So I am shopping for a mini Cooper s and for the most part I have been thinking an early mkII, probably 2007. But I recently found a loaded 2006 with works kit and low millage and I discovered I actually prefer the MKI interior and the supercharger whine over the BOV sound of the 2007 works I drove.

But here is where I get hung up.
There were a lot of changes from one gen to the next, does one handle any better than the other? If I were to strut brace a mkI would it put it more in line with a mkII? (the only thing I have heard from my friend with a 1st gen non s was the strut towers would flex when pushed hard)

What about engine performance? Does one have more gettup for roll ons than another, or for swatting it on the highway? I'm not really interested in 1/4 mile stuff, but the 40-80mph is an important figure to me.

How about maintenance? One better than another? I know the later generation of my Buell increased the matenence interval. And in most pontiacs the supercharger needed a major overhaul at a certain point that turbos typically don't need. BUT this is German engineering and a far cry from a Pontiac.

Any other points would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks

 

I prefer the 1st Gen. Mini's myself.
The strut tower issue can be addressed with a M7 Front Strut Bar and a set of Craven Speed Under Tower braces. The M7 has a full frame design around the top strut towers.

There are alot more performance opitions available for the S/C cars.
Change the pulley to a 17% reduction one, injectors and a good tune.
You'll be very happy.

Suggest you look at forums regarding maintence. They can direct you to trouble spots, etc.

 

I have a 2006 MCS with 115,000 miles. The only things I have done were: Rotors, Pads, shocks soon to be, tires and an aftermarket CAI. I have not driven a gen 2, however, I love the way my car performs. The supercharger sound is addicting. Word is that the new generations ride a little better and may be more sophisticated. The 1st generations reputation is for being a drivers car. A little rougher around the edges but highly customized!!!

 

Any S/C car has a chance that the S/C will need to be rebuilt. Its the nature of the beast. But There are some MINIs that have 100k+ on thier S/C without any visible signs of wear on it.

All in all, the 2006 JCW will be more modable, but the 2007 has potetial to produce tons of torque.

 

I'll tell you straight up, that SC whine is nearly impossible to beat IMO. I had an 02 mildly modded with a 15% redcu pulley and Milltek cat back. LOVED that car.

If you are happy with the 06, its condition, worse fuel economy, out-of-warranty maintenance etc. I'd be all over it.

I still prefer the look of the 02-06 MCS, personally.

With that said, here are MY PERSONAL REASONS for taking delivery of a 2011 JCW this week...
Increased refinement in interior build quality, materials
Improved power
Improved fuel economy
Refined handling
Gadget lust -- MINI Connected w/Nav
New MINI warranty


I'm really stoked for this new car. I know I'll love it! But let me reiterate--nothing can ever replace that SC whine. It was one of my favorite things about the R53.

Good luck.

 

The first gen car has a directness and sense of urgency that the 2nd gen car lacks. The supercharger whine is delicious.

Because of the nature of turbos, the 2nd gen can be upgraded and tuned for much larger gains over the s/c of the 1st gen, for equivalent money.

That said, the "refined" ride of the 2nd gen just means it is softer and more comfortable, yet can still take the corners.

 

I prefer Gen 2's. The engine was refined and is "BMW". The ride is more controlled (don't say soft) and is for more everyday driving yet still handles unbelieveably well. I also like the more sloped aerodynamic nose over the gen 1. I also like the interior better as it was completely redesigned with better materials. Just my thoughts......

 

I think that gen1 handles better than gen2. I perfer the s/c over the turbo. It seems to me that the newer the mini is the bigger it is and it started in 07. I have an 05 and can't get enough of driving it.

 

Recently went through this myself and settled on a gen1. I like the styling a little better, and the s/c whine is addicting. I also like the fact that it seems a little simpler, a little more pure. I really don't think you can wrong either way, but that's my 2 cents. Good luck!

 

sounds like a gen1 isn't a bad way to go, in fact may be THE way to go for me. I don't mind a slightly jarring ride at all as most of my vehicles have been a little on the stiff side, some very stiff.
I'm going to try and move on this 06, it needs a front wheel bearing swapped out already and they also replaced some bushings in the rear and that has me a little worried considering its low mileage, but until I can thoroughly look it over I cant be sure if it was beat on or not.

on my intro thread somebody made a point about the first of a new gen having some teething issues (not their words but mine) and I know all too well what that can be like. I had a 2004 Jetta VR6, 2004 was a switch in engine manufacturing, the result was an increase in HP but in the 2004 model year there were many electrical gremlins that would develop over time. oddly enough perfornace mods would FIX many of the gremlins, I ended up with a 260WHP Jetta, and in the long run it was worthless when the main harness went kaput and nobody could fix it. idiot lights would turn on and off intermittently as would the radio and it would not hold a charge.
not sure if the 2007 had any issues with it or not but it was a good point so I may stick in the 1st gen market because a 2008+ would be higher mileage if it were in my price range.

