I just removed my stock bumper mounted fog/driving lights for some brake ducts. Has anyone used the wiring for these lights for grill-mounted driving lights?

 

My initial thought on this is that this would NOT work, simply because I know that the OEM lights have some kind of logic that informs the car that they're on (controls the dinging if you leave them on with the ignition off). Whether or not you can simply splice in new lights to that existing circuit, I don't know... If people here don't know the answer, though, there IS a seperate "electrical modifications" forum where knowlegable people post.

I guess you could just splice in your driving lights and see what happens - worst case scenario (the lights are a drastically different voltage), all that would hapen is you'd blow a fuse, I think. With all of the on-board computerization the Mini has, however, I'm not 100% sure if that's true.

Good thinking, though...

 

If it were me, I'd use the factory harness to turn on and off a relay and use the relay to turn the driving lights on and off.

That way you have relatively little draw on the factory harness and you can run HolyCrapThoseAreBrightEnoughToPerformSurgeryTrunkM eltingMooseBlinding driving lights if you want without causing the data bus part of the harness to go psychotic.

But that's just me. And I'm real fond of relays.

 

Most driving light kits I've seen, including the Hella's I just installed, are all driven by relays. Relay's are certainly the way to go, to control the circuit from the switch - MUCH safer. You still might blow a fuse, though, depending on the draw of the new lights compared to the stock ones that you're trying to replace on the same circuit, though. Like I said, the main concern I have is whether or not the new lights will confuse the on-board computer - the stock driving lights, for example, must be "programmed" into the onboard computer at the fonal installation step, and I'm not sure what that entails, nor if replacing the stock fog lamps like this would affect anything.

 

I agree, use the stock fog wire as a turn-on lead. That's what I did when installing my FF200's. You can leave the aftermarket switch in the armed position so that whenever you flick the toggle to turn the stock fogs on, the aftermarket fogs will turn on as well.

 

There is nothing in the light that tells the computer anything! the light is just a light. when you turn them on you are telling the car to supply current by a manually operated switch.....and lights do not have voltage ....quite the opposite, they provide resistance.

lights are rated by power (watts) as long as the lamps you use provide the same power then it is a simple swap. just plug in the new ones (dont cut your car's wiring, put connectors on your lights to plug into the factory units please) if they are not the same power then do not use the factory wiring at all! wire them properly using a relay, fuses and seperate wiring. you go pluging crap in to factory circuitry with just egnough electrical knowledge to be dangerous and you will end up blowing your ecu.

 

Understood. I haven't consulted my Bentley manual yet to find the stock lights voltage. Does anyone know? The aftermarket lights are 55w.

My plan was to create a harness for the aftermarket lights, so I could plug them into the stock harness. I want to be able to remove the lights easily for track days.

 

You have to be careful when using fog light wiring with driving lights, that when you actually use your high beams, the fogs don't go off. To rectify this, you need to double check the ground for the fog lights & relay. More than likely the relay is grounded to the high beam lead-- which will cause the fogs to shut off with the high beams.

So both the fog light ground & relay ground should be grounded to the chassis, so that the relay stays on with the high beams.

 

Just to clarify ... my idea is to tap into the harness that the small round stock driving lights in the corners of the bumper use.

I'm pretty sure those lights stay on when the high beams are in use. The question is what is the wattage of these stock lights.

 

The lights on the lower corner of the bumper are fog lights, an H11 is, iirc is 55 W

 

Do you mean the parking lights or fog lights? The fog lights will go out when high beams turn on. Parking lights are what come on when you turn the light stalk just one click. If you tap the parking lights, then you will definitely need to wire a real and switch.

The stock high beams are H7 55w. Stock fog lights are H7 55w (02's and some '03's) or H11 55w ('03 on).

 

Why do the OEM driving lights need a computer upgrade then? Simply so that the on-board can detect them and "ding" the warning tone if you accidentally leave then turned on? FYI - I've never used the OEM driving lights, bit as I recall from other threads, the last step of their installation is to have the on-board computer updated so that it knows the lights are installed. naturally, I did't do any of this with my driving lights, though (Hella's wired independently of the existing lights with an independent switch).

Thanks!

 

Im wasn't trying to insult you before nor am I now, but you have a clear lack of knowledge in this area.....but you chimed in with a quite inncorrect WAG (wild as guess) before and are again off the mark. But will clarify for the sake of others.

The reason you have to have the factory DRIVING lights activated is because of they instructions and harness that are provided with the factory kit. The factory kit, appropriately turns of DRIVING lights when high beams are activated and this is controlled through the the BC1 in the case of factory installation

You can install the lights (or any aftermarket light) by wiring an completely seperate circuit using relay and fuses to operate the lights safely completely independent of the computer, ......you will have no dinging, and will be illegal in most states because you will have to much high beam light comming out and becuase you cant flip two switches every time a car comes.

In this case....we are talking about the auxillary lights in the front bumper....These are FOG lights and are already from the factory, designed to shut off when your high beams come on and as someone confirmed a 55W bulb, by simply replacing the factory light with an aftermarket light of same power in a diffrent location on the car is completely possible and poses no risk of overloading circuitry or blinding on comming drivers

 

Wow.... Close but no cigar

The factory kits turn does NOT turn off the Driving lights when high beams are active.

