Good examples Sabre, and those were sports cars instead of faster accelerating F1 cars.

 

Nothing is ever secret or proprietary in F1 for long!

benjam, it seems other teams were delving into the idea of a ride height management system...


F1: McLaren Stops Designing Adjustable Ride-Height System
McLaren will not debut an adjustable ride height system this weekend...
Adam Cooper - GMM | Posted April 13, 2010 GMM Newswire

McLaren confirmed Tuesday it will not introduce an adjustable ride-height system in China this weekend.

After admitting in Melbourne the British team's boss Martin Whitmarsh suspected other teams including Red Bull of running such a system. Whitmarsh said McLaren designers were working on a similar system to debut in Shanghai.

But in addressing the speculation, FIA clarified the point that adjusting the ride height of a car between qualifying and a race is not allowed in any form.

"Basically, we had a system we were working on, and we've now suspended that," engineering director Paddy Lowe told reporters during a teleconference on Tuesday.

He also clarified that the ruling has not affected the existing mechanical specification of the MP4-25. Red Bull's Christian Horner has also said the RB6 is unchanged between Malaysia and China.

Lowe admitted that he does not really know whether other cars will have to be altered as a result of the FIA clarification.

"We got the feeling that others were further advanced in development. I haven't got a clue as to whether anyone else has a system on their cars though," he said


I guess that its just another Tweak of the Week thing in F1...

Who knows what other dark little secrets hide in the engineering/design offices of the major F1 teams...

 

I don't know. As long as they make a system that doesn't change the ride height. The problem that needs solving is keeping the ride height the same regardless of if the car is heavy or light. As long as there isn't the ability to adjust the ride height during the race, I don't think the FIA would have an issue with it.

 

Since we've been discussing the rules that govern F1 lately, I found an interesting device that the teams are employing, yet it leads me to wonder as to its legality.

Well, the device must be legal, or at the very least, there is a loophole under how it's legality can be interpreted lest the teams would not have gone ahead with development. It is called an F-Duct.

Now, I was under the impression that FIA rules do not allow for movable devices that alter the aero (i.e. airflow) of the car (e.g. movable wings, flipper wings, ground effects skirts, etc.).

The F-Duct (and its intended function), which if I understand it correctly, is a movable airfoil that, activated in the cockpit by the driver is designed to alter the airflow and spoil the downforce to the rear wing.

Here are 2 interesting blurbs concerning the device...


F1: Mercedes F-Duct Makes Debut Friday
Michael Schumacher was conducting a test Friday...

GMM | Posted April 16, 2010 GMM Newswire

Mercedes debuted a McLaren-like F-duct system on Michael Schumacher's car on Friday morning in China.

Team reserve driver Nick Heidfeld said a decision has not been taken about whether the device, activated in the cockpit by the driver and designed to spoil the downforce to the rear wing on straights, will stay on the W01 for qualifying and the race.

"It is now being analyzed to see whether we use it on both cars for the rest of the weekend," Heidfeld told the German broadcaster Sky.

The 32-year-old said he thinks the system works well, after the wind tunnel data looked "promising".

Meanwhile, unlike the sidepod-mounted inlet on the Sauber, and McLaren's on the upper monocoque, Ferrari's new F-duct system lets air in via the actual engine cover itself



F1: Ferrari’s F-Duct Gets No Laps In China
Fernando Alonso blew an engine in P1 Friday...

GMM | Posted April 16, 2010 Shanghai (CHN)

Ferrari's new F-duct system did not get many miles under its belt during initial Friday practice in Shanghai.

The McLaren-type device was fitted only to Fernando Alonso's F10, and the Spaniard did not even complete a timed flying lap before his engine failed.

Ferrari referred to the F-duct on Friday morning as a "blowing rear wing system", and said the one running on Alonso's car in China is "not the complete one".

Meanwhile, Williams did not use its own new F-duct on Friday morning, perhaps because the parts were held up in Europe due to the Icelandic volcano smoke cloud.

It was also rumored in Shanghai that, while Red Bull continues to deny having any such device aboard the RB6, Ferrari's drivers might be altering the ride-height of their cars during the pit stops.

This solution, because the change is not occurring during parc ferme conditions or while the car is in motion, would theoretically be legal, and Felipe Massa welcomed the FIA's recent rule clarification.


Anyone care to shed some light on this?

