R50/53 MC Is Faster Then MCS ???
6th Gear
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,265
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Hey, Kev...You're right about those curves. And also the straight-aways. The MCS did great at 80 on the Turnpike. Both did well on the twisties. My Saturn had a tough time with all of it!
I got a couple of great newlywed pictures for you. I'll try to post them this weekend, or perhaps just send you copies.
p.s. my MCS is at the port waiting for a ride next Friday on the JINGU MARU!
I got a couple of great newlywed pictures for you. I'll try to post them this weekend, or perhaps just send you copies.
p.s. my MCS is at the port waiting for a ride next Friday on the JINGU MARU!
3rd Gear
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 163
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From: Riverton,UT
While I love both cars, I like my MC better and it an beat a MCS in the 1/4 mile if you've souped up the MC and the MCS is stock. Freaked the guy out! We may never beat it in the tuner dept but we can make them go FAST! Yes, be careful MCS owners, there are a few hot MCs out there 
1st Gear
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 44
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From: wooster, ohio
GRASSROOTS MOTOR SPORTS magazine did some comparison testing last year, when both models came out, and came up with similar results. The initial speed advantage for the MC seemed to be based on the fact that it was lighter than the MCS. At any rate, they're both great cars!
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`02 MC, Chili Red/Black :smile:
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`02 MC, Chili Red/Black :smile:
4th Gear
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 318
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From: Eastern, PA
>>I got a couple of great newlywed pictures for you. I'll try to post them this weekend, or perhaps just send you copies.
>>
>>p.s. my MCS is at the port waiting for a ride next Friday on the JINGU MARU!
COOL, thanks and COOL :smile:
Okay, I have an 'S', (although it is green, not yellow, but I haven't changed my username....) Just so you know if I'm biased.
anyway, if you look at national - level autocross results, the S is faster, if only marginally. Since most autocrosses are 1st and 2nd gear, that seems to indicate that the 'S' is a bit faster even in the slow stuff.
Having said that, I think the MC is MUCH better looking than the 'S', and I suspect that 100,000 miles from now, the MC owners will have fewer problems.
So I can definitely see the reasons to buy a MC over an S.
anyway, if you look at national - level autocross results, the S is faster, if only marginally. Since most autocrosses are 1st and 2nd gear, that seems to indicate that the 'S' is a bit faster even in the slow stuff.
Having said that, I think the MC is MUCH better looking than the 'S', and I suspect that 100,000 miles from now, the MC owners will have fewer problems.
So I can definitely see the reasons to buy a MC over an S.
4th Gear
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 352
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From: Charlotte, NC
>>Having said that, I think the MC is MUCH better looking than the 'S', and I suspect that 100,000 miles from now, the MC owners will have fewer problems.
>>So I can definitely see the reasons to buy a MC over an S.
>>
I hear this a lot. I think it's a matter of time before MINI offers the same front end on the MCS.
>>So I can definitely see the reasons to buy a MC over an S.
>>
I hear this a lot. I think it's a matter of time before MINI offers the same front end on the MCS.
6th Gear
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,444
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>>
>>Having said that, I think the MC is MUCH better looking than the 'S', and I suspect that 100,000 miles from now, the MC owners will have fewer problems.
>>So I can definitely see the reasons to buy a MC over an S.
>>
I agree! They are both great cars. One is not "better" than the other. But ToeKnee may not have read the results of many road tests on these cars. Please, can't we stop picking fights?
Regards,
Red
Banned
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 7,756
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I highly recommend driving the Cooper CVT in "Sport Mode" while on the highway or Intersate...is simply AWESOME! Today I drove 60 miles up I-95 in Sport Mode and the car simply FLIES...total effortless acceleration and the CVT programming keeps the RPM's high at 3K and above putting all that midrange power right at your foot.
You have to drive @70 to 90MPH in the highway in Sport Mode to fully understand what I am saying.
Having said this, I am looking forward to my new '04 MCS in October!
You have to drive @70 to 90MPH in the highway in Sport Mode to fully understand what I am saying.
Having said this, I am looking forward to my new '04 MCS in October!
Thread Starter
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3rd Gear
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 243
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Hey Red,
This wasn't trying to pick a fight. No where in my subject was to pick a fight, just point out what I noticed driving both. Also to put on the table that the MC isn't that much slower then the MCS because some MCS owners have been calling the MC slow. In the big picture they are both slow compared to a vette. This wasn't my point.
I even started it off that I'm getting and MCS next year and my wife well take the MC. I love the MCS.
This wasn't trying to pick a fight. No where in my subject was to pick a fight, just point out what I noticed driving both. Also to put on the table that the MC isn't that much slower then the MCS because some MCS owners have been calling the MC slow. In the big picture they are both slow compared to a vette. This wasn't my point.
I even started it off that I'm getting and MCS next year and my wife well take the MC. I love the MCS.
