OK, after much deliberation I've decided on the light wt rim. The forged Montegi Trak lite. in flat black. Now here is the dilema....

15X6.5 4x100+35mm 10 lbs each with Falken Azenis 205/50/15 or

17x 7 4X100+42mm 14 lbs each with either Yoko ES 100 215/40/17 or Toyo Proxi T1s 215/40/17 or other tires?

Here is the application and use of my ride....I have an '02 Cooper S. It is a "fair weather" car and only has ~9500 miles. I want to get rid of the "run-bricks" and heavy S- lite rims and replace them with lightwt rims and sticky tires. Most miles are spent in the suburbs. I do participate in ~ 6 AutoXs / yr. and am not interested in having a dedicated "race set up" wheels/tires. I DO not drive in the ice or snow and enjoy spirited driving, a majority of which is in dry conditions, but I might drive in the rainy conditions as well.

I really like the look of the 17" but I would love to have the Azenis. Can I reach a compromise?

Help me make a decision...PLZ and list your thoughts on Advantages/ disavantages of each set up.

Thanks!!!

 

You could go with the 17 X 7 wheel and Azenis 225/45/17. There is a slight rubbing issue on the rear tires, but nothing major. The Azenis - in my humble opinion (and the majority of people who autocross) is the tire of choice.

 

15 inch wheels on an S.....in an autox! Man, I'd be scared of you

 

How much of a rub? Just under large lateral Gs or with a load, i.e. wife and kids? Would the rub be "Fixable by Dremel" on the plastic or are we talking metal trimming? Would the rub w/ those tires be worse if/when I get lowering springs?

Thanks for any and all suggestions.

 

I think your 15 setup with +35mm offset will make the tire stick out of the fender well...and cause it to rub if your car's lowered.

Azenis are wide bold shouldered tires which are usually 20mm+ wider
than normal perf tires.

 

really? you think that would rub?....how bout without lowering?

I've read that the lowering springs are primarily for looks and add very little to handling...is that your understanding...

Thanks for the input.

Just when i was leaning towards the 15s for the cost, weight reduction, smaller rolling diameter ( gear ratio change), and lust for the Falken Azenis

....what about what ive read about not using 40 sidewall due to Load rating with the 17s??

Thanks for the input....

 

You’ve asked two completely different questions stating racing is not your main goal, but a fun aspect of driving a few times a year.

I’d say the best compromise would be the 17’s with the Yoko 215-45/17’s. Living in Florida, much of my year is dry, but rain can be a problem time to time and very heavy in only moments. I have used these tires and they give great traction and reliability in the rain. At the same time running auto-x only at the local level I have found cars with the other tires not any faster than I am, unlike the other racing cut treads that you may find rather slippery in the wet for day to day driving. You have to ask yourself what the true driving is you will do over an entire year, not just six days that is no more than 1 hour total driving time for the year of auto-x.

You can be competitive and have a great year round tire with the Yoko ES100’s and the 17’s.

 

Not too much of a rub. Mostly when loaded - wife and kids - and hitting a large bump or dip. For instance, if I am alone in the car and slowly go over a parking lot speed bump, no rub. I have used a dremel on the inner fender skirt, now it just rubs on the very inside edge of the wheel arch. In my opinion it's so minor I'll just let the tire file the wheel arch down 'til it doesn't rub anymore. I would think lowering the vehicle would cause it to rub more.

 

What about the 17's with Kumho MX's? I'd agree that the Falken's are AWESOME except when you build up a lot of heat in them.

I would get the T1-S's before those ES100's as they are GREAT non-snow street tires.

Only reason I'd go with the MX's is I'm pretty sure they come in 215/40/17 (I have a set in my bedroom on Kosei's). You won't get the rubbing issues like with the Falkens because those Azenis's are more like 230+ width tires. The Falkens are really good/cheap tires but if you get some wear on them they have less than stellar rain performance (read I tried a set on my car in the rain after driving on T1-S's and spun way sooner than I would have thought). The MX's are a bit more expensive but the 215/40's should be lighter than the Falken's.

T1-S v Kumho MX I'd go with the Kumho's without a doubt based more on price. I personally like both tires for So Cal weather but the Kumho's are just a bargain. Money no object get the Toyos. They are an AWESOME tire and very light.

 

Thank for the suggestions....Sounds like my "lust" over the Falken Azenis has to go by the wayside as there are more practical performance tires out there.

