I got my manual MCS a few weeks ago, this is my first stick shift car so you can imagine how much fun I have for the last few weeks

Now I basically can handle the car without stalling, but of course I still "ride the clutch" from time to time to prevent stalling

I have a question on what I should do when leaving a freeway at high speed.

Here is how I do most of the time:

1) driving at around 75mph
2) step on brake to slow the car down
3) shift it to netural and contiune to step on brake
4) shift it to 3 or 2 depending on the road condition or make a full stop.

The problem I am having is when I shift to 3 or 2, the car will always jerk because of the rpm and gear does not match. I know I can double clutch it to avoid the jerking, but is there any other way to do it? Double clutch is a bit of advance to me, I always end up over-rev the engine.

Thanks you!

 

I think the easiest thing is to just downshift smoothly in order.

Take your foot off the gas, depress clutch, shift into 5th (assuming you were in 6th), smoothly take foot off clutch as you return other foot to gas.

Repeat to shift into 4th, then 3rd, and 2nd as you reach the bottom of the ramp.

Your problem is jumping from 6th or 5th to 3rd or 2nd.

 

if you don't double clutch, just do it slowly, those are really your options for smooth downshifting. Be aware, anytime you push it into gear without the engine and tranny being at the right speed, you are just making the synchros do their job. Do it fast=hard on your synchros, do it slow, easy on your synchros. I double clutch personally, it matches the revs and makes downshifts butter smooth once you get ahold of it. A double clutch downshift sequence, just for refresher:

1. clutch in
2. lever to neutral
3. clutch out
4. blip throttle to match revs to what speed the engine should be at given you road speed and the gear you selected (you'll get the hang of this over time, its the hardest part)
5. clutch in (MAKE SURE YOU ARE OFF THE GAS AT THIS POINT)
6. lever into the lower gear (the shifter should feel like it slides in really easily, easier than if you didn't double clutch)
7. clutch out

it takes some getting used to, but its nice to be able to downshift fast and smoothly

I wouldn't recommend what Red Fish said, that way you will wear each and every one of your synchros on the way down (you won't wear them much if you do it slowly). You'll wear them evenly I guess, but rev matching will be much friendlies to your tranny in the long run. . .

 

This might help you out.

http://www.motoringfile.com/2005/07/...ng_made_simple
http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/how...2/article.html
http://felixwong.com/news/1999/02/ho...-downshifting/

 

i would always recommend looking ahead and seeing what lays before you.

If the expressway offramp is clear, i normally leave it in the curent gear (provided that I slowed down before exiting the ramp) and continue in a gear lower (4th or 5th depending on your speed)

if there is traffic head, often you may need to come to a stop so ride the to a stop (whilst manuvering the gears based on the apropirate speed). There may be an instance where you have to move out of the way quickly to avoid something and being in neutral only complicates things.

 

Someone once said, "Its cheaper to replace your brake pads than to have to put in a new tranny." Take it easy on the gears.

 

I usually use neutral only when I stop. You can downshift without braking, it actually slows down the car. Try to put as less force on brakes as you can controlling with the shifting when possible. To make it short: don't depend on brakes, but create harmony between the two. I never double clutch, just feel every millimeter of it.

You'll get used to your car in a while depending on your driving skills. Keeping smooth driving with manual sometimes is much easier than with auto transmission, not even talking of the controlling in extreme situations.

Good luck and drive safe!

 

You can always rev-match it. While pressing the clutch all the way down, put it in gear and hit the gas, jumping the RPM's up. Once there, let the clutch out and all is good, no jerking. You will have to find the RPM's for each gear, so it'll take a bit of practice. Most of the time you can hit 3k and let out the clutch and be fine.

-Cody

 

Your all making this much harder than it is.

If your in sixth, downshift to 5th or 4th. Take 5th down as slow as you want without lugging. Shift into second matching the road speed to RPMs. Thats the hard way. Hard on transmission. Transmission are expensive, brakes are cheap

When coming of the highway I just brake, dropping it into neutral, let the car slow down and then select the correct gear to match the road speed, Depends upon whats at the end of the offramp. If its a stop sign, well then its first. If its a slow turn where traffic is clear, then usually its second.

Practice ... Neutral is your friend

BTW, FORGET about double clutching, that went the way of the dinosours with synchronized gears

 

From what I understand of manual transmissions, the synchros make double-clutching unnecessary. I am a big fan of rev-matching though...

1. You are in 6th gear approaching exit ramp
2. Press down on clutch
3. Downshift to 5th
4. Tap the gas, elevating the revs by 1000 rpm or so, on average
5. Release the clutch smoothly

The quicker you do this process (without rushing), the smoother your downshift will be. If you clutch and then think about it for too long, the revs of the engine will drop to idle (<1,000 rpm) and you will have farther to go when you use the gas to rev back up, making it more difficult to hit your target rev range.

