My wife and I just ordered a Chili Red Clubman through our credit union's car buying service. They negotiated with the dealer of their choice and received a better deal than we received from our local dealer. The down side to this is we have no direct contact with the dealer. As a matter of fact, we aren't informed of who the dealer is. The car will be delivered to our credit union when it arrives. I guess this is to keep us from bothering a dealer who is selling the car cheaper than usual. Anyway, we asked the buying service rep to ask the dealer for a Production Number. The dealer told the rep that it would be several weeks before this was available.

After reading through these forums I'm not sure what is normal and what is dealer stalling. Has anybody out there bought a Mini in this manner and does the delay in receivng a production number sound right?

Thanks!

 

Unless the discount was substantial, and/or the selling dealer is within a reasonable distance, I'd opt out of the CU thing, for a couple of reasons. The buying process is part of the experience, and has some value on its own. It sounds like you'll be in the dark as to production and delivery, and since that can be...um...prolonged, having a MA to hold your hand is a positive thing. And, after delivery, having an advocate at the dealer can only be good. If you buy the car blind, you'll have to cultivate that relationship on your own, and you could conceivably have an uphill battle.

YMMV, but I think the potential downside(s) could outweigh any savings on the front end.

 

+1 on everything hoonu said.

Also when it comes to warranty repairs questions and all things that you will have to deal with a dealership on this may not be a wise choice.

Although any dealer is required to do warranty work on your car. if the car has not come from your closest dealership there may be problems with them giving you priority support. In other words if there are two cars there for warrenty work and one was bought at the dealership and one was not you can be sure that the one bought there will get first service and the other will have to wait and even maybe have to wait for non warrenty repairs of cars that were bought there.

TheDealer relationship is a very improtant thing to have.

Even after more than 6 months of not beign at or calling the dealer, when i did call to make you one year service appointment the SA mentioned a few things (minor warranty issues) that needed to be taken care of since the last time i was there. And this is at a dealership that sees more than 700 cars a month for service. Having that kind of relationship is definately worth more than a couple thousnad dollars.

 

Can you let us know how much better the deal was with the credit union? Did you ask your dealer to match the credit union deal? If it's a substantial savings that your dealer couldn't or wouldn't match, then it may be worth the extra effort. If you're only getting another few hundred discount, I'd go with the dealer's offer, or at least see if the dealer will meet you half-way.
As far as an order number, won't you know the dealer the credit union used once you make your down payment? I wouldn't make any deal without getting that information upon signing the contract.
'

 

The difference in the deal is about a thousand dollars. The local dealer was hitting us for the "dealer prep" as well as increased cost for the dealer installed options. The MA did not make much effort for us when we told her that we were not interested in anything currently on the lot. She told us that she would attempt to locate our spec (Clubman, Chili Red w/aero). Two days later I called her and she still had not searched for our car. The next day I received an email from the MA stating that she could not find the car, but suggesting that we could add the JCW aero to one of their in stock Clubmans. Of course this was going to cost $1,200 more than the factory aero.

The second issue with the dealer is trade in. The dealer wanted a $1,000 non refundable deposit to order the car. The dealer would not value the trade until the ordered car arrived. The MA stated that they previously used the Kelly Blue Book but since "car prices had gotten crazy" they now used the average sale price from a dealers auction in Pennsylvania (I looked it up at the time but I don't remember the name). This gives the dealer all the advantage when the new car comes in and they under value the trade.

The CU is very large and arranges many car deals. They had the deal put together within the day. No dealer fees and a reduced rate for the dealer installed options. They require a $500 deposit. What they have worked out with the dealer to order the car, I don't know. The CU also priced my trade over the phone. Of course they will re-appraise the trade when the new car comes in but I feel more comfortable with that than with the dealer. I also had no interest in having the deal matched by the dealer. When I called the MA and told her that we were going with the CU and why, she just said "Okay" and the hung up really quickly.

I will do all of the paperwork with the CU. I'm sure I will find out the dealer at some point, but all of the business end of this is done through the CU.

I have tried to buy numerous makes of vehicles from the same parent company as the Mini dealer. Withou fail they are always overpriced and unwilling to bend. I have always gone elsewhere and received a better deal. Unfortunately, they are the only gane in town for the MC.

I'm not the least bit concerned about this process for buying the car. My main questions are what happens to generate the production number and what is a normal wait until the dealer should know the number? Also, the CU dealer stated that it would take 6-8 weeks for the car to arrive. After reading the forums, this appears to be about right, any insights?

Thanks

 

I always respect, and usually agree with Hoonu and Schatzy62 on most everything...but I have a different take on the buy/service dance. I believe this 'thinking' wrt a special service relationship with those that dealer-buy is obsolete, and perpetuated by dealers, MA's and service advisors/techs.