what kind of highway millage can I expect from a mkI S? mkII is rated about 36MPG?
and is the majority of maintenance something that I can do or have a non BMW/MINI shop do?
I am relatively savvy when it comes to these things but if I need proprietary tools I'm still SOL.
BMW around here tends to be a lot like Harley, expensive and excessive when it comes to maintenance. (and I have been less than thrilled with my dealer experience thus far locally)

I'm not finding anything really detailed about regular maintenance intervals, or dealer recommended intervals. normally I find these in an owners manual, but what are the big ones?

my step dads Bonneville SSEi was supposed to get a s/c rebuild every 30k or so per the dealer.

heck I don't even know the oil change interval, my motorcycle with full synthetic (amsoil) is every 5k but my Jetta was every 12k-16k with mobile 1 synthetic. but I tend to change a little early just to be on the safe side.

 

have you test drove both gen's... i just got a 2011 and had a 2002 heavily modded before that and i love my 2011... dont get me wrong i loved my 02 but the new models i feel have so much more potential... the torque is awesome... i feel like if i throw a few mods on this car it would blow my other car out of the water... it is very comfortable inside yet i can wip it around corners without skipping a beat... i love both the looks of the 1st and 2nd gen's but it came down for me which one i could get a better deal on... and i got a GREAT deal on a 2011 and im loving the new interior upgrades...

 

I have driven both but not extensively, both were just short test drives.
a 2007 with works turbocharger and exhaust and the 2006 that I want with engine brakes exhaust maybe suspension and LSD.

it looks like the dealer raised the price online by just over a grand so I will probably be walking away from it unless they come down to what it was first posted at or lower.
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...standard=false

back to the hunt, but I think I'm going to hunt for a mk1 JCW with modest miles on it.

 

Im going to chime in here. I had an 06 r53 s with the following mods. Alta CAI, Alta 15% reduction and Magnaflow Exhaust. That combination, sound, and SC is impossible to beat. I have an 11clubman S that is truely a different beast in its self. To me, the new generation lacks something and i cant quite put my finger on it.

As far as aesthetics go between an 06 r53 and 07 r56 is night and day. I think the interior went backwards in the 07's with the cheap silver plastic crap all over the place. The interior of the 06 is perfect in everyway and nothing was cheap about the interior of that car IMHO. When i got rid of my 06 i thought i would never be a mini owner again just because i could not STAND the interior of the 07-10's and was actually going to purchase an Audi A3 but then motoringfile broke the story about the 11 interior revisions and i just knew that i was going to be an owner again (the 11's have a quality feel and i think its slightly better then the 06's)

After living with my 11 mini for a little over a month now i can say i love the new generations, it still lacks something (maybe its the supercharger whine) but BMW/Mini have a winner with the 11 and the revisions. If you had said this was a choice between an 06 and 11 i would say go 11 but sense this is an 06 vs an 07 IMHO there is no comparison...06 all the way!!!! besides, i dont like the proportions of an r56 compared to an r53...to big to be a "Mini"

the clubman is a much more balanced in the design with the proportions, the r56's tail lights are ridiculously large.....Did i mention that the supercharger whine is truely intoxicating

Goodluck!

 

were there any revisions in the R53 years that I should look for is is any year R53 good/the same as the next?

 

02 is the worst, 06 the best. Pretty much linear change thru the range. Personally, I would stay away from the 07, just because it was such a radical change and has the potential for new gen gremlins. Can't quantify that statement, just a gut feeling.

 

I think it's important that when one embarks on an investigative venture that proper nomenclature be identified initially.

For the record:

The Mini MKl was manufactured from 1959 to 1967.

The Mini MKll was manufactured from 1967 to 1973.

The Mini MKlll was manufactured from 1969 to 2000.

These vintages are now referred to as Classic Minis. (please note the lower case in Mini)

The Generation 1 MINI was manufactured from 2001 to 2006. These are now referred to as Gen1 or GEN1 MINIs. (please note the use of upper case in MINI)

The Generation 2 MINI started manufacture in 2007 and continues today. These are now referred to as Gen2 or GEN2 MINIs.

There will be a pop quiz later this week.

....Les

 

haha i was going to say was i missing something... we can also refer to it as R53 or R56

 

Or you can refer to them this way:

• R50: "Mk I" Mini One & Mini Cooper (2001–2006)
• R52: "Mk I" Mini Convertible (2004–2008)
• R53: "Mk I" Mini Cooper S (2001–2006)
• R55: "Mk II"Mini Clubman and D (2007–present)
• R56: "Mk II" Mini One, Mini Cooper & Mini Cooper S (2007–present)
• R57: "Mk II"Mini Convertible (2009–present)
• R60: "Mk II"Mini Countryman (2010–present)

The "Mk" designators are reused but real people don't use them.

