I think they have. I mean, everyone knew what a mini was all about. This little car that zips through the streets of London or even the idea of a bunch of clowns cramming into the little car at a circus but there had to be a turning point. True movies help perception and so do commercials but how much did BMW influence perception. I had a 335i BMW and I saw BMW all over the mini when I test drove it. Inside and out.

Americans are so into the big 6 and 8 cylinder muscle car and the old fashion understanding of what a engine is all about but it is clear that smaller 4 cylinder tuned engine cars are making a dent into the performance car market and Mini is one of the leaders in this market.

Should we thank BMW for it??? Would mini have taken such a leap if BMW didn't buy it??

 

The general design for the new MINI (2002-2006) was not done by BMW. They bought the company when the design process was almost complete.

But the new model is a "BMW" design.

When BMW bought the Rover group back in the late 90's, they made a horrible mistake trying to get into the SUV market by buying Land Rover. It just turned out that MINI happened to be part of the Rover Group and it turned out to be a silver lining to the deal.

 

High perforamance 4 cylinder cars were around in America long before BMW got its mits on Mini. A couple of minutes of driving with the rattles will quickly dispel any thoughts of BMW while driving the Mini.

 

plus towards the end of the old rover mini's production it had already evolved into a stylish/performance niche car instead of the ultra-utilitarian econobox it was ORIGINALLY supposed to be

when rover was designing the replacement that eventually became the r50/r53, they wanted something more utilitarian still. the car that eventually came to be, however, was heavily influenced by bmw. for instance, the design was done by frank stephenson at bmw and there was a bit of political struggle b/t rover and bmw. so while the original new mini wasn't a complete *bmw design* per se, it wasn't 100% rover either. i think when bmw bought the rover group, even tho they did it mostly to get land rover, they knew the mini brand was somewhat of a golden goose, 'cuz after the new mini came out and when they were selling rover off later on, the brits wanted mini to come away to remain independent from bmw but bmw refused. in addition, they also kept the rights to other classic brands including triumph and riley

 

Well I know HP 4 cylinder cars were around in America, but the perception of high performance in America has always been the bigger engines.

I have a lifted Jeep wrangler as well, nothing can be worse that that....trust me. You haven't heard rattle and wind noise until you drove a jeep at 65 mph. A mini would be like reading a book in a public library.

 

I've owned three MINIs (still have two), purchased new, and 7 BMWs, of which 3 were purchased new. MINIs ARE BMWs now. They are just front wheel drive, four cylinder BMWs. What I feel BMW has done is make sure that the new MINI drives in a way that enthusiasts love it, and kept it from being a small PT Cruiser - like product.

FWIW, My MINIs have been just as reliable as the BMWs were, and more so in some ways.

My 2001 325Ci rattled more than either of my current MINIs. My 03 did rattle somewhat, but it was rectified quickly by the dealer installing some door panel sound material.

 

LOL. I could imagine that.

 

Ahh yes the Vega, Pinto and Gremlin come to mind.

 

Just for clarification. The only 4 cylinder engine that came in a Gremlin was one made by Audi/VW. The 6 and 8 cylinder engines were AMC.

Other HP 4 cylinder engines came from the Japanese manufacturers.

 

I guarantee you there will be a rebirth of the Pinto

 

How about the BMW 2002? VW GTi? Toyota Celica? All sold well in the US in the 70's and 80's and were high performance 4 cylinders. In the US I think the Ralph Nader Corvair debacle caused a turn away from domestic high performance 4 cylinder vehicles back in the day. Yet, there were a few - Pontiac Fiero, Mercury Capri, Ford Maverick, Dodge Dart , . . .

 

Uh, actually the Corvair was equipped with a horizontally opposed 6 cylinder engine, not a 4 cylinder engine.

 

I think the problem with the high performance 4 cylinders in the 70's was that they did not seem to grasp the concept of tuning outside of the engine such as intake and exhaust.

