally I haven't researched camber for handling purposes. Alignment, mods?
Thanks for the input!!! And I forgot to mention its an Automatic
How would you go about getting more camber? Personally I haven't researched camber for handling purposes. Alignment, mods?
You may be able to pull -1.0* in the front, but since you can't get much more than that up front, there isn't reason to go over stock camber in the rear.
If you decided to go to camber plates, you can compliment the front to the rear camber, but no reason to burn through rear tires to run over stock camber on a street car.
You may be able to pull -1.0* in the front, but since you can't get much more than that up front, there isn't reason to go over stock camber in the rear.
If you decided to go to camber plates, you can compliment the front to the rear camber, but no reason to burn through rear tires to run over stock camber on a street car.
Thanks nkfry!!! I'll wait to see if anyone else has any other suggestion, but so far it looks like I've done my homework and gathered the best handling mods for my style of driving. Perhaps after I get the upcoming mods installed I'll work on aesthetics.
By the way, is there any performance benefits in handling by going with a bigger rim (from 17 to 18) or dropping to 16 but getting a fat'er tire 225s? Or is this purely for that "widebody" look?
Just stick to a 17" wheel, run a 215/45/17 sticky tire such as the Bridgestone Potenza RE-71R and you'll be amazed at the handling difference.
Thank you very much nkfry! The toyos are still new, but I'll definetly look into those when the change comes. Maybe pair them up with some 17" OZ Superturismo LM if I get bored of the JCW Wheels
If you want to make a handling monster for the street just look at my signature.
Yes, that is a 27mm front sway bar to go with the 25mm rear sway bar (for all of you doubters, don't knock it until you try it)
For you:
Number 1 item is the IE fixed camber plates. -1.5 deg camber up front without undo tire wear. This is the best handing mod IMHO. The stock rear camber setting is good with these for the street.
#2: Bilstein B8 sport shocks. By this time your stock shocks are shot (yes, I see those same in your list ) those springs should be good too.
#3: Power flex poly front lower control arm bushings
#4: 19mm rear sway bar. Unless you really know how to handle a car that will want to swap ends on you when you are on a wet on or off ramp going twice as fast as everyone else, I would advise against the 25mm bar. The 19 mm bar is a great option.
The RE71Rs are unbelievable
And a set of Hawk HP+ brake pads up front.
I am always keen for less unsprung weight as a handling mod. Lightweight 16" wheels and sticky tyres made a huge difference with no other changes to my R53!
If you want to make a handling monster for the street just look at my signature.
Yes, that is a 27mm front sway bar to go with the 25mm rear sway bar (for all of you doubters, don't knock it until you try it)
For you:
Number 1 item is the IE fixed camber plates. -1.5 deg camber up front without undo tire wear. This is the best handing mod IMHO. The stock rear camber setting is good with these for the street.
#2: Bilstein B8 sport shocks. By this time your stock shocks are shot (yes, I see those same in your list ) those springs should be good too.
#3: Power flex poly front lower control arm bushings
#4: 19mm rear sway bar. Unless you really know how to handle a car that will want to swap ends on you when you are on a wet on or off ramp going twice as fast as everyone else, I would advise against the 25mm bar. The 19 mm bar is a great option.
The RE71Rs are unbelievable
And a set of Hawk HP+ brake pads up front.
Have fun; be safe
Thanks for the input!
1) I looked into the IE Camber Plates and I found this in the forums that explained it a lot more "The Minis tend to understeer (push at the front). The additional front negative camber (from the IE fixed camber plates) puts the tire flatter when cornering thus putting more rubber on the ground for traction going around corners. The larger rear sway bar makes the car tend to oversteer (back end coming around). So the combination of the front not pushing as much and the rear trying to come around a little quicker makes the car handle more neutral." (gonna leave this quote here so I can go back to it and help others as well)
But are camber plates really necessary? If I do get the B12 kit and 25mm rear sway bar, will I jeopardize my tires and have to deal with an unsafe mini (the rear problem you mention)? This IS my daily driver, so I can't afford to be without it if these mods cause any inconveniences.
2) Yeah, I'm pretty much set on the B12 Pro-kit
3) What do front lower control arm bushings do? Haven't looked into this yet...is it necessary?
4) I believe the OEM rear sway bar is already 19mm. I've read multiple times that sticking with an aftermarket 19mm...you can barely tell the difference. Does it really make the tail go too crazy? I thought having lowering springs and the B8 shocks would help avoid that...
