R50/53 Lighting: front fogs, xenons, driving lamps, rear fogs...
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1st Gear
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
From: Portola Valley
I'm new here. So new I don't even have a Mini. I selecting features for my first MCS. I'll be annoying all of you for awhile... as well as my husband who thinks I'm being to picky.
In terms of lighting:
1. How essential are the "front fog lights?" How do they compare to the "driving lamps?" I drive in fog often, snow/rain occassionally.
2. Same with the xenons versus the standard issue.
3. How much do the rear fogs help? [I drive 280 to San Fran OFTEN...]
Thanks.
In terms of lighting:
1. How essential are the "front fog lights?" How do they compare to the "driving lamps?" I drive in fog often, snow/rain occassionally.
2. Same with the xenons versus the standard issue.
3. How much do the rear fogs help? [I drive 280 to San Fran OFTEN...]
Thanks.
>>I'm new here. So new I don't even have a Mini. I selecting features for my first MCS. I'll be annoying all of you for awhile... as well as my husband who thinks I'm being to picky.
>>In terms of lighting:
>>1. How essential are the "front fog lights?" How do they compare to the "driving lamps?" I drive in fog often, snow/rain occassionally.
Front fogs definitely help in inclement weather. They give you a low, wide beam, and also helps your peripheral view. Driving lights have a beam pattern similar to your high beams and are especially useful on unlit roads.
>>2. Same with the xenons versus the standard issue.
the Xenons (also called HID's) are brighter than standard halogen lights and provide a whiter light. They also have an auto leveling feature.
>>3. How much do the rear fogs help? [I drive 280 to San Fran OFTEN...]
Rear fogs are so others can see YOU better in foggy/low visibility conditions.
_________________
>>In terms of lighting:
>>1. How essential are the "front fog lights?" How do they compare to the "driving lamps?" I drive in fog often, snow/rain occassionally.
Front fogs definitely help in inclement weather. They give you a low, wide beam, and also helps your peripheral view. Driving lights have a beam pattern similar to your high beams and are especially useful on unlit roads.
>>2. Same with the xenons versus the standard issue.
the Xenons (also called HID's) are brighter than standard halogen lights and provide a whiter light. They also have an auto leveling feature.
>>3. How much do the rear fogs help? [I drive 280 to San Fran OFTEN...]
Rear fogs are so others can see YOU better in foggy/low visibility conditions.
_________________
welcome to the wonderfull world of mini... im gettin mine on this commin tuesday and im so damn excited!
front fog lights look great and serve their purpose extemely well. highly recomended.
xenon vs halogen, xenons are brighter due to the fact that they burn at a higher color temperature than halogens. they burn more "blue". Living in LA, personally i couldn't justify them. i just got the premium package,no sport package.
as for the rear fogs, it a neat idea, i dont plan on going backwards fast enough to need them.
if you got the loot, get it all.
Thread Starter
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1st Gear
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
From: Portola Valley
Nice photo!
Rear fogs so others can see me, I got it - the question is HOW much better can they see ME? How much brighter (and what color) are they than standard driving lights? Do you think they are worth having?
Rear fogs so others can see me, I got it - the question is HOW much better can they see ME? How much brighter (and what color) are they than standard driving lights? Do you think they are worth having?
Moderator :: Performance Mods
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,427
Likes: 6
From: A Den in Maryland
Rear fogs are the same brightness as brake lights (and the same red color). As was said, they are not there to help you see, but the have people driving in inclement weather behind you see you. Approaching a car from behind in severe rain or in foggy conditions even in daylight with 'rear fog lights' on increases the distance at which that car can be first seen though the fog or mist.
The rear fogs are the uppermost part of the taillight housing that are otherwise unused in the US models. The bulbs are in place, and many have made simple modifications to have them act as extra brake lights.
_________________
"Earl Grey" - '03 MCS, DS over DS, 17" R85s, NAV, DSC (often turned off!), Packs #1 and #3, Rally lights, etc, etc. Perf Mods by the boatload, on the way! Fulton, MD. FRS 7-21
Let's Get Small!
The rear fogs are the uppermost part of the taillight housing that are otherwise unused in the US models. The bulbs are in place, and many have made simple modifications to have them act as extra brake lights.
_________________
"Earl Grey" - '03 MCS, DS over DS, 17" R85s, NAV, DSC (often turned off!), Packs #1 and #3, Rally lights, etc, etc. Perf Mods by the boatload, on the way! Fulton, MD. FRS 7-21
Let's Get Small!
3rd Gear
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 160
Likes: 0
From: arlington virginia
rear fog burns as bright as your rear brake light but only mounted on the driver side of the vehicle. i get lots of constructive comment from my friends because they think one of brake lights is out.
since sf is known for foggy condition, i would get it since it only costs $75.00.
front fog is great. it projects a wider beam and as bright as regular halogen headlight. cost $150.00
xenon is great too. the light is whiter and brighter than regular halogen light. if you don't drive at night alot, i would think twice. i drive at night and early in morning from and to work so xenon definitely a plus. cost $500.00 and you get headlight washer too. they burn cooler but at a higher color temp so snow might stick to it hence the washer.
good luck. i have my mini for two days now and have enjoyed her enormously. the people on this board are very knowledgeable and very helpful to me.
since sf is known for foggy condition, i would get it since it only costs $75.00.
front fog is great. it projects a wider beam and as bright as regular halogen headlight. cost $150.00
xenon is great too. the light is whiter and brighter than regular halogen light. if you don't drive at night alot, i would think twice. i drive at night and early in morning from and to work so xenon definitely a plus. cost $500.00 and you get headlight washer too. they burn cooler but at a higher color temp so snow might stick to it hence the washer.
good luck. i have my mini for two days now and have enjoyed her enormously. the people on this board are very knowledgeable and very helpful to me.
5th Gear
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,100
Likes: 3
From: Endicott, NY
Keep in mind your xenons will be a different color than your fog lights....I think it looks "funky"...stock headlites and fogs burn the same color.
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5th Gear
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 851
Likes: 0
From: Livermore, CA.
Dixie,
The front fog lights are a plus. I used them the other morning driving Highway 84 through the fog and they did an excelent job of lighting up the roadway.
I woundn't trade the xenons in for anything. They put lots of white light on the road and make driving at night much more pleasurable. When I drive a car without them it is almost as if I'm wearing sunglasses.
As for the rear fog lights I didn't get them. I'm going to do the rear brake light mod.
I want to make sure people behind me really know I'm stopping.
The front fog lights are a plus. I used them the other morning driving Highway 84 through the fog and they did an excelent job of lighting up the roadway.
I woundn't trade the xenons in for anything. They put lots of white light on the road and make driving at night much more pleasurable. When I drive a car without them it is almost as if I'm wearing sunglasses.
As for the rear fog lights I didn't get them. I'm going to do the rear brake light mod.
I want to make sure people behind me really know I'm stopping.
6th Gear
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,330
Likes: 0
From: VA Beach
>>As for the rear fog lights I didn't get them. I'm going to do the rear brake light mod.
>>I want to make sure people behind me really know I'm stopping.
Having driven behind a friend who recently got his rear fogs installed, I can definitely say without a doubt that it will make people SEE you! They are really bright and seem to be almost brighter than the brake lights. As far as giving up the break light mod (which uses the rear fogs in addition to your break lights) you can have both. Instead of using a wire to hook up the fogs to the break lights, use a diode.
pic of what it looks like here: break light mod
instructions on how to do it here: diode mod
Also, my friend has had the added pleasure of turning on the fog lights to warn off/annoy SUVs that follow too closely. Works like a charm!
_________________
My MINI makes me want to do the happy dance!
>>I want to make sure people behind me really know I'm stopping.