Rather, the factory kit prevents the Driving Lights to be on UNLESS the high beams are active (the opposite of what you wrote).

The fogs are more complicated because they used the toggle switches. The driving lots do not use the toggle switch but rather just another switch (like any other aftermarket wiring switch).

If you turn on the highs and then the driving lights ... switch to lows, the driving lights will go automatically "off". If you switch back to highs they go automaticall "on". Until the next time you start the car.

 

Ouch. Guess I'll have a buddy on the electrical MODs short bus, anyway...

Yes, this is how I THOUGHT they worked, but again, I've never installed the OEM lights. I BELIEVE (just a WAG) that I've read ON HERE posted BY OTHER PEOPLE, (not me, you dig?) that most states require driving lights to be wired such that they only come on wheh the high beams do, so this configuration makes sense. I make no claims as to the veracity of that statement - Google helps for such lookups - but it's worth mentioning. The configuration the OP is suggesting would not work this way, even if the new lights he wants to add are the same wattage, simplty because the lower fog lamps are not controlled by the high beams. Of course, MY lamps are not wired that way either (not a WAG, just a fact), so it's up to the owner whether or not they want to use them in this configuration.

In my initial post, I said clearly that I THOUGHT it would not work and tried directing this person to the Electrical MODs forum, where the really knowlegable people play.

QUESTION: Do higher-mounted driving lamps offer a benefit over lower-mounted ones, as far as range and illumination? I know I've read to mount them "as far apart as possible", but I can't recall whether or not they mentioned anything about height. I know that many rally bars like the Alta are specifically designed to be down low. On my Hella's, I mounted them more or less the same height as my main lights with the bonnet brackets. Just wondering, if anyone should ask for my WAG on whether or not upper mounted or lower mounted lights are best.

 

Driving lights are meant to be positioned high-- to gain the full benefits.

Fogs lights are meant to be mounted low, to undercut the fog

If you noticed, rally cars have their auxilary lights (pencil beams) high, on the hood. Pencil beams are even narrower than driving lights.

 

Matt where you have your Hella's mounted is about Ideal for a driving light, IMHO. Fogs down low work well, drivings mounted down low not so well, IMHO. Most folks mount lights for how they look, not for how they perform.

 

I gotta admit, they look TOUGH down low, but logically I understand what you're saying and I understand why fogs work better down as low as possible. All that aside, though, If I didn't need to run a front license plate, I definitely would have gone with four low-mounted lights on an Alta bar or on the Outmotoring brackets - that looks just so awesome. Glad I have to run with a plate though - 4 Alta lights and brackets would have sent me to the poor house.

 

To your first sentences ... you are correct. Most state laws (if not all) require that driving lights be relayed via the highs and Fogs be relayed via the low beams. That is exactly why you will find every OEM MINI working that way. Its easy enough to look this up for your state ... just google your state Transportation Laws and start reading.

As to the question ... take a look at "REAL rallye Cars". Not show cars or pimped out cars. You want those driving lights as high as physically possible. This is a photo of the winning mini rallye car. Note the light on the ROOF!



The problem is a matter of "looks". It might not look to cool to have a light bar on your roof "today". Hence the lights are on the bonnet.

Fogs go as LOW as possible. Again, each state law may be different but basically about 18" from the ground. The people putting four driving lights on the alta bar are really wasting the power of driving lights. They certainly are getting more light but I doubt the same if mounted higher. In fact, most states have laws on how LOW driving lights can be although I doubt anyone pays attention to them

I have the OEM driving lights and added Hella FF200 fogs via the outmotoing mounts. The FF200 are great lights, throw a lot of light down LOW, where they belong. They don't bother oncoming traffic.

Everyone likes different things. Some ppl like the "form" over function. I prefer the "function" first. Its just opinion or personal preference.

 

I was wondering if anyone had ever mounted a second set of fogs down low - guess people have.

Ideally, I want the look AND the functionality.

PS- Love those checkered covers with your roof.

 

I have posted this pic elsewhere but here it is again...of my PIAA 540 Ion Crystal fogs. Was just out on the back roads on the weekend in heavy fog and these cut thru and below the fog very nicely.

 

Thanks

You mean FOUR (4) foglight below? I think that might be a bit of overkill since you already get fog lights. Adding one sets makes 4. Adding another set makes 6. I can't see anyone needing SIX foglights?

I can see six, 8, 10, 100 driving lights ... the more the better to see but fogs are for liking driving at 30 mph or less.

 

No, I meant like you did, with driving lights up high and secind set of fogs down low, like you have going. or are those lower lights a second set of driving lights?

How did you mount those lowers, by the way? they look higher-up than I've seen with the Alta bar or the Outmotoring lower brackets... they look good.

Big Daddy - those lights are MONSTER, but, I think I'd like them better and they'd mirror the clean lines of the dark car without the grilles. Of coursem the only opinion that matters is YOURS.

 

The lowers are fogs.

The outmotoring brackets lets you mount them high ... or low within the real bumper. I purposely put them high (in the lower grille.

 

Oh! I had no idea that they could be used that way! When you said the Outmotoring ones, I assumed you meant the ones listed as "bonnet" brackets. That's great to know...