Disclosure:I did buy Pelle through a broker, and my reasons were rather typical:
Immediate order: I called after I built Pelle to my specs online, and simply relayed the order to my broker. Fastest delivery: they searched for earliest production date among dozens of West coast dealers. Price: I got MSRP from the remote dealer at a time when local dealers were doing the 'dealer prep' and markups of 1K and more. And service: they did all the footwork...it would take me literally days of phonetag, emails and dead-end sales pitches before weeding through and accomplishing what they did overnight..I capitalised on their pre-existing relationships in my region. I was commuting in a gas-guzzler pickup truck, with a $1000/mo gas bill , so time 'was of the essence' is getting Pelle home ASAP, and I had no qualms spending the $500 commission to have all the work done for me, the earliest delivery possible, and at MSRP. I beat the local dealers by at least 2 months (some were 12 weeks beyond my final dealer), for a savings of at least $1500 in gas alone, regardless of markups. My broker emailed my production number, then followed with VIN, and emailed when Pelle reached Long Beach (I already knew from tracking the ship online ). Then my broker called the night before arrival to set up a time to deliver Pelle to my home, and sign the final paperwork. I never stepped into a dealership, heck..I never even had the time to test-drive a MINI!

On service, I've had two experiences so far, and they were complete opposites. I had Pelle's windscreen replaced, and while waiting, I recalled SF BMW/MINI was just a block away, so I thought I'd drop in and begin the 'cultivation' everyone claims they need. I walked into the service area, and despite a half-dozen manned desks, no customers at these desks (I guess they were playing Solitaire?) and it was easily a minute or more before anyone even made eye contact with me. Not good. I got looked at, then they looked at someone else, who in turn looked at someone else, glances all over the place, with me standing there..simply waiting. After about 2 minutes, someone walked by from my left, and asked me if I was there to pick up a car. I explained (in earshot of everyone) I was interested in getting service for my MINI, as the regular maintenance date was fast approaching. I was directed (by pointing) to the one desk with a person on the phone, intead of a computer. He said 'wait here' (still standing), and he'll help you out. So I waited..about another 3 minutes. Eye contact had been made, so the guy knew I expected to meet with him, but he was in no hurry whatsoever. When he hung up, he motioned me over, and I was allowed to finally sit at his chair. I reiterated I was interested in scheduled maintenance, how soon could he fit me in. 3 weeks to schedule...an oil change! OY! I asked if they had any non-scheduled drop-in times (every dealer indeed does, but don't advertise the fact), and he confessed if I was able to drop off the car at 6AM (NEVER gonna happen , I go to bed at 6AM HAH!), they could do the oil change any day of the week, but just couldn't schedule it, nor guarantee WHEN they would actually do the oil change...it could be anywhere from several hours, to several days, he just 'couldn't tell for sure'.
Naturally, he hadn't asked me where/when I bought my MINI, and I had already gotten the impression he could care less. I decided to probe the schedule (I still had an hour to kill waiting for the windshield) to see exactly how far out any openings occurred...the monitor was sideways, so I could indeed see what he was doing (no Solitaire) and he was almost right...nearest available appointment was just over 2 weeks out. I waffled, and he finally asked my name and wanted my fob, saying if anyone canceled, he'd fit me in. I complied, but he couldn't find me in 'his system'...'naturally', I said, because I didn't buy the MINI there. 'No problem', he continued..and we proceeded to fill out the service request screen. I grabbed a free espresso drink from the comfy waiting area, but left feeling like I had just wasted my time. I went home and got online, leading to my second experience.

Discouraged by SF BMW/MINI, and recalling a few positive reports here about East Bay MINI, I searched their site. BOOM! I discover I can schedule my own service appointment, at my own convenience. I can tell them exactly what services I want, complaints I have I want addressed, everything...I got a confirmation email, and the day before my appointment, I got a courtesy call from the service manager reminding/confirming tomorrow's appointment. I drove an hour, but was greeted within 5 seconds, fob taken, service request was printed and Pelle was driven into the garage in under 3 minutes...I was never asked where I bought Pelle, never shown an attitude, and was treated like I was family...I had found my service dealer. Only questions I was asked: Have I had lunch yet? (There were some good deli's nearby if I was interested), Is there anything wrong, or not to my liking about Pelle? (NO! :P ), and would I mind filling out an online survey of my experience with service at East Bay MINI? (Sure...in fact, count on it!). I had an oil, filter, and microfilter? changed out in about an hour, and Pelle was washed, almost as good as I do. No charges. I called SF MINI and cancelled my mystery/snowball-chance in hell 'appointment'.

