I keep hearing how people say more than 300whp and a FWD car is undrivable. I was wondering the reasoning behind this. I know there's people who thing you don't need any more than that. That's not the people I want to hear from. I'd like to hear from those who think 200whp+ would not be controllable on the street as a daily driver. I'm not here to argue points, but to try to understand your reasoning.

*Note: please note the HP figures are in WHP not BHP which most cars are advertised at.

 

Whoops, misunderstood.

The only reason 200+ HP on a FWD car would be undrivable is if the driver can't handle it, or doesn't know how to compensate. 200+ HP on a car that has 5' wide front tires would be difficult, but not undrivable...

 

It would be an overstatement to say it's 'undriveable'. The issue with high HP FWD is that you're asking one set of wheels to both channel 200HP to the ground and steer (and brake.) That's a lot to ask.
That said, there are 200HP MINIs out there, and lots of Hondas. You only get the 200HP way up in the rev range, so you get to choose when you harness those horses.

 

Go back with me to 1966 and the Olds Toronado. 425 ci V8 with 370 - 380 hp. The owner of the gas station where I worked had one. I don't remember it being undrivable. I'd not want to put 400+hp through the MINI gear box on a regular basis, but I know of nothing magic about 200 hp and front wheel drive. The pieces have to be stout enough to handle the torque.

 

we have put over 400 WHP through the tranny with LSD...with slicks...so far so good...you will loose an axel before you loose the tranny from what we have seen so far...gettrag goooood!

 

Never heard anybody say that...maybe you're hanging out with the wrong crowd

 

YUP YUP !

I have 200whp and its actually starting to feel rather run of the mill, not hardly undrivable in any way, it only goes as fast as you push the long pedal.

 

That's good info. As tuners continue to up the power, the weak pieces will make themselves known. Undrivable, no. Stuff break, could happen.

 

Since I am running on 175/65-15 snows, I agree. Wheelspin is fun but controllable.

 

Just go down to the Dodge store and test drive an SRT-4 to see for yourself how "undrivable" it is. 230hp/250 lb-ft and front-drive is perfectly manageable with modern street tires, though not necessarily any faster than with less power. 355hp/365 lb-ft from the top dealer-installed and fully warranted Mopar "Stage 3" kit too: http://www.mopar.com/street/products_srt4_stage3.htm

 

i really wanna do that, just for the heck of it

 

if the map was a sudden spool it would be hard to control especially
coming out of a turn or from a standstill.

 

if you can modulate the acclerator, you should have zero problems driving a 200 hp fwd car!

 

I agree with this completely....... I think my Mini is very easy to drive and modulates well.......not peaky and no surprises.......it was wierd the other day putting the pedal to the metal on a Boxster S and feel the rear wheels break.......(I kind of liked it )

 

i had a nitrous kit on my 98 prelude...had to aim then fire. blew away
vettes. bye bye v8. (well, it was an older one with an anus driver).

 

If you gas it, the weight transfer it to the rear wheels. that's why rear drivers will do better 1/4 mile times than a front driver. But undrivable, that's just BS. The guy that told you that is speaking out his a$$. He's just quoting stuff that he doesn't understand to sound like a wise person, and comes off as a smart-***!

Matt

 

I agree that it's totally driveable. HOWEVER...it does spin on the factory performance run-flats tires and the winter X-ice (haven't tried R compounds yet) from a stand still....you need to get a little roll going. And it will spin the winter tires in 1,2,3rd gear if you push it. The only problem with it is a little torque steer (spelling? ) when changing gears but that is something you can easily learn to accept and expect.

 

yah, torque steer is one thing I don't like about FF's. otherwise very fun
to drive. on FR you get a slight wiggle sometimes at full launch with
light tire spin. some people don't like that.

 

yeah, i get the same pleasure on daily basis against Hondas, Acuras, and some Bimmers, VWs

 

hmmm, hey Dom who was it who said that again?

 

I remember it being said here on NAM (or was it Mini2) in a thread (which I think got deleted due to it's unruly nature) about super high HP MINIs, and then there was one definately posted on motoringfile.com (I think it was in regards to a special version of the JCW kit rumored to have 225+ hp).

 

I would have to say that I don't think that 200HP in a FWD car is "undriveable" considering that most of the Japanese "sporty" cars are making better than that as is.

I think a better statement would be that a 300hp or better FWD car starts to test the limits of useability. I mean, how many twincharged Minis do you know of kicking *** at autocross? With that much power, traction becomes a problem. Hell, ask the SRT-4 crowd what their cars would be like with over 300whp, without an LSD.

It wouldn't be pretty.

Which is why for me, if a car has more than 300whp, it's gotta be AWD or RD. Why waste power?

 

Quoting HP without regard to car weight etc is rather pointless. Look at the reference to the Olds Toranado above. Sure the thing was a tank, but a very powerful front drive one. With that big fat iron V8 sitting on top of the tires, it could use a whole lot more of the torque before things got squirly....

So blanket comments are ususally pretty much useless.

Matt

 

Can you expound on this statement? I'd like to learn how useability is affected by having 300+ hp in a FWD car like the MINI.

 

Since I was speaking more for modern cars than for old cars that weigh more than 4000 lbs, I think my statement was fine as is. I took from the initial statement that we were speaking of modern cars in general, not ALL cars. I daresay a high HP Olds Toronado would be easier to drive than a high HP SRT-4, would you agree?