Most of my daily drives involve lots of highway. The handling bit comes when I get off and want to take the mini for a ride through some turns on my way home. Not looking to go into every corner at 100mph either But the camber plate makes sense, just wondering if with more camber up front, what size the rear sway bar should be? Is 25mm (hollow) overkill with camber up front?
Doesn't it "makes the car handle more neutral" with a bigger sway bar as mentioned in the quote above?
I appreciate the fact that you are willing to learn about these things before just going off and making changes.
However, I wish it was as simple as your quote, and I am sure that companies like BMW would like to figure out how to not to have to spend millions of dollars on designing car suspensions that are reasonable safe for the average driver. Then on top of designing 1 suspension, they design 4 more for just the MINI. For our generation MINI alone there is the base suspension, the S suspension, the Sport suspension, the JCW suspension and the GP suspension. Each one of those is a bit more aggressive then the previous one. From personal experience I can tell you the S suspension outperforms the bases suspension and the Sports suspension outperforms the S suspension. I can also tell you that each one dials out a bit of the understeer without adding snap oversteer. If you want a great handling street machine without spending 10 years on the track trying to figure out what works, you want to mimic the Sports or JCW suspension options. If you look into it, BMW took a balanced approach with each upgrade; they didn't just throw one part at it and say "we'll just stick in a big fat RSB, here you go, all fixed". It is not that simple. If it were then BMW would have done that a long time ago. But no, it is complicated. Each of the MINI suspension options gets a larger front sway bar, a larger rear sway bar, stiffer springs and shocks.
What your quote doesn't say is how those changes achieve "neutral" handling. The camber plates add traction up front and the larger rear sway bar reduces the traction in the rear. The net effect of the larger RSB in a corner is that, by lifting the inside rear wheel, it moves weight to the rear of the car and off the outside front tire. At first this seems like a good thing. However, if you add a dynamic change to the cornering of the car, like lifting off the throttle in the middle of a turn, you add even more traction up front and lessen it in the rear and the car will tend to want to swap ends. I know, don't do that. In a race car or on a autocross course, where you have some amount of control over what is going on, you might be able to keep your foot on the gas throughout any turn and keep that from happening. In the real world, you might not have that options. And all of these dynamic change with rain or snow.
As for your comment about what is already in these cars, you need to read up on it more. You also need to understand what it means to the balance of the front to rear stiffnesses for car control and handling. For RSBs, the base Cooper has a 16 mm bar, the S has a 17 mm bar, the sports suspension has an 18 mm bar and the JCW has a 18.5 mm bar. The front bar on the S is 22.5mm. The front to rear roll stiffness from just the roll bars is about a factor of 3. An Alta 19mm bar is adjustable and on the middle setting it is almost 50% stiffer than the 17mm bar the S came with. At the stiffest setting it is almost 80% stiffer. You should be able to feel that. I have seen the change that bar made to a stock S in autocross racing. It was noticeable. That 25mm bar is almost 2 times stiffer than stock on its middle setting and it is as stiff as the front bar. So you are looking changing the front to rear stiffness from 3 to 1, that BMW thinks is a good design, to 1 to 1. Here is what that means:
The thing is, you are making a lot of changes all at once, without a clear idea of what any of them are going to do. The shocks will stiffen up the rear. The springs are of unknown rates front and rear, but are likely to stiffen up the rear some more. A 25mm bar is going to stiffen up even more and you are looking to add more traction up front. Hmmmm, I see shades of that video in your future.
Don't get me wrong. I believe that BMW has put an incredible amount of time, money and effort in designing fun suspensions. But they are for the general masses. Can they be improved to be more for your own liking? Yes they can. But you need to understand what each change is going to do for you, how it will help you and how it can "bite" you. Make one change at a time and get an understanding of it before making the next change. There are a lot of interrelated dynamics at play here and making a lot of changes at once is no guarantee of achieving success. The list I gave you is not a whim, but is based on a lot of track and autocross experience, not just goosing the throttle a few times on the street. Is it right for everyone? No. Will you have fun on the street with it? Absolutely. Is it going to bite you in the butt when you don't do something right? Not likely.
I appreciate the fact that you are willing to learn about these things before just going off and making changes.