4th Gear
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 434
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I have a friend that has a modded MC and I hate to say this, but his MC kicks MY MCS *** from the start. I'm sure it is as fast or faster 0 to 60. He doesn't have the sunroof, I do, so his MC is well over 200 lbs lighter....it definitely out performs my MCS through the corners & coming out because of the weight advantage. Once we hit the freeway at 50 to 90, then the supercharger helps me pull away, but not as much as you I would have thought. The other thing I noticed driving through the hills & curves around Phoenix with his MC requires more shifting with the 5 speed to keep the rpms up....again hate to say this, but with more shifting, felt more of a fun drive...ouch ! Straight away on the expressway and for passing, my MCS still had the edge.
BTW...his mods were a ECU chip mod, air intake and exhaust....my only mod has been lighter 16" alloys and yoko tires. After driving his MC, went to the dealer and test drove the new works...got to say I was disappointed, slightly faster than the MCS, but certainly not for $5K plus....his MC mods of slightly over $1K seems now like a real bargain...if I had it to do over, I'd take a real serious look at the MC since I drive mostly in town & do prefer the more classic look especially without the hood scoop....but still both cars are great and fun to drive...matter of personel preference...
BTW...his mods were a ECU chip mod, air intake and exhaust....my only mod has been lighter 16" alloys and yoko tires. After driving his MC, went to the dealer and test drove the new works...got to say I was disappointed, slightly faster than the MCS, but certainly not for $5K plus....his MC mods of slightly over $1K seems now like a real bargain...if I had it to do over, I'd take a real serious look at the MC since I drive mostly in town & do prefer the more classic look especially without the hood scoop....but still both cars are great and fun to drive...matter of personel preference...
4th Gear
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 477
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From: So Cal
Man you guys are making feel bad! I didn't even think to test drive the MC when I went to check out the MCS. Since my first choice car was the Infinti G35 coupe with monster 280 hp I was surprised that the MCS was so great and made me so happy. Didn't think there was any way the MC could. Now I wonder!!! What have I done? LOL! Better not go there... just be happy with my MCS when it gets here and leave it at that. 
4th Gear
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 434
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Interesting....what intake, exhaust and ECU is he running?
He had the work done in San Diego, he drove there from Phoenix, not sure what exactly, but company named Diamond Racking did the work, he said he spent around $1200 for the mods....the exhaust was a little loud for my tastes, but certainly gave the MC more of a growl, laugh !
He had the work done in San Diego, he drove there from Phoenix, not sure what exactly, but company named Diamond Racking did the work, he said he spent around $1200 for the mods....the exhaust was a little loud for my tastes, but certainly gave the MC more of a growl, laugh !
4th Gear
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 434
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Man you guys are making feel bad! I didn't even think to test drive the MC when I went to check out the MCS. Since my first choice car was the Infinti G35 coupe with monster 280 hp I was surprised that the MCS was so great and made me so happy. Didn't think there was any way the MC could. Now I wonder!!! What have I done? LOL! Better not go there... just be happy with my MCS when it gets here and leave it at that
Cat....I just drove the new RX8 last week, terrifice performance, handling that is very close to the MINI's and at 28K.......well I'm really confused now about my "let's motor days"....lol !
So many cars.....so little time....
Cat....I just drove the new RX8 last week, terrifice performance, handling that is very close to the MINI's and at 28K.......well I'm really confused now about my "let's motor days"....lol !
So many cars.....so little time....
4th Gear
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 477
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From: So Cal
Here's an excerpt from another board, G35driver, about the MC vs. MCS in AutoCross. Thought it would a good last word (one hopes, anyway) on the debate!
While this is a side track, one thing that is for sure in GS is that the Cooper S is not dominating at the national level. It has only won 1 Pro Solo and no Tour events. It is definitely not making Celica, Impreza, A4 or Neon drivers thinking about switching. It is also certain by the classing that no individual on the SEB(Solo Exectutive Board) thinks the Cooper S has any chance of keeping up with a G35 driven by a good driver. The Cooper S was in fact moved down from DS because it wasn't competitive and there's no question to its position in GS. The regular Cooper on the other hand is dominating HS. In fact, so much so that the 00' and 01' National Champ, Gerry Terranova, in his Civic Si, was beat by 3 seconds at each a Tour and a Pro event at the beginning of the year. Mark Chiles driving his base Cooper has beaten EVERY Cooper S that has been at the same event. Gerry is now so convinced that he can't keep up with the Minis that he changed to STS. A lot of people have the opinion if the Cooper is that good, the S much be that much better. The problem with this is that the S has almost all its additional 150 lbs extra weight over the base car in its front end. It doesn't turn or transition as well as its lower powered sibling. Only power courses are where the S has an advantage.
As an FYI, I have been autocrossing with the SCCA regularly for the last 3 years and I am a member of the Equipe Rapide board. I just did an SCCA event today. I regularly send proposals or rule revisions to the SEB and believe it or not, about half go through(my name has been in Fastracks bulletins a couple of times). If anyone ever has some rule questions, I would be happy to answer them.