Service boils down to what your options are...if you only have 1 dealer in a 300 mile radius, I hope he's got a good service department, or you're hosed, regardless of where you bought. I'm lucky to have 4 MINI dealers in my area. Maybe more, if I included the central valley where I work, but my experience shows the place you purchase won't guarantee you any special treatment...it will only come from a dealer that's already commited to exceptional service, regardless of sales.

 

If I may ask. Where is the only deal in town? This may also help you as there may be people here to tell you what their experience is with that dealer.

You should be able to have a production number before you walk out the door. In fact I had my production number before i even signed any paperwork.

Length of time can vary greatly. I have two mini dealers in my area and the first one (Mini of Peabody) was telling me and showed me the schedule and it was going to be 7 months. The second dealer (Herb Chambers Mini of Boston) was 5 weeks. It all depends on their particular ordering schedule and how many they have sold.

Something i just thought of is that the CU, if they really do sell that many cars may not even be dealing with a dealership they may be dealing with someone a MINI HQ and then the car just gets delivered to the closest dealer. I know this is how Mercedes/BMW/Volvo do it with their orders where you get to drive it in Europe before having the car shipped to the US. If that is the case then you may not be able to get a production number easily.

If you have ordered the car then you may be able to find out the production number from MINI USA but they are usually 2-3 weeks behind on their data.

Alpha - I'm with you on the each dealer is very different situation. I try to be patient with the service departments, but one of the dealers near me will never get my business because they did expressly state to me "You did not buy the car from us you bought it from HC" and although they did not refuse to look at the car there were at least 6 other cars that got in ahead of me with out appointments. When they finaly did bring it in they took care of the problem in less than 10 minutes. All they did was replace two clips on the dirver side barn door to keep the lower panel from ratteling.

 

never tried these car buying brokers, but all I know is that in the NY area the dealers are dealing like never before, with a lot more than $1K off of MSRP.

MINI's have a pretty good margin especially if you are ordering packages and a lot of add on accessories.

 

Great post, Alphawave.

According to the OBC, I'm still three months (or 7000 miles) from my first service. We'll see if the selling dealer is any more excited to have me return than the one that's an hour closer...

Good luck on the purchase, DSNTMATR, you'll dig the car either way.

(You're not in NC, are you?)

 

While in a "normal" economy I would try this, I think that now you should be able to find something. I got more than $1000 off this past weekend and a good deal for my trade in. ALSO, the salesman was telling us that the reason the order was 10 weeks was because Mini turned it back a bit. He said most dealerships are sitting on around 100 cars as opposed to the usual 60 or so. That's what he said anyway.

 

Thanks for all of the input. I am going to hold off on naming the dealer until I have tried their Service Dept. and then I will give them a fair review based on sales and servic.

As there are only two dealers in the state, there wasn't as much motivation to deal as in some larger markets.

The bottom line is that my wife and I have a major case of car fever and we are only a week into the wait. I think that next time we will have to buy from dealer stock to avoid the pending insanity.

Thanks!

 

To the OP, I did not have my production number when I bought my MINI. I didn't get it until the next week or so. So you not having your number immediately is not abnormal.

6-8 weeks for the car to arrive seems to be based more on when the production starts than when the car is ordered. It may take a few weeks to a few months from when you order it for production to actually start on your MINI, depending on the dealership it's being ordered from.

edit- you must've replied as I was typing (and trying to have a phone conversation at the same time, lol).
Good luck with your wait! I can't say I enjoyed mine, lol!

 

Thanks for the info. At some point this will all seem like a good idea.

 

There's only one dealership in my state and so I didn't think they would negotiate much. From what I could tell had I ordered it outright they wouldn't have negotiated, but since I took something they had in inventory (I didn't get my #1 color choice and I had to sacrifice the Xenons) they did and I think I got a really good deal.

Oh, I'm sure it'll be worth the wait. I've only had mine for a few days and I love it. Looks like a million bucks. Plus you'll be getting the car you want. According to my dealer, there were only two cars with the color and options I wanted in the entire country.

 

I don't get the whole service relationship thing either. I haven't had my MINI in yet, only 9,600 miles, but with my wife's BMW she had, and the old ML350 I had with Mercedes, it was an absolute nightmare. Going 4 weeks out for an oil change? Give me a break.

Alpha, I also ran the gauntlet of 5 people staring at computers not helping me numerous times.

Our BMW dealer had a nice wonderful thing where you had a personal service advisor, and you always had the same one every time you came in. OK, #1, I had the X3 36 months and had it serviced 3 times, or once a year. Synthetic oil of course. All 3 times I did go in for service, even though there were 4 to 5 available reps to help, they couldn't help me because my X3 belonged to Brian or Chuck or Jerry or whatever the hell his name was. So I would have to wait on him for up to 30 minutes because he was with a customer. How is THAT customer service when other SAs are available?

Hendrick BMW service is deplorable and I am hoping their MINI service is different.