Having driven behind a friend who recently got his rear fogs installed, I can definitely say without a doubt that it will make people SEE you! They are really bright and seem to be almost brighter than the brake lights. As far as giving up the break light mod (which uses the rear fogs in addition to your break lights) you can have both. Instead of using a wire to hook up the fogs to the break lights, use a diode.
pic of what it looks like here: break light mod
instructions on how to do it here: diode mod
Also, my friend has had the added pleasure of turning on the fog lights to warn off/annoy SUVs that follow too closely. Works like a charm!
_________________
My MINI makes me want to do the happy dance!
6th Gear
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,147
Likes: 0
From: New Hampshire
>>rear fog burns as bright as your rear brake light but only mounted on the driver side of the vehicle. i get lots of constructive comment from my friends because they think one of brake lights is out.
Then your rear fogs are malfunctioning. BOTH sides are lit up when operating normally on a MINI.
Then your rear fogs are malfunctioning. BOTH sides are lit up when operating normally on a MINI.
6th Gear
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,330
Likes: 0
From: VA Beach
>>>>rear fog burns as bright as your rear brake light but only mounted on the driver side of the vehicle. i get lots of constructive comment from my friends because they think one of brake lights is out.
>>
>>Then your rear fogs are malfunctioning. BOTH sides are lit up when operating normally on a MINI.
I concur. Your friends are correct in that you have a light out; both driver's and passenger's sides should be on.
>>
>>Then your rear fogs are malfunctioning. BOTH sides are lit up when operating normally on a MINI.
I concur. Your friends are correct in that you have a light out; both driver's and passenger's sides should be on.
Moderator :: Performance Mods
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,427
Likes: 6
From: A Den in Maryland
Conventional setup of rear foglights in most European vehicles have only one bulb active on the driver's side, the driver's side depends on the country, i.e. England on the right side. Depending on local laws, the bulb is removed on the opposite side if required. In the U.S., there seems to be no such restriction, so both sides can burn brightly.
3rd Gear
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 217
Likes: 0
From: Southern CA
>>rear fog burns as bright as your rear brake light but only mounted on the driver side of the vehicle. i get lots of constructive comment from my friends because they think one of brake lights is out.
>>
ecl3x,
I think your friends are onto something. I've got the rear fogs on my car & they light up on BOTH sides. Check your connections and the bulb. You might find an easily correctable problem.
GreatBear, the one light thing is a really cool bit of information. Thanks.
FYI--I'm Scoop's friend with the recently installed rear foglights. From what I've seen, the rear fogs are a little brighter than the brake lights. And yes, they do work wonders on tailgating SUV's. Don't hit the brakes, instead hit the rear fog switch a couple of times :
_________________
His name is Ollie.
>>
ecl3x,
I think your friends are onto something. I've got the rear fogs on my car & they light up on BOTH sides. Check your connections and the bulb. You might find an easily correctable problem.
GreatBear, the one light thing is a really cool bit of information. Thanks.
FYI--I'm Scoop's friend with the recently installed rear foglights. From what I've seen, the rear fogs are a little brighter than the brake lights. And yes, they do work wonders on tailgating SUV's. Don't hit the brakes, instead hit the rear fog switch a couple of times :
_________________
His name is Ollie.
Dixie,
I just took delivery of two MCS, and both had the Xenon lights and front fog light options. They are wonderful, especially the Xenon lights
I don't think it's necessary to purchase the rear fog option, especially driving 280. (if you were over in the San Joaquin Valley on Hwy 5 or Hwy 99, with their fog, maybe)
I do think the modification (which is easy) of activating the rear fogs is a plus. You can also purchase replacement bulbs that are brighter. (see below) for the stop/tail lights and the turn signals. (Protection against getting rear ended on Hwy 280)
The driving lights are nice, but it will add about $700 minimum to the cost of the car (especially if a CA dealer sells/installs them...probably more like $8-900)
I would suggest just replacing the high beam bulbs (simpler than changing a diaper) , using the bulbs listed below as well.