Opinions/comments...

 

Here's some more on the issue that is the F-Duct as taken from the F1 website...



Pre-China analysis - the battle of the F-ducts?


At one time it seemed that the Chinese Grand Prix might be the battle of the ride-height adjusters, with McLaren developing a system along lines they believe Red Bull to have been using since the start of the season in Bahrain. But then the FIA issued a clarification that any such device would be deemed illegal, and McLaren dropped the idea. Now, it seems like the race could became the battle of the F-ducts.

McLaren stole a march on their opposition with the elegant system, which comprises a duct on the scuttle of the MP4-25 which runs through the cockpit and can be blocked or opened up by movement of the driver’s body to provide a flow of carefully channelled air to the rear wing which can then be used to stall the wing at high speed in a straight line, thus reducing drag and boosting terminal velocity. The main straight in Shanghai is one of the longest in Formula One racing, with top speeds of more than 300 km/h.

Prior to the weekend, Ferrari’s Felipe Massa voiced the Scuderia’s thoughts on such systems when he said: “It's a nice circuit to drive and the extremely long straight leading into a tight corner means there is a real possibility to overtake. However, we will need to be careful on that straight this year, because we have seen that the McLaren in particular has a very high top speed, so in case of a close battle with them we will have to be careful and ready to defend position."

Lewis Hamilton has already acknowledged that the length of the straight bodes well for McLaren's chances this weekend. "Overtaking is possible at this circuit, particularly at the end of the long back straight, so I'm pretty confident we'll have another competitive weekend," he said.

Now Ferrari have revealed that they will run their own interpretation of the F-duct in practice today, on Fernando Alonso’s F10.

"It will be an advantage, no doubt," Alonso said. "It is one of the longest straights in the championship and we know how efficient the McLaren is on the straights and what their top speed was in the first races.

"We saw McLaren very competitive in Malaysia, especially with Lewis in the dry. But I still think that Red Bull will have a little advantage over everybody again here."

Interestingly, however, the F-duct was no help in getting Hamilton past Adrian Sutil’s similarly Mercedes-powered Force India in the race.

Alonso insisted yesterday that the F-duct is not a major priority for Ferrari, however. "I know that we keep developing the car, but it's not maybe the first priority for us. We keep working on our philosophies. There is an important step here to improve the car, and I know that there is more coming in the next races. I'm not specifically worried only about that system."

Mercedes may also run their own system this weekend, while Williams have one under development.

It’s also interesting that while BMW Sauber have so far been the only other team to use such a system in testing and intend to run it this weekend, thanks to Pedro de la Rosa’s former links with McLaren tipping them off to the development, the Hinwil team have yet to optimise it and the technology can be tricky to perfect.

"The team is improving the system race by race," the Spaniard said. "It's not an easy one, it's very complex, and they're doing a good job making it work reliably, but our plan is to run it from tomorrow until Sunday now it's working, and here is one of the places it's useful."


There's no doubt that if perfected straight-line speeds will increase as the rear wing's effectiveness is negated.

I thought that this fact in the story was interesting; "...comprises a duct on the scuttle of the MP4-25 which runs through the cockpit and can be blocked or opened up by movement of the driver’s body to provide a flow of carefully channelled air to the rear wing..."

Movement of the driver's body?

Wow! I hope the driver doesn't shift around in the cockpit during a session/race!

 

The way I've heard it explained, it sounds like there's basically a bladder in the cockpit that fills up with air. The driver then uses their arm or knee to squeeze the bladder empty. I would think on a long straight, the bladder could fill up with pressure and squeezed empty a couple of times.

I don't know if that's an accurate interpretation or not.

With the small size of the duct, I don't think the driver just operates a lever or something like that. I think you would need a fairly significant volume of air to make an appreciable difference.

 

Holy cow, awesome race. Didn't have the outcome that I wanted, but Button beating Hamilton will deffinitely do. How many warnings is Hamilton going to get before they finally start handing out penalties?

I was happy to see Petrov finally finish and do it in good fashion.

What is going on with Ferrari's engines? Very unlike them. I think Sauber is going to be in trouble at the end of the season....even if they and Ferrari get this thing figured out.

 

When he kills someone. Kind of makes me miss Ide.

Vettel had the fast lane and the edge. LuHam needed to back off.

 

Agreed......but that (and the race) was fun to watch! You don't get that entertaining of an F1 race very often anymore..