However, I wish it was as simple as your quote, and I am sure that companies like BMW would like to figure out how to not to have to spend millions of dollars on designing car suspensions that are reasonable safe for the average driver. Then on top of designing 1 suspension, they design 4 more for just the MINI. For our generation MINI alone there is the base suspension, the S suspension, the Sport suspension, the JCW suspension and the GP suspension. Each one of those is a bit more aggressive then the previous one. From personal experience I can tell you the S suspension outperforms the bases suspension and the Sports suspension outperforms the S suspension. I can also tell you that each one dials out a bit of the understeer without adding snap oversteer. If you want a great handling street machine without spending 10 years on the track trying to figure out what works, you want to mimic the Sports or JCW suspension options. If you look into it, BMW took a balanced approach with each upgrade; they didn't just throw one part at it and say "we'll just stick in a big fat RSB, here you go, all fixed". It is not that simple. If it were then BMW would have done that a long time ago. But no, it is complicated. Each of the MINI suspension options gets a larger front sway bar, a larger rear sway bar, stiffer springs and shocks.
What your quote doesn't say is how those changes achieve "neutral" handling. The camber plates add traction up front and the larger rear sway bar reduces the traction in the rear. The net effect of the larger RSB in a corner is that, by lifting the inside rear wheel, it moves weight to the rear of the car and off the outside front tire. At first this seems like a good thing. However, if you add a dynamic change to the cornering of the car, like lifting off the throttle in the middle of a turn, you add even more traction up front and lessen it in the rear and the car will tend to want to swap ends. I know, don't do that. In a race car or on a autocross course, where you have some amount of control over what is going on, you might be able to keep your foot on the gas throughout any turn and keep that from happening. In the real world, you might not have that options. And all of these dynamic change with rain or snow.
As for your comment about what is already in these cars, you need to read up on it more. You also need to understand what it means to the balance of the front to rear stiffnesses for car control and handling. For RSBs, the base Cooper has a 16 mm bar, the S has a 17 mm bar, the sports suspension has an 18 mm bar and the JCW has a 18.5 mm bar. The front bar on the S is 22.5mm. The front to rear roll stiffness from just the roll bars is about a factor of 3. An Alta 19mm bar is adjustable and on the middle setting it is almost 50% stiffer than the 17mm bar the S came with. At the stiffest setting it is almost 80% stiffer. You should be able to feel that. I have seen the change that bar made to a stock S in autocross racing. It was noticeable. That 25mm bar is almost 2 times stiffer than stock on its middle setting and it is as stiff as the front bar. So you are looking changing the front to rear stiffness from 3 to 1, that BMW thinks is a good design, to 1 to 1. Here is what that means: 2016 04 03 슈í¼ì±Œë¦°ì§€ 2016ë…„ 1ì*„ ì¸ì*œìŠ¤í”¼ë””움 wet 첫주행...ê³*ë‚œ - YouTube
The thing is, you are making a lot of changes all at once, without a clear idea of what any of them are going to do. The shocks will stiffen up the rear. The springs are of unknown rates front and rear, but are likely to stiffen up the rear some more. A 25mm bar is going to stiffen up even more and you are looking to add more traction up front. Hmmmm, I see shades of that video in your future.
Don't get me wrong. I believe that BMW has put an incredible amount of time, money and effort in designing fun suspensions. But they are for the general masses. Can they be improved to be more for your own liking? Yes they can. But you need to understand what each change is going to do for you, how it will help you and how it can "bite" you. Make one change at a time and get an understanding of it before making the next change. There are a lot of interrelated dynamics at play here and making a lot of changes at once is no guarantee of achieving success. The list I gave you is not a whim, but is based on a lot of track and autocross experience, not just goosing the throttle a few times on the street. Is it right for everyone? No. Will you have fun on the street with it? Absolutely. Is it going to bite you in the butt when you don't do something right? Not likely.
Thank you very much Eddie! I was just about to write that I looked at your suggestions a little deeper and I was gonna say that I completely agree.
Thanks for the FSB and RSB measurements by the way. I've been trying to look for them everywhere! Like you said, I am eager to learn about the car and mods before just installing them all at once. Even more so now that I've just realized that the JCW Front Strut Brace and the FSB are completely different things .
I just installed the Front Strut Brace a couple of weeks ago and that's where the handling addiction started. This week I also had a little fun against a M135i up a hill and words cannot describe how I felt watching him trying to keep the tail in place and me just zooming by . Best.Feeling.Ever.
Thanks for the video too! That's very scary!
To wrap it up, I will give your list a shot. By the way, is it in a particular order? (camber plates, B12 Pro-kit, Bushings, and 19mm RSB?) or if not, what order would you suggest?