As an FYI, I have been autocrossing with the SCCA regularly for the last 3 years and I am a member of the Equipe Rapide board. I just did an SCCA event today. I regularly send proposals or rule revisions to the SEB and believe it or not, about half go through(my name has been in Fastracks bulletins a couple of times). If anyone ever has some rule questions, I would be happy to answer them.
6th Gear
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,567
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From: A Van Down by the River
>>I have read hundreds of threads here and without a doubt there are some guides on how to drive a MCS correctly in order to get a better take off from a dead stop. For the most part though, the average driver of an MCS doesn't know these tips >>
HEY!! I need these tips!! I am a newbie at the whole manual shifting, but knew from the very beginning that the S was for me and convinced myself that I could "learn". But I truly know nothing about the ins and outs of proper shifting and even LESS about appropriately handling the MCS. Any tips to a smooth transition from automatic to manual?
HEY!! I need these tips!! I am a newbie at the whole manual shifting, but knew from the very beginning that the S was for me and convinced myself that I could "learn". But I truly know nothing about the ins and outs of proper shifting and even LESS about appropriately handling the MCS. Any tips to a smooth transition from automatic to manual?
6th Gear
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 1,422
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From: Lockport, NY, USA
Drive them both, see for yourself... when me and my wife went for a test drive, I drove the MCS first, and the MC second, and I couldn't wait to turn around to drop off the MC.. sure, i'm willing to believe that there are cases when a MC is faster than an MCS... but there are also cases where an MCS is faster than a Dodge Viper, and although it's sweet braging rights, in no way do I think that my Mach Four is better and faster than a Dodge Viper...
Rocketboy_X
Rocketboy_X
4th Gear
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 477
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From: So Cal
>>>>I have read hundreds of threads here and without a doubt there are some guides on how to drive a MCS correctly in order to get a better take off from a dead stop. For the most part though, the average driver of an MCS doesn't know these tips >>
>>
>>HEY!! I need these tips!! I am a newbie at the whole manual shifting, but knew from the very beginning that the S was for me and convinced myself that I could "learn". But I truly know nothing about the ins and outs of proper shifting and even LESS about appropriately handling the MCS. Any tips to a smooth transition from automatic to manual?
>>
Greetings, fellow EB/Whiter! :smile: I'm an experienced manual driver and I STILL want tips as to how to best drive this car! Rather than hijack the thread though, you may be interested in this thread. It's confusing and enlightening both LOL! In a nutshell, you want to shift at the proper power band (RPM) so you always have maximum torque for your needs. The MINI is highly forgiving in this sense, unlike most cars, because it has smooth power at a wide range of RPMs from 2nd gear on up. First gear is the only touchy one.
perf mods: how fast was I going?
>>
>>HEY!! I need these tips!! I am a newbie at the whole manual shifting, but knew from the very beginning that the S was for me and convinced myself that I could "learn". But I truly know nothing about the ins and outs of proper shifting and even LESS about appropriately handling the MCS. Any tips to a smooth transition from automatic to manual?
>>
Greetings, fellow EB/Whiter! :smile: I'm an experienced manual driver and I STILL want tips as to how to best drive this car! Rather than hijack the thread though, you may be interested in this thread. It's confusing and enlightening both LOL! In a nutshell, you want to shift at the proper power band (RPM) so you always have maximum torque for your needs. The MINI is highly forgiving in this sense, unlike most cars, because it has smooth power at a wide range of RPMs from 2nd gear on up. First gear is the only touchy one.
perf mods: how fast was I going?
5th Gear
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 781
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Pinch me, I'm dreaming. I've never seen a thread of this nature last so long w/out the usual bashing and trashing. A balanced and unbiased discussion of the performance of the Cooper and the S is almost unheard of here. Could it be that some of the Fast & Furious wannabes have left the forum? At any rate, it's very refreshing to hear about folks experiences, expecially those who have head to head comparisons where handling and performance are concerned. Some very valuable info has been shared: track performance, weight distribution, spool-up, CVT RPM range. Great stuff, and highly appreciated. Makes it seem like we're all in this together, kind of family-like. :smile:
4th Gear
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 477
Likes: 0
From: So Cal
>>Pinch me, I'm dreaming. I've never seen a thread of this nature last so long w/out the usual bashing and trashing. A balanced and unbiased discussion of the performance of the Cooper and the S is almost unheard of here. Could it be that some of the Fast & Furious wannabes have left the forum? At any rate, it's very refreshing to hear about folks experiences, expecially those who have head to head comparisons where handling and performance are concerned. Some very valuable info has been shared: track performance, weight distribution, spool-up, CVT RPM range. Great stuff, and highly appreciated. Makes it seem like we're all in this together, kind of family-like. :smile:
Pinch!
:smile:
Pinch!
:smile:
