First let me say I have done searches here and other forums about this and have not gotten any resolution. I am hoping that someone here may have an idea or have encountered a similar problem.

On July 21st i bought my MINI for a local Honda Dealer with an excellent reputation for servicing used vehicles. I also bought a 3 year extended warranty for the car. In addition i have had 4 BMWs and am familiar with the strengths and weaknesses of them.

My MINI is an '02 MC, 5 speed with 23K on it and inshowrrom condition. When I test drove it the brake light was on and when I picked it up the light was out and they had topped the resevoir.

The next day the light was on again and when I took it back, once again the resevoir was topped off. I also had a check engine light that came on and when I reminded them they had already topped the brake fluid off previously, they sent it to a BMW dealer about a mile away who reset the check engine (fault code was misfire, due to poor gas), and they found nothing with the brakes but again realized that the resevoir was low.

The decision was made to flatbead it to a MINI dealer about 70 miles away (MINI of Towson, MD) and they pressure checked the brakes and found nothing wrong. I was away on vacation for 10 days and so told them to drive it for a few days and when I got it back,the first day the battery went dead and I trickle charged it with a float charger. The battery was an original and the view window was black, indication insufficient charge and a weak battery. The Honda dealership was very apologetic and told me they would look at it at my convenience, so the next day I was in the process of going there but when I started the car the battery check light was on again.

They tested and replaced the battery (sent it to the BMW dealership) and once again they topped fluid and inspected the brakes with no result. By the time the car was shuttled back the 2 miles or so to the Honda dealership the light was back on.

The decision was to again flatbed it to the MINI dealership and it is there now.

So briefly to recap. The car is losing fluid, but no drops pr marks under the car. It passes a pressure test and so must have a low pressure leak and it is getting absorbed somewhere. It is losing just enough fluid to set off the sensor, not a large amount. The brakes feel fine and in the (almost) 4 days that I have had it since July 21st, it has been perfect in every way and I even got 35 mph on the highway trip back from the dealership when I filled it with toptier 92 octane gas.

I love this car and am familiar with BMW vehicles and also with used vehicles that frequently must be tweaked to correct problems. The dealership has provided an '08 loaner and is very responsive and apologetic. Now I know why someone sold a showroom ready car with only 23K, I bet they could not figure out wnat was the fix for the problem with the brakes.

Any ideas?

 

Is the master cylinder (clutch or brake) leaking into the interior of the car. Check the carpet under dash for evidence.

 

Thanks, I called the service advisor at the MINI dealership and they had not looked at that, they were looking for the external problems first.

Hey, if you are right, I will owe you a cigar...

As a matter of fact whoever gives me a lead on the problem will get a premium cigar.

 

It's an 02 with low miles. Has the fluid been changed? Ever? Could it be old fluid that when heated up under use is becoming a gas/vapor and leaking out?

Just thinking out loud.

 

Maybe. If it's never been flushed, it's due anyway. If there aren't any noticeable leaks, it could be leaking back into the booster at the master cylinder.

 

Good thought. I did not hear from them and so I don't think the problem was resolved. I called and left a message about the age of the fluid and whether is had absorbed moisture as you said.

These people are going to love me for all the suggestions I am giving them.

Keep them coming!!

 

yea, they love suggestions

 

You were making a joke weren't you? I guess if the OP had his brakes blazing hot that old fluid would boil. Never heard of brake fluid becoming a gas & leaking out. Nope new one on me. It just boils in the calipers & stays there laughing at your attempts to stop.

I'm thinking kapps has the right idea. It may be his master or more specifically his brake booster. It's possible that the brake fluid is being sucked down the vacuum line & being burned in the engine. That would account for the missing fluid from the leak that no one can find. It also might explain his fault code due to poor gas. Brake fluid & gas isn't a very good mix.

 

Well me being a tech. We dont have too many problems with the brake fluid system. What we do have is the Slave cyl leaking externally. Thats the cyl for the clutch throwout arm. on the 02 its located underneath the battery
box. Bolted to the transmission. See if you can shine a light down there and see if there is any br fluid
trace if not. As some suggested it could be the master leaking internally
into the booster. Since you bought this you have had nothing but issues.
its a safety thing now. Have the honda dealer or the Mini dealer pull back the master cyl/ shine a light into the booster see if there is any brake fluid.
I hope these tows you mention back and forth are not costing you.
if this is going to be a repeat process I would give the Car back. Look for a newee model. The early 2002 were problem childs. Try sticking with a 2004 or later. go on motoringfile.com they give a good breakdown of whats happening with certain yrs.
good luck.

 

I had hope for a cigar You blew my cover.

 

I'm betting kapps wins the stogy.

 

Thanks guys. The way I look at it the Dealer is in for an inch and in for a yard. They have to get this fixed or they will be the ones that throw up their hands and call it quits--I have nothing to lose. I have a loaner car and this was reported on the initial dealer waranty period and so they are contracted to repair it. I also have an extended waranty and so am not overly concerned--it is their rep, not mine.

They know that if they send me out with a car that has a brake problem that thay have major liability, this is all documented.

So thanks for the concern but this car repair has cost them big bucks not me (and this is not internal time but BMW/MINI clock hours) and it is a bit of a challenge for me to get this straightened out before I call them to the table. They are also putting an honest effort forth--in-house mech time, BMW, towing twice and MINI service time twice.