Remember, there will be a pop quiz later this week.

.....Les

 

LOL

yea I use the Mk designators because I got sick of everybody marking generations with "G" because they thought the Iphone 3G was a generation mark not a cellular network identifier.

now I can hear people talking about the ipod nano 5G (and they don't mean gigabyte either)

but I have no problem with the chasis codes R5_ (except the countrymen being the first of the R6_ chassis.
I use the F_ designation for the RX-7's too because its more clear what you are talking about.

Ill never get the old Austin mini's straight in my head, though I would love a bastardized AWD VTEC mini. (yea I'm sick)

I'm starting to catalog performance modifications in my head for the R53 and R56 but my focus is now on the R53. my only problem thus far is that my searches don't yield number stats for most of the modifications. (spring stiffness; kg/in, progressive%, constant rate, parabolic, or staged rate, cooling effect increase, CFM capacity, ect.)

when did companies stop publishing stats for their components?
dyno results are ok for a generalized idea if you baseline first but there are so many variables that I would rather calculate percentages.

I also found some good info in the form of a buyers guide to the first gen MINIs but it was a little incomplete and I am still trying to fill in the gaps after reading it. but to summarize the 04-06 are the years to buy with the 05-06 having higher preference and no real changes between the final two years but the 04 marked the end of some fairly significant teething issues with a new car and factory. and 05 being a year of refinement with revised supercharger and software to back it up as well as interior refinement.

but one thing that continued to be an issue across the board for the R53 was apparently something with the clutch and flywheel, but I haven't looked for any stats to back that up yet or even clarification as to what the problem was exactly.
also coolant tank ruptures and two main points for potential oil leeks on the engine.


I have yet to find info on standard intervals and labor for primary services, but after reading up some more I am for the most part confident I can wrench it myself.

 

The Mk and caps lock idea reminds me of the Bimmer Beemer argument

 

I'd say R53 is more a driver's car, so if you want a more comfy commuter the R56 with its softer suspension is the way to go. But if you want a sunday canyon carver (slash) track day toy the R53 is the best bet.

 

The clutch/flywheel issue was predominate on the '06 R53. It sounded just like Chewbaca from the movie.

Mine started that at around 25k miles and the dealer replaced it under warranty. The problem has been well documented and discussed here and on other MINI forums.

The other well documented and discussed issue is the thermostat housing on the '06 (and a few earlier '05s). Again, dealer replaced mine under warranty.

And the last well documented and discussed issue has to do with the engine cooling fan. The resistor for low fan speed fails due to corrosion and you end up with only high speed. Again, dealer replaced my fan assembly under warranty. This issue can/could be related to all GEN1 MINI's.

But, in my unbiased opinion (just don't look at my sig), the '06 MCS 6 speed with no sunroof and manual climate control but MFSW is the best MINI made out of all of them.

The most insanely quick MINI was the '02 MCS with 6 speed, no sunroof, manual climate and no MFSW. It was a fire breather. But that was BEFORE the EPA flash which improved emissions but put the flame out of the fire. I owned a very early build '02 MCS, took it into the dealer for a myriad of small things and they FLASHED MY MINI!!! It was still a lot of fun to drive, but alas, the FIRE was gone.

....Les

 

thanks for the heads up, you probably saved me several hours of searching (my google fu is still weak when it comes to the MINI)

the clutch and flywheel should be easy enough to catch on a test drive. Not so sure about the other two though, especially the fan unless I do an extended idle (its around averaging "stupid cold" around here this time of the year)

there are a few late R53s in the classifieds here that I am thinking about.

I want to find one before spring so I can stop at Detroit Tuned while I am in the area.

 

Hmm...really? Have you seen any R56's with 300hp? 400+hp? How about 500+ hp? Didn't think so. Doubt you will ever see a R56 comming anywhere near that amount and stay together. Think of it.....BMW seemed to think it needed to reinforce the block for the JCW and it only added what? 25hp? So how do you think that block is going to react to 200 more hp?

Hmm ... really? You do know that the engine is a Peugeot right? And sounds like a diesel when they run?


Anyway as an owner of both a 03MCS and a 09MCS, I can verify what some of these people are saying. The R53 has a more visceral feel to it, granted I have not driven a R56 JCW? The R56 seems...?...?...more refined, but time will tell. I personally think the R56 engines are not going to last like the Chrysler designed R53's, but again....time will tell. With all that said, my wifes R56 is more comfortable than my car, which is heavily modded, but does one drive a MINI for comfort or feel?

 

I prefer the interior of the 1st gen. And, of course, the supercharger whine. I think they are very similar from a performance standpoint. If it's a works car, do you have the strut tower braces already? All in all, I prefer the looks and sound and interior of the 1st gen. It' just a more visceral car, in my opinion, while still being more than refined enough for daily driving.