Ostram Rallye H-7 65 Watt bulbs @ $38/pair (High Beam)
Ostram HO Brake/Tail @ $6.10 ea
Ostram HO Rear Turn @ $6.10 ea
These are available from Daniel Stern Lighting, http://lighting.mbz.org/
Also, check your private messages for information on ordering your car at a substantial savings, including all your accessories. also check out
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ic=19942&1 in the MINI Talk Forum
Charlie
I just took delivery of two MCS, and both had the Xenon lights and front fog light options. They are wonderful, especially the Xenon lights
I don't think it's necessary to purchase the rear fog option, especially driving 280. (if you were over in the San Joaquin Valley on Hwy 5 or Hwy 99, with their fog, maybe)
I do think the modification (which is easy) of activating the rear fogs is a plus. You can also purchase replacement bulbs that are brighter. (see below) for the stop/tail lights and the turn signals. (Protection against getting rear ended on Hwy 280)
The driving lights are nice, but it will add about $700 minimum to the cost of the car (especially if a CA dealer sells/installs them...probably more like $8-900)
I would suggest just replacing the high beam bulbs (simpler than changing a diaper) , using the bulbs listed below as well.
Ostram Rallye H-7 65 Watt bulbs @ $38/pair (High Beam)
Ostram HO Brake/Tail @ $6.10 ea
Ostram HO Rear Turn @ $6.10 ea
These are available from Daniel Stern Lighting, http://lighting.mbz.org/
Also, check your private messages for information on ordering your car at a substantial savings, including all your accessories. also check out
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ic=19942&1 in the MINI Talk Forum
Charlie
5th Gear
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 633
Likes: 0
From: so cal
I have have the XENON HID's and they are excellent. They real are much brighter than the stock lamps. I notice other drivers signal before merging in front of me. I love them! I definite yes on purchasing them again. They turn on with a blue tint but seem to fade to a bright white light after a few seconds
4th Gear
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 321
Likes: 0
From: Mexico
To be completely honest, the standard MINI halogens are really good, but the Xenons are just awesome (If they were available on MCs in Mexico I would have gotten them)
The front fog lamps are very useful, especially under bad weather, they are also helpful on less than good roads to avoid hazzards.
The rear fog lamps... man if they are the same intensity as the regular stop lights then I don´t understand why they are SO annoying to people driving behind MINIs
A lot of people here in Mexico turn them on all the time even on perfect weather and they just drive me crazy (not only MINIs, all european cars, especially the peugeots). I´d save the money (neve have used them - came as standard equipment on my euro-spec car)
Better get the rally lights. You really don´t need them but they look great
The front fog lamps are very useful, especially under bad weather, they are also helpful on less than good roads to avoid hazzards.
The rear fog lamps... man if they are the same intensity as the regular stop lights then I don´t understand why they are SO annoying to people driving behind MINIs
A lot of people here in Mexico turn them on all the time even on perfect weather and they just drive me crazy (not only MINIs, all european cars, especially the peugeots). I´d save the money (neve have used them - came as standard equipment on my euro-spec car)
Better get the rally lights. You really don´t need them but they look great
6th Gear
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,256
Likes: 2
From: Chicago, IL
>>I'm new here. So new I don't even have a Mini. I selecting features for my first MCS. I'll be annoying all of you for awhile... as well as my husband who thinks I'm being to picky.
>>In terms of lighting:
>>1. How essential are the "front fog lights?" How do they compare to the "driving lamps?" I drive in fog often, snow/rain occassionally.
>>2. Same with the xenons versus the standard issue.
>>3. How much do the rear fogs help? [I drive 280 to San Fran OFTEN...]
>>Thanks.
Newbie future MINI Cooper phreak here (and yes i know that's a terribly constructed phrase); l been lurking here (this site's Grand!) and elsewhere in the MINI Realm for several weeks... I'm infatuated with MINI's, to say the least...
