I'm a proud owner of a PW/B MC. I also love the MCS - thinking of giving my wife my MC and getting the MCS next year.

So I have driven both. I have a few friends in the are that own MCS. So we did some testing.

--- These are both stock cars ---

The MC with the CVT in SD mode seems to be faster then the MCS up to about 35-40. From about 40 they are about even but you can see the MCS start to kick in from there. The MCS starts passing me at 45.

So here is my comment. I live in Chicago. For the most part (other then highways), the speed limit is 45 and under. So if staying legal (without going over the speed limit), the cars are equal in speed :smile:

So why am I posting this. I have no idea. I worked 12 hours today and I'm tired :smile:

I think though because I have been seeing a few new MCS owners in this forum picking on the MC as a slow car. And I want future buyers looking at the MCs to know that you are equal if not faster in city driving :smile: Oh, not to mention the MC still hits 120+ with no probelm (been there, done that).

Got to get some sleep now.

Now I'm not bashing the MCS - I would have gotten that for the extra power just because - but my wife couldn't take the tight suspension. Just something I've notice. The stock MC and MCS are both pretty quick cars (if you stay in the speed limit).

 

>>The MC with the CVT in SD mode seems to be faster then the MCS up to about 35-40.

Yeah!!!

The CVT seems to get a bad-rap since it's not a stick.

(I have a MINI Cooper 5-speed)

Good for you to publicize this. Make the CVT owners know
they can pants the MC owners off the line.

 

I have a 1960 vw bus with reductions boxes. I can take anyone off the line and up to 25mph.(which is 3rd gear) but they usually pass me before we get out of the intersection.

sometimes the littlest pleasures make me smile :smile:

 

Heh heh.. my dad did the same thing one time with his old Beatle.. I think it was a Duster he totally blew off the line.... for a wee little bit at least...

Rocketboy_X

 

Yes the MC is faster then the MCS mu hahahaha....off the line that is

 

For general use- all coopers are good, fun and fast enough.
Anything under 45 mph- doesn't really matter much. Mostly you can do more if your skill level is higher.
If you want to pass and reach higher speeds above 50 then the MCS does better but then you have more weight and more cost, lower mpg etc.

So the take home lesson is for most people the MC is fine. CVT is plenty good. Skill counts alot and the higher your skill level the more you can do. Basic driving is fun and the car has a large performance envelope- it is very capable in basic stock form and when upgraded.

_________________
ALOHA

 

Morning :smile:

To be honest (now that I'm awake), the MC and MCS are both very quick cars overall. The MCS is about 1 second faster to 60 (if they can shift) and can hit 100 quicker (about 3 seconds). In the big picture they are so close in speed. It's not like the MC is a Yugo and the MCS is a Vette. The difference is there and noticable but not huge.

My Thinking. The MC is a fast car if you like to do the speed limit and under :smile: You can get the speed limit very fast. The MC is faster off the line up to about 35-40. What I like about the MCS is not the off the line, but from 50 up. Mainly when you are trying to pass someone on the highway when you are doing 60 already and want to set 75 qucik to past. That's where the MCS shines.

I love both of them. Oh, for the record, I'm a stick man but my new wife can't drive stick so I had to get the CVT. I've only had two other automatic cars (out of a dozen), and the CVT kicks ***. It shifts smooth and about as well as I would do.

 

Because the CVT has "infinite" gears - even more than the six in the MCS - it can do a better job of maintaining the engine at its optimum power point during hard acceleration. It will also "shift" quicker than almost any person.

The Manager at MINI Peabody drives a CVT, and comments that it is just as much fun as the MCS.

 

We've got an MCS because excess is our nature


OK, that was a rambling post, excuse me.

_________________
She let's me drive her MCS (which is good, cause I gave it to her as a wedding present)!!!

Our Baby? - she's an 03 Elect Blue (white roof/wheels) MCS, w/ all the toys (premium, cold, h/k, Nav, xenon, fogs etc) !

 

Thanks for the report and for doing this "research." I drive in normal traffic and do few highway miles...my MC has always exceeded my expectations regardless of the traffic situation and consistently succeeded in producing plenty of thrills for me and my passengers. This car gives me a very serious case of the grins!!!!!!!

