Like the tittle says, I need some legal help... Here is a summary of the issue with a friend's MINI here in south Florida.


My car is a 2009 Mini Cooper (base) manual transmission, currently with 1800 miles...
Back in February of this year someone backed into the front of my car while it was parked cracking my radiator. I didn't know it was hit so I started to drive it, the car overheated and the engine exploded completely demolishing the head, oil went all over the engine etc.

The car was towed to the dealer and StateFarm paid for the repairs needed (this process took 2 1/2 months). The cylinder head was resurfaced rather than replaced (car had just 1300 miles at that point)

Less than 1 month later the car was rumbling very loudly on a cold startup. Brought the car to the dealer and could not be duplicated and the car was returned.

Took car back to dealer few weeks later because engine shut off while driving on a highway stop/go traffic and sometimes while in stop/go traffic would shut off other times. Dealer could not duplicate and car was returned. Service rep suggested that I change to a higher grade gasoline.

Oil light came on 1 month later, took car in, oil was missing and just needed to be topped off. I was told this is normal.

Oil light came on again about 1 month later, took car in and it was determined that the engine was burning oil and that a supplement need to be called in to StateFarm because the engine was not repaired properly the first time and that the cylinder head should have been replaced rather than resurfaced.

Adjuster came to dealership and denied the claim. Was told from SateFarm that this is 4,000 miles later and 6 months down the line and they can not see a connection between the accident and the current issue.

Second adjuster was called out and said the same thing.

Claim has been closed and I am currently at a standstill. I have been without my car for almost 2 months and BMW will not give me a loaner since they believe that it is a insurance issue and not a warranty thing. I have called BMW customer relations and because it's between a dealership and insurance they can not get involved. They suggested for me to call and speak to the service manager, but no solution has been given.

*Here are some notes I've been taking as well...

-statefarm feels that workmanship was not completed; did not do all of the preformed test that should have been done. During the initial time that I brought the car in they payed to replace a valve. Typically before they repair the one valve they will make sure that all of the other valves are functioning properly; rots pistons etc. is working before they put the valve covers back on and oil back in the car and they do not think that this was done properly.

-Comprehensive test or teardown was not done properly; from the additional damage that was done now; property claim trainer went out and determined: when the vehicle was torn down and I had to keep bringing it back that since they did not inform SateFarm about this that now #3 & #5 valves need to be replaced. Need a new block due to those damages. To repair all of the issues. That all valves were not checked before we do the repairs. Also when the car was brought back 4 times it was not further evaluated. Therefore StateFarm is not responsible for these repairs.

-StateFarm would have been able to cover it if there was something that would have occurred and given the chance to look into it before now but since they failed to fix it from the begining; claiming that it is a result of the poor workmanship.

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Thanks for your help!

 

Have you called MINI USA and got them involved? Be sure to present State Farm's points along with your repeated attempts to have the dealership diagnose the problems. Truly sorry for your suffering. hope that you'll quickly get resolution and back out Motoring. Good luck.

Cheers!!

 

Ugh- what a horrible situation. I honestly have nothing to add except if you need legal help contact a lawyer. Not to take any credit from any posters here, but a lot of here'say gets tossed around and some may take it as fact. Either way I wish your friend the best of luck for a fair outcome.

 

Ask you State Farm agent of a good lawyer in your area that they have used to resolve issues.

You will probably have to incur costs to get this resolved. Perhaps the lawyer can suggest to the dealer they buy your car since they appeared to have performed a bad repair.

 

I hate to say cause it would take a MINI off the road but, you should just run that ***** into a lake.

 

First off I am curious why State Farm initially opted out of a MINI short engine considering the mileage you had ? It would have been the logical choice.

SF didn't insure the workmanship, so no surprises there.

Not even gonna comment on the 2.5 months your MINI was VOR....

I am surprised the dealer has not stepped up to the plate here though. Especially with consideration of your due dillegence with documentation and followup issues and visits.

I agree with above post. If both parties to this venture are unwilling to negotiate an amicable solution....contact a decent lawyer.

 

Thanks for the replies...
MINI keeps saying that at this point is State Farms call... ad SF denied the claim because according to them is 4,000 miles later and 6 months down the line and they can not see a connection between the accident and the current issue.

Does any of NAM members know any good lawyers here in South Florida?

Any help/advise is appreciated.

 

Wow...this is very unfortunate. I hate to hear stories like this. From a distance, it sounds as if State Farm is legit in their claim. I am willing to bet the the dealership did a half-*** inspection and did not go to bat for you (requesting short block). I presume that State Farm would've gladly approved a short block and been done but because the dealership did a half *** job now YOU are stuck with the problem. This is a perfect example of why I would never go to a dealership for ANYTHING mechanical or requiring a mechanical aptitude. Real mechanics run garages...dealerships read computer codes with expensive machines and are spoon fed data to fix issues. Your car would have been better served at a BOSCH certified garage or other high quality garage with ZERO vested interest in the diagnosis of the car but I understand your situation and you trusted the dealership to do their job. That's not too much to ask but these days....apparently it is.