You can take this one step further, if you need to stop even more quickly, by braking and blipping the throttle at the same time w/ your right foot.

1. You are in 6th gear approaching exit ramp (same as above)
1.5 - Apply brake with left side (ball) of your right foot on the right side of the pedal - keep braking though next steps (new instruction)
2. Press down on clutch (same as above)
3. Downshift to 5th (same as above)
4. Tap the gas, elevating the revs by 1000 rpm or so, on average (same as above, but you are braking w/ the left side of your foot, so tap the gas w/ the right side (pinkie toe) of the foot)
5. Release the clutch smoothly

It took me 2-3 months of practice to get this right 95% of the time... the last 5% took another 4-5 months. I made a series of perfect braking/downshifts the other day in the MINI... 5th gear down to 2nd. The guy who was in the car with me looked over and said "What the hell was that?" It took 10 minutes of explaining engine revs vs. transmission revs and several demonstrations of downshifting with and without rev matching, but he's a convert now and starting the long process of learning how to get it right in his car.

 

Totally Agree - besides, my community has signs all over the place that read "Engine Braking is Illegal"

I almost never work my way down through the gears when slowing but either do one of two things -

• Like Chows, from the time I want to slow, I leave the clutch out and brake my way to a comfortable speed for the next piece of road I will face, then (largely through feel) put it in the right gear to match that speed and zoom on....
• In a similar fashion, I leave the clutch engaged and do the same thing - braking down from 5th or 6th to the speed I need to be at without changing gears (being careful not to get too slow and stall) and then when the time comes that I need power, clutch out, slide it over to the desired slower gear and zoom along....

I suspect that the second method will help the engine better match speeds since the first method drops your revs to a minimum level, to be followed by some increase to the desired gear.

My worry with the second approach, though, is that in an emergency you are not going to have very much torque to get your tail moving in a hurry without more work than the first choice (where I may already have it in the lower gear waiting for my speed to hit the right zone).

Absoltely nothing wrong with coasting along with the clutch out, though... Don't worry about always having it in the "right" gear all the time, especially in downshifts. I want my tranny to last forever so I try not to ask it to do more than is necessary....

B

 

Keep the car in the gear until you see the tach drop to around 1,500- 2,000 rpm before down shifting. If the car revs the engine too much for comfort (jerkiness) after the downshift, wait until the revs drop lower before downshifting again. At some point, you will be able to do the downshift thing by the sound of the engine.

 

Forget double clutching. You're just wearing out the throwout bearing and pressure plate faster than you need to.

Let your synchors do what they designed and manufactured to do. Downshifting is very easy if you just drop your gears in descending order, 6-5-4-3-2-1.

With more experience, you can glance at the speedo, and know what gear is usually good for that speed. I can be in 6th, pop it into neutral, use the brakes to slow down, and then when I'm at what I consider to be 2nd gear speed, pop it into 2nd, get a little engine braking, make my turn and off I go.

If I ever see anyone double-clutching at an autocross, they will likely lose the event. Takes too much time.

 

dang, all these excellent instructions!


i just slam on the brakes and watch all the cars behing me
fly off the road in my rear view mirror.

 

The MCS can get down to about 30 mph in 6th gear. Just brake normally as you come off the ramp. Once you get down to about 30-35 mph look ahead. If I am going to have to make a complete stop I just pop it into neutral and finish braking. If it looks like I can keep going I will shift into 3 and continue.

It is fairly hard to stall the MINI while moving. You can keep it in any gear until about 900-1000 RPM, at which point it will start to kick back a little. About that point I will decide what gear I need to be in and shift.

 

I was once rear-ended by some guy paying exactly zero attention to the fact that the light before us had turned red. I had basically come to a stop, but was still moving a teensy bit while in Neutral. I saw, in my rearview, that the guy wasn't stopping. Would I have had time to maneuver (though, there really wasn't anywhere to maneuver) out of the way had I not been in neutral? I don't know. But for that reason I now stay in gear until completely stopped.

You wouldn't catch me coasting down an offramp in neutral. Just downshift sequentially, if traffic is clear, until you get a better feel for what speed/RPMs fall in line with which gear. If you know you're coming to a stop, I've been told (as has been suggested) just to come to the stop in whichever ear you're in, though I'd probably drop it a bit just to retain some semblance of responsiveness just in case.

Either way, I think you're complicating your life with your method.

 

[quote=agranger]From what I understand of manual transmissions, the synchros make double-clutching unnecessary. I am a big fan of rev-matching though...

1. You are in 6th gear approaching exit ramp
2. Press down on clutch
3. Downshift to 5th
4. Tap the gas, elevating the revs by 1000 rpm or so, on average
5. Release the clutch smoothly

The quicker you do this process (without rushing), the smoother your downshift will be. If you clutch and then think about it for too long, the revs of the engine will drop to idle (<1,000 rpm) and you will have farther to go when you use the gas to rev back up, making it more difficult to hit your target rev range.