Yes, the GTI was the top gun in 4 cylinder

 

I think a better way to ask the question maybe, " Would BMW have even considered buying MINI if it had not already been in a design process that appealed to them?" I think not. The 07 however now has the full influence of BMW on it, which has just added to the appeal.
I drove the 04 MCS and would have purchased it had I not already had a 03 VW GLX (Which is now my daughters). What does that mean ? Answer, I have an 07 MCS in my garage and am having a blast.

 

Actually Honda was a pioneer in using intake and exhaust design to make thier engines more efficient. That had all carried over from thier motorcycle division.

I think BMW did an outstanding job with the redesign. They could have easily done a more efficient aerodynamic design. Instead, they kept the brick-like design and go-kart handling in tact. What it could have been, versus what it did in fact end up being is a huge gap. Like the one between Pluto and the Sun.

 

Agreed there have alway's been decent 4 cylinder products from Europe and Japan. U.S. manufacturer's have traditionally been weak in this area.
FYI the Capri was from Ford in Europe and I believe the Dodge Dart was made by Mitsubishi. The Fiero and Maverick were just POS, certainly not high performance.

 

Uh, the Ford Maverick never came with a 4 cylinder engine. It had many different inline 6 cylinder engines and the 302 V-8.

Dodge used the 'Dart' name for many years and built all of them. None of them were available with a 4 cylinder engine. Maybe you are thinking of the Challenger for year models 78-83, which was built by Mitsubishi.

 

After 1976, the Dart model name remained in use from 1977 to 1979 as an F-body Dart. Two door, four door, and station wagons were produced with 225cid six cylinders and 360cid V8s. In 1981, the Dart name was moved to the K-car platform where it continued through at least 1987. In 1987, the Dart was available as a station wagon or a four door sedan with engine options of the 2.2 four cylinder, the new 2.5 four cylinder and even the "TurboChrysler" 2.2 four cylinder.

You are correct about the Corvair - my bad.

With regard to the Ford - they had a bunch of 4 cylinders, but the Maverick wasn't one of them. However, the Comet (which was very similar in body style and what I was thinking of), Cortina, Falcon, and Probe, at one time or another, I believe had 4 cylinder engines.

 

...like a Phoenix.

 

No, i think the Comet was always using small block 302 and other small blocks.
I have a 72 Ford 302 small block from a Comet that i'm putting into one of my 51 ford f1 i'm restoring.

 

Best friend had a mustard yellow Pinto station wagon with fake wood paneling on the sides and a Heineken beer tap as a stickshift ****. Oh yeah . . . that's comin' back!!!

 

The Dart ceased production in 1976 and never had a 4 cyliner engine offered in it. At least not here in the U.S. Seems we may be talking about a different badging. The differences in year models you are talking about and what I am talking about is pretty far apart.

The 71-77 Comet was the Mercury version of the Ford Maverick and it never had a 4 cylinder engine in it either. The base engine was an inline 6.

The Ford Falcon was offered from 1960 through 1970 and it never had a 4 cylinder in it either.

The Cortina was a British Ford. The Mercury Capri had a 4 cyliner engine in it.

Maybe that is the difference. Are you from Britain?

 

I drove a 4 cyl '76 Capri into the ground, and I don't know that I'd call it high performance either Maybe the V6's were, but then it did have 180,000 miles on it when I got it. There's some front-end suspension bushing company out there I kept in business for years.

It wasn't a branded a Mercury yet, just "Capri II Ghia" with no other badging. This ad is the exact car I had, they really pushed the 'European Design' angle. The Mini's spherical air-flow controls are creepily similar.

 

That link to that website is a riot...I clicked the ads for cigarettes and there is this one 1951 Camel ad. "More Doctors Smoke Camel than any other cigarette!"

 

Then new MINI would not, could not, have been developed by the old regime, as they didn't have two nickels to rub together. The project was just too ambitious for a company that was on the ropes. The BMW ownership (and development) has morphed the cars image from a quirky British car into a still somewhat quirky European car. The British background and assembly combined with the German technology/ownership has, in my opinion at least, resulted in a car with its feet planted in two different worlds. It seems a surprisingly comfortable fit!