 

This is a classic example of irrestible force meets immovable object...

Neither driver was going to give any ground to the other and they weren't even fighting for position on the track!

I watched the replay of this several times and I have to say (IMHO) that Hamilton should have conceded and moved in behind Vettel rather than pushing the issue.

An accident between those two locking wheels in the pitlane could have had dire consequences. I can well see one car being launched over the other and into a pitbox causing mayhem to the crew people stationed there.

Came across this article and Martin Brundle feels that both drivers should recieve penalties.


F1: Brundle - Stiffer Penalties Needed
Retired F1 driver Martin Brundle would crack down on offenders if he were making the calls...

GMM | Posted April 20, 2010 GMM Newswire

Former Formula One driver Martin Brundle has revealed that he would push for harsher decisions and penalties if he was a F1 steward.

So far in 2010, to give additional credibility to the officials' adjudications, experienced former drivers including Alain Prost, Johnny Herbert and Alex Wurz have acted as stewards at grands prix.

But although Brundle argues that the "brutal and sometimes unfathomable penalties" of the recent past have now been eradicated, he thinks the stewards are now being too lenient.

The former McLaren driver, a full-time commentator for British television since retiring in 1996, wrote in his BBC column that Sebastian Vettel and Lewis Hamilton should have been penalized for their pitlane stoush in China.

"They both received a reprimand, but what does that mean? How long does a reprimand last and how many are you allowed to collect before a real penalty?" said Brundle.

"They are lucky I wasn't the resident driver steward for the weekend because I would have strongly recommended dropping them both some penalty places on the grid for the next race in Barcelona.

"The decision taken has set a very dangerous precedent," he charged.

Brundle also said race winner, Jenson Button deserved a penalty for unduly slowing behind the safety car prior to a race restart.

"I wouldn't have been a popular steward with my former McLaren team but that job is not a popularity contest. Ask any referee," said the Briton.


I disagree with Brundle wanting Vettel to be penalized, seeing as he clearly beat the McLaren out onto pit lane from their respective pit-boxes. What is Christian Horner going to tell his driver? "Be a nice lad and move over for the McLaren." I don't think so.

Additionally, seeing as no action yet has been taken by the stewards what was Vettel to do? Back-off and let Hamilton move on by and take his position hoping that the stewards would/might/ reinstate his position after the fact?

Let's hope they get this sorted out soon...

 

Make that Christian Horner. Ross probably doesn't care about those two battling each other (except maybe hoping they'll take each other out).

 

Oops! My bad... My apologies for such a blatant error...

I don't know what possesed me to write that!

Brain fade or dementia praecox I suspect.

Thanks RaceTripper for setting me straight.

 

I think it's great that they have race drivers as stewards, but they need to have the same driver throughout the season, that way the penalties are consistent throughout the season.

 

Hear, hear! I agree!

 

Interesting article:

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/220420...-stirrers.html

 

All the world is a stage and the play that is F1 would suffer if it's cast of characters were milquetoast, players without persona, lacking passion, emotion, and soul. If you don't want to lose your audience you need to infuse those factors which keep the audience spellbound and attentive... After all it is a show is it not (at least according to Bernie)?

So whats really at work here?

Rarely do F1 teams have harmonius pairings when it comes to their drivers (the only one that comes readily to my mind is Andretti/Peterson at Lotus though I'm hoping there are other examples) especially when both are attempting to set a pecking order (i.e. who's #1 and #2).

First there are the drivers. Alonso comes to Ferrari with a champion's credentials, Massa is the established boy on the team and almost a World Champion... you can see where tensions might exist among such a spirited pair as they strive to establish control. Certainly neither is going to cede anything to the other and the recent pitlane contretempts add fuel to the issue but both seem to be handling it with a level of calm and diplomacy (wether enforced by Ferrari management or not).

Then there is the team managment. Ferrari has been known to set one driver against the other (back in the days of Enzo and perhaps even abiding by that philosophy even today) to keep them competitive. Maybe this ideology is quietly at work in the background? Hmm...

Lastly, let us not forget the media... Journalists need drama (as if what occurs on track is not suffcient) and people seem to love conflict. What better way to sell magazines/newspapers/etc. than to create some bad blood between teammates. Conflict, controversy, good guy driver, bad guy driver... It sells and if you don't believe me then just look at how the NASCAR media mavens stir the pot and sit back to let others do the PR work for them whilst they watch the turnstiles spin and the ticket sales/merchansdising cash registers sing!