Is this similar to double clutch?

1. clutch in
2. lever to neutral
3. clutch out
4. blip throttle to match revs to what speed the engine should be at given you road speed and the gear you selected (you'll get the hang of this over time, its the hardest part)
5. clutch in (MAKE SURE YOU ARE OFF THE GAS AT THIS POINT)
6. lever into the lower gear (the shifter should feel like it slides in really easily, easier than if you didn't double clutch)
7. clutch out

You basically eliminate step 2,3 and 5.

This is a much better way to drop speed and match rev at the same time with a single clutch action!!

I like this much better!!!

 

This isn't EXACTLY the same as double-clutching, but the syncro's in a MINI transmission make that engage and dis-engage step unnecessary.

When you are driving your 18-wheeler, feel free to double-clutch as you describe...

 

Wow! All this instruction has me thinking of my golf swing; head down, feet shoulder width, slight turn out of my left foot, weight on the right side, arms relaxed, grip pressure just right, slow take away, shoulder turn, hip turn, left arm straight, **** the wrists, turn the club face away, point the head to the target, intiate the downswing, rotate the shoulders, turn the hips, release the hands, weight transfer to right side, hit ball first then the ground, head still down, firm left side, follow through, watch out for the water on the right...

My advice; just do whatever feels right to you. I have been driving sticks for over 25 years (I learned to drive in a stick-sift on the slowest car of all time, a diesel Rabbit. I even took my drivers test in that car) and I have learned to use the heal/toe method described above. It is so natural to me now that I don't think I can drive any other way. I am currently teaching one of my daughters to drive this way (in her very own Cooper) and I will be teaching my son soon in my car.

***Pay attention to what X rev point is at X speed in X gear. Two words in closing; REV MATCH

 

HI AGrange,

Thanks for your advice!! Forgive my ignorance, I still have question about your method and the traditional double clutch method. It seems to me that both methods are trying to rev up the engine before engage to a lower gear so the jerking can be avoided. The only difference is your method does not require to shift into neutral first before tap on gas, so it can be done faster and less compilcated. Am I right?

 

You've got it right! My way doesn't work on 18-wheelers or older manual transmissions, but it works fine on our little MINIs! Someone else will have to give an explanation about what synchros do to accomplish this feat, but the simple tap on the gas (frequenty called blipping the throttle) works fine in the MINI.

 

I like the golf analogy, above...

In golf, sometimes it's good just to do what feels natural. When I'm on the course, I try and think about one or two big-picture things (ex: keep your head down and don't rush). Anything more than that, and you don't enjoy the game, the company of your friends or just being outside for a few hours.

Sometimes in golf, though, it's good to think deeper about what you are doing. That's what putting greens and driving ranges are for. If you want to learn to work the ball (draw or fade), you practice those skills in the safety and solitude of the practice facilities. It's at the driving range where you practice your swing to make it regular... to make (what is a completely un-natural motion) feel natural. You program your body to repeat that motion so that, when you are under stress (playing the game), you don't have to think about it much.

I took the same approach to learning how to rev-match and heel-toe shift. I practiced doing these things on my drive to and from work... I was in the car by myself and the roads were fairly quiet. I didn't try them when there were other cars around and where I would be a menace to other drivers. I practiced where I had plenty of time to think about it and where a mistake wouldn't cause me any stress.

When I get onto that short off-ramp and I need to decelerate quickly, heel-toe shifting now feels very 'natural'. When I get onto the track for a DE event, I don't have to think about rev. matching because I've practiced listening to the engine and blipping the throttle to give just enough gas to catch the next gear smoothly.

Do exactly what feels natural, but allow yourself to practice, so that what is natural is also good for your wear/tear on the car, good for your ride quality and provides you with additional capabilities (more balanced car in turns and shorter braking distances) that you wouldn't have otherwise.

 

my 2 cents In 6th 70mph 3000 rmp..... Before the on/off ramp I change into 4th and coast down dropping into 2nd / 1st if ness' so I'm in a strong gear if Dim wits pull out into my path

 

Everyone is making a big deal over nothing.

As you come off the off ramp, knowing that your going to either hit a stop sign or a slow corner, just brake, neutral, and slip it into the correct gear matching the road speed

downshifting through every gear is a total waste of a transmission. doubleclutching was obsolete (30 years ago).

Brakes are cheap ... transmission are not ...

Yo OM, how quickly can you put it into a gear ... I bet a blink of an eye. Being in neutral is no hinderance at all. It only when sitting at a light and your daydreaming and the light turns green that the ppl behind might get irrirated

 

Hi chows4us

This is how I do it right now by using the neutral and shift to correct gear matching the road speed, but it will always jerk because once I shift it to neutral, engine rev. drops faster than road speed. So somehow I need to rev up the engine to match the speed again to avoid jerking.

Do you experience any jerk by doing this?