_________________
'03 IB/W Cooper

 

In my opinion, shifting is highly overrated. Here's why.
Your MC or MCS doesn't need that many gear shifts to do well.
For the manual transmissions- 1st gear is to get started and 2nd will take you anywhere from 15 to 50 mph. This is really marked when you are teaching someone how to drive stick. Just teach them 1st and second, maybe reverse or third in theory and they are fine for most driving.
3rd will take you from 30 up to 70+ mph just fine. This is all because the cooper engine is great at high revs. 3500 to 6500 rpms is fun city.

So when you are driving around town stay in 2nd and do third if you must. Entering the freeways? 3rd is great. See if you can redline it.

Try it with the MC, the MCS and with the CVT- doesn't really matter- all are fun.

 

>>I have a 1960 vw bus with reductions boxes. I can take anyone off the line and up to 25mph.(which is 3rd gear) but they usually pass me before we get out of the intersection.
>>
>>sometimes the littlest pleasures make me smile :smile:
:smile: :smile: :smile: Oh the memories!!!

 

The CVT in SD mode is a whole different car. We got a CVT so my girlfriend could drive it. The MC with a CVT is probably a better car for city driving with traffic lights and lower speed limits. I've heard many people suggest the CVT is the best version to autocross for the reason that it is quicker off the line (and you can concentrate on steering).

Of course, my MINI would be a JCW MCS since I prefer a stick.

James

 

Of course the MINI CVT is faster off the line...its computer controlled shifting and can find the best target speed and gear ration as soon as you press the pedal.

 

The MC is a very quick little car. Not so much by modern standards where we're all drunk and spoiled on insane power carts, but when you stack it up against what would have to be considered very desirable sportsters at their time and still today -- a first generation 944 wasn't going to break out of the 8s stock, only the RX-7 GSL-SE in the 80s could break into the 7s, a first generation Miata was slower and against a 2nd generation it would still be a good fight. That's not bad company.

Cooper enthusiasts recognize something that is lost on most new car consumers -- perspective.

 

I agree that the average driver won't be able to tell the difference in power between the Cooper and the S in a city driving environment.

Once that tach passes 3500rpm, the differences are obvious. However, I would guess that many people don't drive their MINI's at or above 6/10's at any given time, making the Cooper S a virtually moot-point.

$0.02,
Ryan

 

All I can say is... put both in the twisties without long straights and they perform EXACTLY the same (drivers being equal). Put them both on an autocross track and they'll turn similar times... it's in the straights that the MCS really shines.

I've found that I can carry a bit more speed into a corner in my MC than in an MCS, and that I can get on the throttle sooner in the MC and exit the corner slightly faster as well because I don't have to deal with wheelspin as much. Driving an MC and an MCS down the same road, back-to-back, was an eye opening experience for me... the MCS was faster in the straights, but felt slightly slower in the corners (especially exits, where I had to be careful on some corners to keep it hooked up), whereas the MC was faster through the corners and couldn't quite keep up on the straights (but it was close). The MC seems more forgiving, too, as there's no boost to contend with - where if the S/C spools up at the wrong time can unsettle the car in a corner, especially on the exits if there's any oddities in the road surface...

IMHO, the MC makes a more balanced track car for tight tracks with lots of corners... the MCS is better for tracks with long straights... both are a riot to drive around town or at speed on a track of any kind, however. All I can say is that from the club run I have led up a twisty road, the MCS' had as much trouble keeping up with my MC as the MC's (and one non-stock Ford Mustang GT). The driver makes a difference, obviously, but the MC and MCS are both spirited cars, capable of far more than most people will ever know.

In a drag race, it should be obvious... unless the MCS driver can't shift or keep it hooked up... heh.

 

CVT oWnZ j00!!!!!

 

>>All I can say is... put both in the twisties without long straights and they perform EXACTLY the same (drivers being equal). Put them both on an autocross track and they'll turn similar times... it's in the straights that the MCS really shines.
>>
>>I've found that I can carry a bit more speed into a corner in my MC than in an MCS, and that I can get on the throttle sooner in the MC and exit the corner slightly faster as well because I don't have to deal with wheelspin as much. Driving an MC and an MCS down the same road, back-to-back, was an eye opening experience for me... the MCS was faster in the straights, but felt slightly slower in the corners (especially exits, where I had to be careful on some corners to keep it hooked up), whereas the MC was faster through the corners and couldn't quite keep up on the straights (but it was close). The MC seems more forgiving, too, as there's no boost to contend with - where if the S/C spools up at the wrong time can unsettle the car in a corner, especially on the exits if there's any oddities in the road surface...
>>
>>IMHO, the MC makes a more balanced track car for tight tracks with lots of corners... the MCS is better for tracks with long straights... both are a riot to drive around town or at speed on a track of any kind, however. All I can say is that from the club run I have led up a twisty road, the MCS' had as much trouble keeping up with my MC as the MC's (and one non-stock Ford Mustang GT). The driver makes a difference, obviously, but the MC and MCS are both spirited cars, capable of far more than most people will ever know.
>>
>>In a drag race, it should be obvious... unless the MCS driver can't shift or keep it hooked up... heh.