I see that you mentioned Alta for the RSB, how about Eibach (but its 20mm :/)? Also, do you happen to know the length of a 19mm RSB? (can't find that either...)
And again, thank you very much eddie! I'm excited!
In my opinion: RSB first. This is the best bang for buck mod you can do. I am not a fan of the H-sport 25mm bar, when I installed my 22mm I looked at the clearance and wondered how anyone could get anything fatter in there. There's a post here on NAM by a guy who discovered that his H-sport bar was rubbing on a seam in the body and wore half way through. On the other hand, there's lots of people who think it's the greatest. Make your own decision.
Next, get a set of coilovers and camber plates plus adjustable rear control arms. If you're serious about handling, don't go cheap, wait and save up and go for quality. I am set up for -2 degrees camber all around, with a 22mm RSB, the handling is incredibly neutral, with understeer at the limit unless the road is wet or the tires are cold and I push it too hard. Even then a quick correction with the wheel and a slight lift on the throttle and it is all back in shape. Turn 10 at Laguna Seca is a fast downhill right hander, slightly off camber, I can pitch the car in there hard enough to feel all 4 tires slide slightly with complete confidence that the car won't do something evil. Anyone who gets snap oversteer on a Mini has done something very, very wrong with the suspension.
Go for some 215x45 tires. I'm on Michelin PSS, they are getting to the end of their life (20K so far) and I need to decide what's next. The PSS plus coilovers/camber plates/alignment helped me take 8 seconds off my lap times. Just remember if you go for an extreme performance tire that you're not going to get 40K miles out of it, and depending on where you live it won't be appropriate for winter.
Finally - if you gave an M135 a hard time, either the driver was incompetent or he had lousy tires. At the track a couple of days ago there was one in my run group that was incredibly quick, I don't know what tires he had or any suspension mods, all I can say is there was no way I could hang with him. That car is a rocket. On the other hand, my 17 year old son in his first track experience completely embarrassed a guy twice his age who was driving a 350z.
Anyway - you're on the right path. Suspension/handling and brakes first. Go to the track or autocross to make yourself a better driver. The Mini is never going to be a fast car in a straight line, so work on improving the handling and there's lots of fun to be had.
The OP has indicated that they plan to install the Bilsteins B8 Struts and Eibach Pro-kit Springs. And he indicates that this is going to be a street car. The IE (Ireland Engineering) fixed camber plates are a great street option as they are made with BMW parts and don't introduce noise (see Way Motors). They will also give -1.5 deg of camber (yes they are designed for -1.2 deg, but matched with the slot in the strut tower it adds up to the -1.5 deg) and they will match well with the Bilstein/Eibach setup.
While I think BMW does well with their suspensions, the one part they really fall down on is the shocks they use. I recently installed a set of B8s with the sport option springs and now realize how poor the stock shocks are.
With that said, my suggestion is to replace the shocks first. Of course that means the new springs too. Because you need to pull the shocks to do the camber plates, do those at the same time.
The RSB is a "do it any time option", as are the lower control arm bushings.
So there you have two opinions as to what to do...think about it.
As for wheels, get some light weight Enkie or like wheels with a 40 to 43 ET; the MINI wheels are heavy and will slow you down and will give a worse ride. The ET change will help with handling. And you won't go wrong with the RE71R tires in place of the Toyos.
The OP has indicated that they plan to install the Bilsteins B8 Struts and Eibach Pro-kit Springs. And he indicates that this is going to be a street car. The IE (Ireland Engineering) fixed camber plates are a great street option as they are made with BMW parts and don't introduce noise (see Way Motors). They will also give -1.5 deg of camber (yes they are designed for -1.2 deg, but matched with the slot in the strut tower it adds up to the -1.5 deg) and they will match well with the Bilstein/Eibach setup.
While I think BMW does well with their suspensions, the one part they really fall down on is the shocks they use. I recently installed a set of B8s with the sport option springs and now realize how poor the stock shocks are.
With that said, my suggestion is to replace the shocks first. Of course that means the new springs too. Because you need to pull the shocks to do the camber plates, do those at the same time.
The RSB is a "do it any time option", as are the lower control arm bushings.
So there you have two opinions as to what to do...think about it.
As for wheels, get some light weight Enkie or like wheels with a 40 to 43 ET; the MINI wheels are heavy and will slow you down and will give a worse ride. The ET change will help with handling. And you won't go wrong with the RE71R tires in place of the Toyos.