The quoted posting caught my eye primarily because as I read it, I realized I didn't know there is a distinction between "Front Fog Lights" and "Driving Lamps" (yeah i know, *sigh, but be patient with me I'll get the hang of this yet
) Anyhow, don't both of those terms refer to the 2 "additional" lights that sit above the front bumper, in the space between the plain ol' headlights? I have realized, in my MINI Musings, that i LUV the look, and I NEED to have (at least) 4 lites in front.
PS If I'm committing "thread abuse" here, have faith I won't require much training...
I also appreciate how LITTLE work will be required to make a MINI nest in my otherwise cluttered garage!
Gratefully,
Tatt
>>In terms of lighting:
>>1. How essential are the "front fog lights?" How do they compare to the "driving lamps?" I drive in fog often, snow/rain occassionally.
>>2. Same with the xenons versus the standard issue.
>>3. How much do the rear fogs help? [I drive 280 to San Fran OFTEN...]
>>Thanks.
Newbie future MINI Cooper phreak here (and yes i know that's a terribly constructed phrase); l been lurking here (this site's Grand!) and elsewhere in the MINI Realm for several weeks... I'm infatuated with MINI's, to say the least...
The quoted posting caught my eye primarily because as I read it, I realized I didn't know there is a distinction between "Front Fog Lights" and "Driving Lamps" (yeah i know, *sigh, but be patient with me I'll get the hang of this yet
) Anyhow, don't both of those terms refer to the 2 "additional" lights that sit above the front bumper, in the space between the plain ol' headlights? I have realized, in my MINI Musings, that i LUV the look, and I NEED to have (at least) 4 lites in front.PS If I'm committing "thread abuse" here, have faith I won't require much training...
I also appreciate how LITTLE work will be required to make a MINI nest in my otherwise cluttered garage!
Gratefully,
Tatt
Coordinator ::Bluegrass Minis
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 377
Likes: 0
From: Lexington, Kentucky
>>I realized I didn't know there is a distinction between "Front Fog Lights" and "Driving Lamps" (yeah i know, *sigh, but be patient with me I'll get the hang of this yet ) Anyhow, don't both of those terms refer to the 2 "additional" lights that sit above the front bumper, in the space between the plain ol' headlights?
>>Tatt
Driving Lights are the lights that sit above the front bumper in front of the grill.
Front Fog Lights are smaller lights that are recessed in the lower bumper cover below the bumper inserts.
Hope this helps...
Pepper White/Black Cooper - At Distribution Center
I can't wait much longer....
Gern
) Anyhow, don't both of those terms refer to the 2 "additional" lights that sit above the front bumper, in the space between the plain ol' headlights? >>Tatt
Driving Lights are the lights that sit above the front bumper in front of the grill.
Front Fog Lights are smaller lights that are recessed in the lower bumper cover below the bumper inserts.
Hope this helps...
Pepper White/Black Cooper - At Distribution Center
I can't wait much longer....
Gern
6th Gear
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,256
Likes: 2
From: Chicago, IL
WoW @ quick response on my lights query, I appreciate it. Gotta get 'em ALL
Quite sure I'll come up with a few more questions related to the huge menu of MINI features, options and packages... this will be one delicious "meal" indeed if I can pull it off in late 2004.
Thanks again for quick response, (my mom used to say "never miss an opportunity to STOP lookin like a dummy!" but then, Mum was ALSO the one who counseled me to always tell policemen the truth... ) She had other little gems too, bless her heart... Does "come here some i can smack you!" ring familiar with anyone?
Long-winded, off-topic, and yet Continuously thankful,
Tatt
Quite sure I'll come up with a few more questions related to the huge menu of MINI features, options and packages... this will be one delicious "meal" indeed if I can pull it off in late 2004.
Thanks again for quick response, (my mom used to say "never miss an opportunity to STOP lookin like a dummy!" but then, Mum was ALSO the one who counseled me to always tell policemen the truth... ) She had other little gems too, bless her heart... Does "come here some i can smack you!" ring familiar with anyone?
Long-winded, off-topic, and yet Continuously thankful,
Tatt
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