Very sorry to hear this and I don't have much to add that you probably haven't thought of...just very, very infortunate. The dealer should step up to the plate here for sure!

 

Mflossin- You think the dealer would have rather done a "half-***" job replacing parts rather than replacing a short block? No. Who has more motive for fixing the car for the cheapest possible price? The person paying or the person replacing parts?

Believe it or not I've meet a lot of good people who work for dealerships. Ones who are very competent mechanics.

This is getting bad though. People thinking insurance companies are more honest than dealerships.

 

If State Farm agrees that the initial workmanship was not adequate, why are they not willing to go to bat for your friend now? The initial poor workmanship is independent of any intervening events.

At the start of the post it indicates the MINI has 1800 miles on it. Later it mentions the mileage between the initial repair and now is 4,000 miles. So what is the real mileage on the MINI?

Is there any particular reason why the MINI dealership is not honoring the warranty on the initial repair? (I assume they warranted the work that was initially done).

It sounds like MINI agreed to repair the engine in exchange for the payment they received (from SF). Now it turns out the repair was not done properly and the dealership is not willing to make it right?

Hope it eventually works out.

 

I cannot say as to specifically in florida but I can tell what I know from my experience in Kansas. If the insurance company paid the dealer directly then the issue of whose fault lies in the insurance company and dealer to decide, but it is the responsability of one or the other to pick up the tab. To help expedite the process and not have any attorney fees call you state insurance commisioners department and talk to their consumer protection department. All states have a insurance dept that covers all matters regarding the legalities of what insurance companies can and cannot do. They keep staff attorneys to deal with such issues as this. They are generally part of the state attorney generals offices. More often than not once the insurance dept gets involved the companies get a lot more willing to work with you on any issues you may have. Only know this since I worked in my state commisioners office and also in automotive repair. Have had to fight with companies many times to get them to properly cover expenses. The best spot to start will be the commisoners office if you ask me.

 

Yea....

I'm probably in the minority here, but I think this is 100% (or at least 99%...) a problem with the insurance company, not the dealer. If the dealer had their way, they'd replace everything they possibly can...especially when its warranty or insurance paying. The warranty company (either aftermarket or BMW) and the insurance companies tell them what they are allowed to replace on their dollar/what they'll pay for to replace. More likely than not the insurance probably wouldn't even let them replace the full short block the first time around. It's just easier to automatically blame "those evil greedy dealers." Having worked in the car business, and having multiple family members in the car business...I can tell you not all dealers are the bad guys. Insurance companies are a nightmare to work with sometimes, and they are the greediest companies around.

Sadly, once your car gets stuck between a dealer and an insurance company, it takes a long long long time and a lot of fighting (mainly with the insurance company) to get anything done. I would be screaming at the insurance company, and also if you can in anyway get the dealer service mgr on your side to argue with the insurance company, you might get a better response out of them. The service mgr will gladly stand up for his department and defend their workmanship....at least every service mgr I know.

 

1. Car salesman
2. Insurance agent
3. Lawyer
4. ...
That's been the ranking as long as I can remember.

Of course, the OP's friend is (will be) stuck in the middle of all 3 types... kind of like a perfect storm of "it's not my problem". My sympathies.

 

this is strange. if you had the mini dealer repaired the mini to manufacturer specification, then shouldn't the warranty kick in to repair this breakdown? if you brought the mini to an approved bmw/mini repair collision center, i assumed that all repairs made should be guaranteed and your mini warranty should still be valid for this breakdown. i don't understand why your dealer (is this the same one you go to for the collision repair?) is not using mini warranty.

 

I'm not really getting the part where you drive the car and it over heats? Didn't you see coolant on the ground? Ok, I'll let that pass. Didn't you notice the steam cloud? Didn't you notice when it went into limp mode and the CHECK ENGINE light came on?

Don't you ever check the oil? The Mini doesn't have an oil level indicator light, it has a low OIL PRESSURE LIGHT. It has low pressure because it has no oil. Didn't you notice the 3 qts of oil it must have left somewhere? (twice?) Either a Gulf sized slick on the parking space, or the clouds of blue smoke it left in it's wake while you were driving? How long did you drive it with the OIL PRESSURE Light blazing away? No wonder it died.

Sorry, but you are probably stuck fixing this on your own dime. Lawyers for the insurance company, the dealer, and Mini too, are going to make those points. You failed to follow the instructions in the manual, and that caused the engine failure.

When the oil pressure light comes on, TURN OFF THE ENGINE!

Check oil level regularly, (like EVERY time you fill the gas tank) It really is part of owning and maintaning a car...

As far as I know, Mini dealer techs are not trained to rebuild engines. They replace them. (though I've never asked if they would...)

 

I am not trying to be an *** here but, why doesn't your friend get on so he can explain everything?