So is this denial of tension between teammates, Alonso & Massa the work of spin-doctors at the Scuderia or are these two ready to rumble?

Is this the work of the F1 media hoping to increase public attention to the sport (wether good or bad)?

Yes indeed, there are those who just love to stir the pot and sit back to see what their efforts cultivate. The wise tell us that time will reveal all secrets...

I am patient and can wait.

 

Interesting article in Motorsport Magazine (online) on what the future of F1 should/could be...

I'd like to share it with all of you:



An F1 car for the next generation...

April 23rd, 2010 | Nigel Roebuck |Exclusive


“The Formula 1 car,” said Ferrari’s Stefano Domenicali recently, “is too efficient…”

For most, if not all, of the designers in F1, Domenicali’s words will be heresy, for their constant quest is to achieve as close to perfection as possible, and quite right too – that’s what they’re paid for. But a man like Patrick Head, as much a racer as anyone I have known in this business, has always been able to see the bigger picture, to appreciate that Grand Prix racing is – or should be – much more than merely a technical exercise. It is also a sport, and one that requires fans to enable it to survive.

Those fans need to be entertained. As Head once said, “Imagine how spectacular Monaco would be if we ran there with ‘Hockenheim’ wing settings…” Very well, Patrick was speaking some years ago, when Hockenheim was still a flat-out blind, but his point was well made. It’s interesting to remember that in those days, when the cars were as ‘trimmed out’ as possible, in the interests of straightline speed, they twitched and moved around in the stadium section most entertainingly.

Over the years I’ve written endlessly of the need for a complete reappraisal of Grand Prix racing, and where we – the fans – would like it to go.

Personally I believe we have taken a good step forward this year, with the ban on refuelling, which has revived the need for a driver to look after his tyres, and will reward artists in the Clark-Stewart-Prost mould.

A driver, as Robert Kubica has said, now needs to ‘manage a race’, rather than go through a series of qualifying sessions – which are great on Saturday afternoons, when they decide the grid, but quickly became too much of a muchness on Sundays. There is now, as Jenson Button has superbly demonstrated, more than one way to win a Grand Prix.

So all that’s good, but it is not enough. Since its soporific start in Bahrain, the F1 season has picked up dramatically – but it would not, it must be said, have done so to this degree had not rain played so big a role.

In both Melbourne and Shanghai, the races were mainly wet, and in Sepang – admittedly with the help of complacency by McLaren and Ferrari – mixed conditions in qualifying led to a highly unusual grid, with four major players towards the back.

Lewis Hamilton may lack his team-mate’s delicacy when it comes to going quickly and babying your tyres, but his aggression, his freestyle approach to overtaking, has been one of the highlights of the year.

In Sepang, where he started 20th, Lewis sliced through the field in amazing style – until he caught Adrian Sutil. The Force India wasn’t as fast as the McLaren, but it was very quick in a straight line, and driven extremely well. At that point Hamilton’s only hope of getting by was to pressurise Sutil into a mistake, but it never came.

The race was dry in Malaysia, of course, and I thought the Hamilton-Sutil duel served very well to highlight F1’s abiding problem: when grip levels are normal, overtaking is simply too difficult, and, while the layout of many circuits doesn’t help, the main culprit is aerodynamics.

As Domenicali says, the F1 car is too efficient. You only have to see how good the racing becomes when it is less efficient, when the track is damp and grip levels are reduced, to appreciate that.

Next year the controversial ‘double diffuser’ is to be banned (as it was originally intended to be from 2009 on), and that is good, but much more needs to be done.

As the powers that be contemplate the future, let them concentrate not on tricks and artifices – a minimum number of pitstops and the like – but on tailoring the next generation of Grand Prix car so that it can race more effectively.

The technical gurus may not like it, but in the end – as it should be – it’s the fans who matter most. They’re the ones who pay for it, after all.





So, how does NAM's F1 afficionados feel? Right or wrong? Good idea bad idea? What do you feel is the future path should F1 trod? Love to hear what you're thoughts are on this!

 

Well, I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't want to see a driver "manage" a race. I suppose a nice conference table would be driveable, though--maybe a nice tea tree for China; beech for Germany, and mahogany in Brazil?