Thanks eddie! Yeah I figured that the other reply was more oriented for track use rather than street/daily driving
So I think that settles it then. I'm gonna with the 19mm RSB first so that it's easier on the wallet haha. But I'll probably be purchasing the camber plates along with the B12s around September
Perhaps next year I'll look into changing the JCW Challenge Wheels. It's always nice to change the look of the car every once in a while
By the way, I can't seem to open the way motor works website. I found the IE Fixed Camber Plates on Outmotoring though:
Do you plan to install it your self? Even if you have someone else do it, you need to know that if there lower shock bolt is not installed absolutely correctly and not over torqued then it can be stripped out. I will look up the thread for you. The shocks will need to be undone to install the bar.
TIP....
Here is a tip for anyone Who has removed the trailing arm bolt to change shock/springs/coilovers and you DON'T want to strip the threads.
#1 NEVER, I SAY NEVER use an impact gun!!!
#2 Thread by hand
#3 patience!
When putting the lower bolt into the trailing arm, leave the two UPPER bolts on the coil/shock assembly loose, say like 3/4 of an inch from the end of its travel.
Use a jack to raise the trailing arm close to the lower shock mount.
Slowly work the bolt through the lower shock mount and into the trailing arm.
The loosened shock assembly will give you the ability to move the shock around and slowly work the bolt into the hole properly. If the two uppers are tight, YOU WILL cross thread it if it is off even slightly.
You should be able to thread it by hand 90% of the way. Once you get it snug by hand then Use a ratchet to snug it tight, don't torque it yet.
Then tighten the upper bolts and tourque them.
Then tourque the lower bolt
NEVER use an impact gun for this.
You will need patience as it is tough to get it lined up properly
Back the bolt out if you feel too much resistance.
You should feel it thread, then It gets tight, thread, then tight, thread, then tight.
It's OK to torque it to the 103ft/lbs . If you have threaded it lightly and it went in 90%, then ratchet it until snug, then tourque it.
Do you plan to install it your self? Even if you have someone else do it, you need to know that if there lower shock bolt is not installed absolutely correctly and not over torqued then it can be stripped out. I will look up the thread for you. The shocks will need to be undone to install the bar.
TIP....
Here is a tip for anyone Who has removed the trailing arm bolt to change shock/springs/coilovers and you DON'T want to strip the threads.
#1 NEVER, I SAY NEVER use an impact gun!!!
#2 Thread by hand
#3 patience!
When putting the lower bolt into the trailing arm, leave the two UPPER bolts on the coil/shock assembly loose, say like 3/4 of an inch from the end of its travel.
Use a jack to raise the trailing arm close to the lower shock mount.
Slowly work the bolt through the lower shock mount and into the trailing arm.
The loosened shock assembly will give you the ability to move the shock around and slowly work the bolt into the hole properly. If the two uppers are tight, YOU WILL cross thread it if it is off even slightly.
You should be able to thread it by hand 90% of the way. Once you get it snug by hand then Use a ratchet to snug it tight, don't torque it yet.
Then tighten the upper bolts and tourque them.
Then tourque the lower bolt
NEVER use an impact gun for this.
You will need patience as it is tough to get it lined up properly
Back the bolt out if you feel too much resistance.
You should feel it thread, then It gets tight, thread, then tight, thread, then tight.
It's OK to torque it to the 103ft/lbs . If you have threaded it lightly and it went in 90%, then ratchet it until snug, then tourque it.
If you have to force it in, you got problems!
Thank you very much! But, no. I won't be installing the shocks myself at least. I looked at R56 rear sway bar install video and it did not look that complicated...but due to my lack of mechanical experience, I rather not mess with the suspension. So I would have someone do it for me at a shop that regularly sees minis come in for mods.
By the way, what do you guys think about the Eibach 20mm RSB? Its the most accessible option where I live.
The other options I'm pretty much set on the brands. (IE Fixed camber plates/B8s with Eibach Pro-kit)
TIP....
Here is a tip for anyone Who has removed the trailing arm bolt to change shock/springs/coilovers and you DON'T want to strip the threads.
#1 NEVER, I SAY NEVER use an impact gun!!!
#2 Thread by hand
#3 patience!
When putting the lower bolt into the trailing arm, leave the two UPPER bolts on the coil/shock assembly loose, say like 3/4 of an inch from the end of its travel.
Use a jack to raise the trailing arm close to the lower shock mount.
Slowly work the bolt through the lower shock mount and into the trailing arm.