I guess I have to decide the look of the 17s vs the performance "gains" of the 15s. Are these gains for real?

Here is a list that I've come up with.

[font=Abadi MT Condensed Light]Advantages: 17" wheel
Able to upgrade to big brakes
Looks better
wider tire

Disadvantages: 17" wheel
Weight heavier…decreased handling? is it noticable?
Cost more and tires more expensive

Advantages 15"wheel
Cost less
Improved Gear ratio, i.e. smaller diameter tire…= better acceleration
Weight less…..less wt= improved handling

Disadvantages 15"
Looks are poorer, IMO
Speedo off
[/font]
I have a buddy who was telling me that the smaller ~ 2" in decreased circumference of the 205/50/15 combined with the lighter weight of the 15s made a noticable performance change for the better over the 215/40-45/17.

Thanks again for all the help! Feel free to chime in.

 

Personally, if I were going with the 17's, I'd only get one tire - the Kumho MX in either 215/40 or 215/45, and I'd prolly go with the 215/45... I know plenty of guys that run these at our autocrosses and on the street and track and love them. While I don't think they have quite as much stick as the Azenis (personal opinion), they are darn close! Besides that, the prices on the MX's are pretty wallet friendly for what you get in the 17" category! Performance on wet surfaces is pretty impressive, too...

That being said, my track/autocross tires are 15's and they are Azenis... talk about waking the car up! The smaller diameter is excellent for squrting you right outta corners... If you ever decide that you want to get into autocross seriously, I'd suggest picking up a cheap set of 15" rims and going with 205/50R15 Azenis... that's what I did, and I can now save my ES100's for the street... Or, some people are running 16" rims and the 215/45R16 Azenis for a bit more width and grip...

My prior set of ES100's did very well for autocross, though, especially in the wet. I only ended up getting 10k miles, 4 autocrosses, and 1 track day out of them, though, and they were toast. But, I'd expect that you'll only get about that much out of any good performance tire - even the MX's.

 

ive ran bridgestone re750 for awhile now...

they have performed very well in autox and street operation, comes in the 215/45-17 size and in the wet they are real good as well....

i'd choose 17, simply for looks, and the wider choice for performance rubber

 

i say go with the 17's since they are pretty light, and use the T1S.

 

The biggest problem with the T1S that I have seen is that they chunk... Those thin shoulder lugs just get eaten up at autocrosses or at track days... Other than that, they're a fine tire (but way more expensive than the Kumho MX)...

I still vote Kumho MX...

 

Thanks everyone for the suggestions....

So to sum it up im hearing more votes for the 17s and to go with the Kuhmo Mxs.....Looks and performance..

Does anyone have any other thoughts on the handling advantages of the 15s?...I've only had a "sprinkling" of comments on that one...

Do the 15s bring "real" world results or are the results so negligable that the Looks of the 17s far out weights the handling aspects of the 15s??? .

Thanks again!

 

I don't think the 15's offer any other advantages than lower weight, being cheaper, and providing a gear reduction... The 17's may handle better, depending on the width and weight of the wheels and tires, and maybe not... my 205/50R15 Azenis are have razor sharp turn in, though because the sidewalls are sooooooooo freakin' stiff... I still love driving on them. The performance gap between the Azenis and the ES100's is like the difference between the ES100's and the factory Goodyear runflats...

 

I've had Centerline PRM rims with 215/40-17 Bridgestone SO3 and couldn't be happier with them on the track or street. I just replaced the tires again with same size.

After months of going back & forth between 15 or 16" I just bought 15 X 7 SSR rims with AVON Tech R 225/45-15 for track- can't comment on differences yet- Track day on 10/30- can't wait.

 

Well here is the end result. Thought I would post some pictures. Montegi Trak Lites, forged, 14# a piece in gunmetal. Deliciously wrapped in Yokahama ES100s in 215/40/17.

 

TwOMINIs,

Looks pretty darn good to me.
Take them out and burn rubber!

While Falken Azenis Sport make for a good autocross tire they are not as good as the ES100 for general use street driving (comfort, smoothness, noise, wet and dry traction). One tire cannot do all jobs so some compromise needs to be made.

I have about 10,000 miles on my 215/45-17 ES100s after a few track sessions, a driving school event and about three autocross meetings. They are still going strong but wearing a bit.