I think this assessment is dead on. Before you buy MCS- read this!!!

_________________
ALOHA

 

As many have hinted at in the thread, the word "faster" has many meanings. The MCS is faster (with equally skilled drivers), very much the same as a BMW Z3 2.8 is faster than a Z3 2.3. Yes, on the right track, with equal tires and suspension, the MC could keep up with, and even beat the slightly heavier MCS... Just like a I have seen Z3 2.3s whoop Z3 2.8s on a tight autocross track. The MC is certainly no slouch and is a great performer, but in day-to-day driving the MCS is clearly faster.

As for this statememt
>>The MC with the CVT in SD mode seems to be faster then the MCS up to about 35-40.
and any statements about the Cooper being faster in city driving...
Gimme a break. I've driven both and I'm sure any stock MCS would take any stock MC from 0-40. Probalby the biggest problem is getting a good launch with just the right amount of wheel-spin. Bad driver = poor launch and maybe a CVT would kick his butt.
_________________
[img]albums/album25/ama.gif[/img]VinceAndJessica.com
Alta pulley, Stebro exhaust, Pipercross intake, Progress rear anti-sway bar.

 

>>As for this statememt
>>>>The MC with the CVT in SD mode seems to be faster then the MCS up to about 35-40.
>>and any statements about the Cooper being faster in city driving. Gimme a break.

Ahhhh, now comes the part I like:

An MCS owner telling everyone that they are wrong about the MCS being slower.

Fun fun. :smile:

 

For the recorded I don't think the MCS is slower then the MC. Just up to 35 MPH. I have read hundreds of threads here and without a doubt there are some guides on how to drive a MCS correctly in order to get a better take off from a dead stop. For the most part though, the average driver of an MCS doesn't know these tips (and in same cases just not good at doing them). Of course the members here are Mini Lovers and read everything - we are so smart here :smile: And not the average car owner.

I have also have read enought that most MCS owners know the MC is faster off the line, but 34-40 up the the MCS starts moving real nice.

My point on this thread was just to point out for the new (and mabye old) MCS owners that have been posting things like "the MC is slow". I think they need to look at the whole picture. In City Drivng and staying under the speed limit, my MC can either be ahead of them or with them.

I think I posted this too, because I was tired and cranky at what I was reading -long day, long week - anyone with a job and a bad ex-wife can understand :smile:

OH, and the other reason is I don't want people who want to buy an MC get pushed into and MCS if they don't need it.

 

I drove both with spirit when I was looking at them, and decided on the MC as my platform. Just kept thinking that for autocross, which is what I planned on doing the most of besides daily driving, the MC was a better match for me... I'm not going to say the MCS isn't good for that because it is, especially on courses with longer straights.

Both have their place... I just didn't really want to spend the extra $ on the MCS at the time, and I couldn't be happier with my choice.

Doesn't seem like anyone argues about MCS v. MC anywhere else but on MINI-related boards. Hah! Actually, whenever EITHER shows up at local SCCA events, everyone says 'CRAP, here comes ANOTHER MINI'. Mwahahahaha... gotta love that! We're driving the Corvette owners nuts in Solo II, ya know.

 

>>Don't go around picking fights, you never know who is better than yourself (until it's too late)... and remember there is ALWAYS someone better than yourself

I dont think there was anyone better then bruce lee! he could pick a fight with anyone!

 

>>>>Don't go around picking fights, you never know who is better than yourself (until it's too late)... and remember there is ALWAYS someone better than yourself
>>
>>I dont think there was anyone better then bruce lee! he could pick a fight with anyone!
>>


Do you think it was always that way???

There is ALWAYS someone better...