The loosened shock assembly will give you the ability to move the shock around and slowly work the bolt into the hole properly. If the two uppers are tight, YOU WILL cross thread it if it is off even slightly.
You should be able to thread it by hand 90% of the way. Once you get it snug by hand then Use a ratchet to snug it tight, don't torque it yet.
Then tighten the upper bolts and tourque them.
Then tourque the lower bolt
NEVER use an impact gun for this.
You will need patience as it is tough to get it lined up properly
Back the bolt out if you feel too much resistance.
You should feel it thread, then It gets tight, thread, then tight, thread, then tight.
It's OK to torque it to the 103ft/lbs . If you have threaded it lightly and it went in 90%, then ratchet it until snug, then tourque it.
Thank you very much! But, no. I won't be installing the shocks myself at least. I looked at R56 rear sway bar install video and it did not look that complicated...but due to my lack of mechanical experience, I rather not mess with the suspension. So I would have someone do it for me at a shop that regularly sees minis come in for mods.
By the way, what do you guys think about the Eibach 20mm RSB? Its the most accessible option where I live.
The other options I'm pretty much set on the brands. (IE Fixed camber plates/B8s with Eibach Pro-kit)
Thanks!
Not sure the brand is going to make a difference. I had a 20mm bar in my first MINI. On the softest setting it was good on the street. But, for me and the shocks I had, it was too much for the track. It might have been better with a stiffer set of shocks. The car didn't feel balanced; nothing like the way my current MINI does.
Say do you know about pulling the little white plastic pin and moving the top of the strut inward to give the car an increase in camber? You need to jack up the front wheel, to loosen the three nuts on the top of the strut tower, pull the pin, and push the top of the strut inward. If you do this, you will understand why I suggest doing the camber plates first. Oh ya, there is a little toe in adjustment that needs to be made. You just need to turn in the toe adjustment by two flats on each side. It's easy to do.
Last edited by Eddie07S; 06-22-2016 at 04:17 PM.
Reason: Correction to the toe adjustment
The camber change I noted above changes the toe in to be too much. You need to move it a bit towards zero. You do this by turning the adjuster to shorten the tie rod. Hope that helps.
I bet when he said 25mm sway bar he meant a hollow bar not solid. The F56 cars come with hollow bars, and their "upgrade" is usually 25mm they like it. Our solid "upgrade" bar is usually 19mm as Eddie07S said. 25mm solid would be crazy. I bet nobody even makes that, so it's probably a hollow bar which is probably good.
I've had the IE fixed camber plates and recommend them. I also installed the powerflex control arm bushings and noticed a slight improvement in steering response. The control arm bushings wasn't an easy install, so I don't think it was worth the trouble unless your bushings are bad.
I've run Koni yellows and TSW springs for almost 4 years, and like them. I recently put stock shocks back on for comparison, and quickly went back to the Konis. If I was doing it again, I would probably try the Bilsteins (like the idea of the digressive design). I rode in a buddies car with Bilstein PSS10's, and it had a better ride (on city roads) than my car. I'm currently back on stock springs, and the higher ride height doesn't bother me. I was getting tired of whacking everything a baseball or larger that I drove over (I also have the TSW x-brace which hangs under the car another 1-1/2 inch).
I'm really happy with the PSS in 215/45/17, and would highly recommend them. I am also running the 25.5 mm hollow RSB in the middle setting. I've never been caught out with oversteer or sudden unloading with my car. One important thing to note is that all aftermarket RSB's have multiple mounting holes to adjust the feel of the car to the taste of the driver. Supposedly the 25.5 mm hollow bar is similar in stiffness to a 22 mm solid bar. Also, I had a 19 mm H&R bar, and there was a minimal difference on how the car felt compared to my stock Sport suspension.
My best mods (if I was doing it again)
1. tune. I'm just running a stage 1 Accessport tune, but the extra 10-20 hp is noticeable.
2. Good tires (had all seasons, the PSS was a major upgrade). I've only run the stock wheels, but I imagine that light aftermarket wheels would be a better option. I really, really like the way that the challenge wheels look on the car.
3. Shocks/IE fixed plates/RSB. Probably Bilsteins and 25.5 mm bar. I would do it all at once to minimize the number of times that I unbolt the rear shocks.
06-17-2016, 11:43 AM
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But the camber plate makes sense, just wondering if with more camber up front, what size the rear sway bar should be? Is 25mm (hollow) overkill with camber up front? 
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