 

I agree that the insurance company is the problem, not the dealer. The state insurance commisioner's office is one place to start if all pleas to State Farm are being ignored. There can be no question that the original accident's damage to the vehicle in ongoing and in need of another repair (no matter how many miles have transpired). The car was never right after the repair, it just took many trips to the dealer in order to make the diagnosis. Very unfortunate situation. An attorney might be needed. It's likely that an attorney would get results. Too often the big boys (State Farm, dealer) just tell you to pound sand and figure you'll go away. Usually you will go away, they lose one customer, and save a few grand. It's worth it to them. And the dealer already unloaded one car on you, the chances of unloading another one are pretty slim anyway, they want you to go bye bye too.

 

So...if everybody signed on the dotted line when State Farm agreed to pay for a fix, why isn't the car covered under warranty? Something is missing from the equation here or the full story is not laid flat here. The dealership must've made an "all-out" recommendation on what needed to be done to satisfactorily repair the car, no? If this was done...were compromises made? Did State Farm refuse the dealerships recommendation and opt for a lesser repair (resurface vs replace)? If all parties agreed at the time of the initial repair....this car is still under warranty and the other issue is water under the bridge and exclusive from the new issue. There are missing details here I think....

 

Two things....

1. Check with the state. Ususally there is a mandatory warranty on repairs like this. THe dealer should honor their work and fix the problem. They can then fight with the insurance company for payment.

2. Your insurance is screwing you and you need to escalate it. Be firm but nice until you can talk with someone other than the first person that answers the phone.

 

Hi paipuky:

I have a few thoughts, if you are interested.

First, you can contact the Florida Attorney general. Visit the website for the Florida Attorney General at http://myfloridalegal.com/. Once at the site, you can click on the "Consumer Protection" tab, and file an online complaint against both the dealer and State Farm if you like. Or, you could look up the local Attorney General's office number for the Consumer Protection unit which would be in the Civil (as opposed to criminal) division. The website also lists a "fraud hotline," with a number of 1-866-966-7226 if you want to speak to a live person.

Second, you could take your complaint to a local television station that has a segment aimed at protecting consumers. This would make a fine television report! And no business would want bad press in this crappy economy.

Third, you may need to consider contacting a lawyer to deal with State Farm and the dealership. While I cannot really comment on the liability of State Farm here, as a general matter, we all know that insurance companies have a vested interest in not paying claims. The same would go for any company that offers any insurance, like a warranty. Why pay out if you can stall the consumer? Your situation may need the help of an attorney to investigate whether State Farm or the dealer who performed the work would be liable directly, or perhaps indirectly through a bad faith action. Or, the attorney could just name them both as defendants, and you could watch them squirm as they apportion liability! Ha!

That being said, and this may be stating the obvious, but litigation should always be the last resort. You usually have to pay money up front, and then you have the hassle of the litigation itself. Not to mention, it can drag on for a long time before you get any result at all, especially where insurance companies are involved. Litigation can result in a judgment for you, but at what cost? Sometimes the headaches are just not worth it.

Maybe you should just look at getting the car totaled out on the insurance policy? Sorry to have to say that about a MINI, but it may be the least stressful way to handle this. But then you could get a new one!

Good luck!

 

I agree. Second-hand explanations always lose something in translation.

 

I am posting for my friend because she is not a member of NAM.
Thanks for all the replies, we're taking all in consideration. As you can see it is a complicated situation.
Thanks a lot, I'll post an update in next couple of days.

 

If mini request a new and SF refused there is a paper trail. If the head caused the failure SF pays even if is 3 years later. Damaged a SS prop on a offshore go fast. Insurance refused to replace stressed gears. Outdrive blew up a year later. Gears exploded. They bought a new outdrive for 8K. 400 saving earlier cost them a ton later. Dealer shouldn't have done the work if they couldn't do it right. If they noted the head issue st needs to step up. A letter from a lawyer would be more than enough. Insurance commissioner complaint too. Be firm and clear. They are hoping she goes away. Try a local news
Reporter or consumer help segment. Google get jessie Seattle. They will not want the bad press. Good luck. Move things up the food chain.

 

"Like a good neighbor State Farm is there"............I've had my own issues with SF. Hope you get it sorted.

 

Lots of good suggestions here but being in the bodyshop business for 30 years, I'd like to make a comment.

First, did your friend take the car to be repaired to a State Farm pro shop, usually called a "Service First" shop?

If so, if the work isn't done correctly, State Farm is suppose to stand behind it.

Second, this might be the time to make a call to the Insurance Commissioner in your state. Their job is to make sure insurance companies are screwing over customers.

Third, it might be in your (her) benefit to contact a lawyer.

Once an insurance company's adjuster denies the claim, it's almost like the kiss of death. Usually any other adjusters that are sent out to inspect a vehicle will not override what the last adjuster said.

Obviously we're hearing this info second hand but based on what we've been told, it sounds like the insurance company is definitely screwing you over by not supporting the repair.

Though all the insurance bashing may be justly so, the real culprit is the company that did the repair work. Obviously if they diagnosed and repaired the car correctly, your friend wouldn't be in this situation.

It might take a lawyer to sue them to get the money back and just take the car elsewhere to fix it.

Hope they get it fixed correctly.


Mark