I have a Colorado pickup for everyday and an '89 corvette convertible (that I ma trying to keep lo mileage) for fun. I am not rich but my kids are grown and now it is time for me. I have owned over 30 cars in my life and, although I am disappointed in the showing so far, I want a MINI that runs well.

As for how they take the suggestions; well I will ask them if they checked the things mentioned here and then it is up to them.

And, I should note, I will not drive a car that is showing safety concerns.

Keep the ideas coming--I love this forum. I also have lots of cigars for my Friends, hence the name.

Thanks.

 

I just spoke to the service advisor at MINI. Two(?) gaskets in the master cylinder/booster were loose and so the pressure checks were just making them seal for the check and then they went back. Also two lines in the cylinder/booster area were cracked and deteriorated. She told me the brake fluid is fine and good to go.

The parts are to arrive this am an will be installed today. They want to keep the car and drive it to check it out.

I listened and didn't ask any questions about specifics; I'll do that after the repairs are completed. I am having the key/computer programmed for daytime running lights, doors lock at 10mph & unlock when ignition is off and the lights to stay on for 40 seconds when the turn signal stalk is activated; so I'll talk with her then.

My service manual is with the car and so I am not sure where the gaskets are or what lines. Maybe one of you knows the specifics.

I will wait til the repairs are given the green light before I get excited

Looks like I may owe a couple or so cigars here.

"COSMO"

 

I think thecigarman will fit in real well at MINI on the Dragon. See You There.

 

OK, when is that? I have intended to get there with my harley and never have, as yet. Maybe my first trip will be with Cosmo instead of Rufus...

We newbies need a bit of orientation to the activities and to the board.

 

Well, two nights ago I got my MINI back. The MINI dealership identified the problem as a bad seal on the brake resevoir cap and deteriorated booster hoses. They replaced them and after a week I picked it up. They drove it 60-80 miles and then guys drove it back from Towson to Harrisburg (about another 70 miles or so). No lights, problems, and guaranteed to be right.

My Wife and I took an overnight trip to the Pittsburgh area for her Dad's 84th birthday. For the first 200 miles the car ran like a champ, but I noticed the gas mileage was only about 29-30 on rte 68 across WVA. I had put BMW fuel treatment in and figured that was the reason.
We stopped about 150 miles into the trip (I had put about 50 on the night before and in the am before I picked up my wife) and when I started the car up the "Service Engine Soon" light was on.

Really put a damper on my spirits.

We got there with about a total of 260 miles since the service and I parked it overnight. When I started it the Brake light and DSC lights were on in addition to the engine light.

I had a get-together with the General Manager, Service Manager and Sales manager and they are talking with MINI to see what the chances are that it can be fixed. They gave me a 2003 MCS with 49 K to drive instead of a loaner car after I suggested that unless they could give me some assurance it would be repaired (permanently) that I would rather trade it back in on a different car. They also suggested that they could find me the one I would like from their sources.

The MCS is quite a car and right now I am leaning to it as a solution, but I think I'll wait to see what they come up with and what kind of deal they will give me.

I did tell them about the suggestion that the MINI is aspirating hydrolic fluid and the service manager said that was a very likely possibility.

Tthey all were great to deal with and I couldn't say enough about their efforts; unfortunately the car is still in the shop. I have owned it 31 days and had it a total of 6 nights and 4 partial days and 2 full days...

Gentlemen, as soon as I get this worked out I will ask each of you who posted here and made suggestions to give me your addresses and the type of cigar you would like.

Best,

Cigarman

 

Cosmo is gone. I traded him in for an '03 MCS in Pure Silver with a black roof. Sparky has 49K and looks and runs great (I have had him for 4 days to test drive him).

Rahal treated me well and made me financially whole with the trade. I couldn't be happier.

OK you guys who posted here to help; PM me or e-mail me (redvette at comcast.net -- @ for at and no spaces) your cigar favorites and mailing addresses and I'll treat you for your help.

BTW, the MC is back at MIni of Towson. They were less than complimentary about the suggestions you posted--sour grapes on their part for not diagnosing the problem. Oh well, not mine now...

 

I'd written a nice long post about how it would have been fluid that was getting past seals into the booster and sucked into the engine.... And that was when the servers were acting up and it never showed. Boo hoo hoo!

But that's OK, I don't smoke!

Anyway, I'm glad it's all worked out, and that you're a happy camper..

FWIW, the bad seal on the cap and the deteriorated vacuum booster line wouldn't have lost fluid unless it was running out all over the resevoir and the master cylinder....

Too bad about the hassles though....

Matt

 

I've sent you a PM with my request.

Thanks!!!

 

I'll smoke whatever Crashton is and Thanks Dustin, sending PM next

 

With the holiday and traveling for PSU I have gotten behind in my responsibilities. I did not forget you Gentlemen, I will take care of you

 

I was a tech for 22 years. been out of the business for 16 years now, but about once every couple years we would get a car in with the same type of problem where brake fluid would disappear but there would be no signs of external leak. It was always as you mentioned. Brake fluid was leaking into the booster itself. Its kind of rare but it does happen.

 

Your cigars are on the way, Gentlemen.

Thanks for the advice

Over 1000 miles on the " new to me" '03 MCS and I'm happy as can be.

 

Glad you have a new ride

 

You got one on that grin...