Nah.

 

I gotta say, they pretty much hit the nail on the head. The thing is, the different aero regs that you put in place will just be another obstacle for the engineers to work around. I think the term "less is more" fits perfectly.

I think part of it is the tracks. So many of the Tilke tracks are the same. China is ok because it's such a compromise. Turkey is another good one. But the classic tracks are classics because they followed a simple formula....long straights with a slow corner at the end. And you know what? It works! I'm not saying lets trot out there and change all the tracks that don't fit this mold. But be more selective of the designs of the new tracks that are brought onto the calendar.

As far as cars go. I think they need to move towards a more "ground effect" dependent car. This would help the issue with cars not being able to follow closely. The tracks are so ridiculously safe now that you wouldn't have to worry about a repeat of Imola 94. Also, maybe they could limit the amount of elements on a wing. The fewer elements a wing has, theoretically, the less efficient it's going to be.

Finally, as far as the regs go. Instead of making tweaks to the chassis regs each year to slow the cars down, why cant they just make the tire manufacturer make the meats heavier? I got a chance to hold a wheel and tire off of the Super Best Friends car at Indy. It weighs little more than a basketball, it's sick!

 

Hey all... Here is some very interesting news that I came across today!

Dare we hope that the USA will finally get a GP and even hoping further that it will be at a REAL race course not some slap-dash, Mickey Mouse, street venue?!

F1: New Venue For US GP Return?
Tony George was seen in Shanghai for the Chinese Grand Prix...

GMM | Posted April 25, 2010 GMM Newswire

Tony George is interested in taking Formula One back to the United States.

The 50-year-old former boss of the Indianapolis Motor Speedway was spotted in Shanghai for the Chinese Grand Prix.

George met with F1 chief executive Bernie Ecclestone and also Zak Brown, founder and CEO of motorsport marketing firm, Just Marketing, who represents several high level sponsors according to the Indianapolis Business Journal (IBJ).

"Would Tony George love to broker a deal to bring back a US Grand Prix? Sure," said Brown.

IBJ said sources confirmed that George was in China to discuss F1's return to America and meet with potential sponsors for a race that would not necessary take place at Indianapolis.

Indeed, new Indianapolis Motor Speedway boss Jeff Bulskus said George was not in China to represent the fabled Indy 500 venue, while Ecclestone has been pushing for a street race with the New York skyline as a backdrop.

Brown said: "Tony has a lot of contacts in motorsports , and he knows how to put on a US Grand Prix."

"I think if there's a role for Tony in trying to bring Formula One back to the US, he'd be willing to help. Tony and Bernie have a very good relationship, and Tony has a lot of interest in seeing F1 return to the US," he added.

Tony George,who still has an ownership stake in the Indianapolis Motor Speedway, could not be reached for comment.

 

I dunno. Unless someone builds a big sweet new racetrack in this country, I would imagine that it would be a street course...unfortunately. And I think Tony George is just a Bernie wanna-be, so I don't think there's any depth to this shallowness when it comes to where to host a race. He just wants the $$$$.

 

F1 back to Long Beach anyone? That's the most likely street course, has the experience and the infrastructure.

Street courses in general, make me want to puke however.

 

Bernie is clear that he wants a street race in NYC.

I would go again if the USGP returned to IMS, especially if they ran the CCW Moto GP circuit. My tickets for the USGP were in Stand A Penthouse, so those tickets would now be right at the braking point for turn 1 using the CCW course.

Not to mention the Hoosier BMW CCA chapter puts on the best car corral ever. They put all the ALMS car corrals to deep shame.

I will not attend the USGP if it is in NYC.

 

I don't really like Long Beach. I've watched the IRL/Champ Car races there and it's like an American Monaco....except not as nice as Monaco. But there's next to no passing and it's narrow and not a very good track.

I'd prefer it not be in NYC, because they're going to time it so the USGP and the CGP are next to eachother on the calendar, and both of those two are within a stone's throw away from eachother. Logistically, it's great for the teams, but common, spread the wealth.

I'm just curious if Bernie is going to push for the CGP and USGP to be dawn races, to coincide better with the European TV audiences.

 

EXACTLY! Which why street circuits suck like a tornado, and I'm sorry, including Monaco.

Bernie might want a NYC GP, but I doubt the people in NYC want it.