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Electrical Bluetooth Basics?

  #1  
Old 12-10-2005, 11:02 PM
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Bluetooth Basics?

OK, I have a simple question (I hope). I have an '05 MCS with factory Navigation, HK stereo system, center console, and the MFSW. What do I need to purchase to make my Bluetooth RAZR V3 to work in my MCS? Does anyone have the part numbers needed? I don't want to put the phone into the console just for the sake of charging it! I prefer to just put it in the cup holder and plug it in to charge. I have no objestions to aftermarket products if there are any.
 
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Old 12-11-2005, 07:26 AM
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Originally Posted by MGMRAM
OK, I have a simple question (I hope). I have an '05 MCS with factory Navigation, HK stereo system, center console, and the MFSW. What do I need to purchase to make my Bluetooth RAZR V3 to work in my MCS? Does anyone have the part numbers needed? I don't want to put the phone into the console just for the sake of charging it! I prefer to just put it in the cup holder and plug it in to charge. I have no objestions to aftermarket products if there are any.
Here is a pic of the MOT 1000. Mike is hidden where the OEM mike would go. Speaker is hidden down low on passenger side. The wife uses it with her Razr everyday. Cost is far cheaper than doing anything with OEM. Works great.

 
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Old 12-11-2005, 09:09 AM
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Originally Posted by chows4us
Here is a pic of the MOT 1000. Mike is hidden where the OEM mike would go. Speaker is hidden down low on passenger side. The wife uses it with her Razr everyday. Cost is far cheaper than doing anything with OEM. Works great.
Do some searching in this forum -- there are plenty of installs/discussions.

If you'd rather have something integrated into the factory stereo (route calls through the stereo speakers and auto-mute music) and/or have the MFSW and want the phone buttons to work, check out the options at newministuff.com.

The two factory options are expensive and annoying. Folks have had success with the Nokia CK-7W and the Parrott 3000/3100 with the interface cables from Mike.

I'm leaning towards the 3100 b/c I know the voice tag features work well with my Treo.

--dwf
 
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Old 12-11-2005, 09:52 AM
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So from an electronics "for idiots" perspective, what exactly do I need to get the hands free setup working in my MINI, and save a few bucks off of OE?
I do want to use the MF controls and the built in microphone and the phone thru my HK. My provider is Nextel, and I might be able to switch to a Blackberry, which is Blutooth enabled, I am waiting for my credit card processor to also come out with a Blutooth, credit swipe machine and printer. It's due in the next few months or so, as well. Thanks. Unfortunately with contracts and all I have been locked into Nextel for a few years, but then again they are now Sprint so maybe there are some options there.
 
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Old 12-11-2005, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by CDMINI
So from an electronics "for idiots" perspective, what exactly do I need to get the hands free setup working in my MINI, and save a few bucks off of OE?
I do want to use the MF controls and the built in microphone and the phone thru my HK. My provider is Nextel...
You have to have a phone with Bluetooth. It has nothing to do with your provider.

While there are plenty of slight variances (anyone who's worked with Bluetooth at all is now laughing their collective *** off) in Bluetooth from device to device, what you want is a Bluetooth car kit and a phone that supports Hands-Free or Hands-Free Car Kit modes.

The kit and phone are "paired" once to create a trusted relationship. Then when in your car, your phone will send/take all audio to/from the kit. There are advanced features like voice dialing and caller ID that your kit may support.

In general a Bluetooth car kit works just like an installed car kit, but all audio (and maybe some data, like caller ID) travels wirelessly instead of with cables or wires.

The downside of an aftermarket kit (vs. either of the MINI kits) is that the clearly labelled Phone buttons on the MFSW are not integrated. That's where New MINI stuff kicks in. Mike has made wiring harnesses that fit between the car kits and your MINI so that you get stereo and MFSW integration.

Caveats: My MINI is on order. I've never installed any of these, but will once my MINI arrives. I do work for a cell phone company, so I know a bit about Bluetooth.

More can be found out about specific car kits in MINIs by searching this forum.

Hope this helps.

--dwf
 
  #6  
Old 12-11-2005, 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by CDMINI
I do want to use the MF controls and the built in microphone and the phone thru my HK.
There is no "built-in mike". ALL MINIs just have the little space there for where it would go.

You also might NOT want to use the stereo speakers for the voice. They are not meant to reproduce the human voice. Rather, the speaker that comes with a top grade aftermarket unit is meant exactly to reproduce the human voice. That doesnt mean you can't have it mute the stereo when talking.
 
  #7  
Old 12-11-2005, 05:02 PM
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Originally Posted by chows4us
You also might NOT want to use the stereo speakers for the voice. They are not meant to reproduce the human voice. Rather, the speaker that comes with a top grade aftermarket unit is meant exactly to reproduce the human voice. That doesnt mean you can't have it mute the stereo when talking.
It sets unfair expectations to use "exact reproduction," "voice" and "cell phones" in the same paragraph. Instead, it's all about perceived quality by the listener.

Carkits are a convenience item, and some would argue a safety item. Bluetooth makes your carkit even more convenient -- mostly because you're more likely to upgrade your phone than your car in their relative lifetimes.

The market for car kits is relatively small compared to the number of cell phones sold each year. Thanks to Bluetooth, that percentage is going up -- espeically if you include the OEM units shipping from many car makers now.

I don't want to get into an argument that involves graphs, but I'm betting that the rule of profit margin says more time and money have been spent on the quality of your MINI's sound sytem.

--dwf
 
  #8  
Old 12-11-2005, 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by dwfrank
....

I don't want to get into an argument that involves graphs, but I'm betting that the rule of profit margin says more time and money have been spent on the quality of your MINI's sound sytem.
doubtful. Many ppl feel the HK is terrible. That aside,. I am only quoting what was said to me by the people who installed it when I said hook it up to the stereo they said "bad mistake" and etc. etc. etc and explained why. There IS a reason they include a speaker with those kits and its not for bling. Made sense to me.
 
  #9  
Old 12-11-2005, 07:30 PM
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many of the speakers included in the kits have a limited frequency range, as do most phones. I do not necessarily agree that they are better for the human voice, just that they may be "clearer" for phones and most people's perception.
 
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Old 12-13-2005, 01:06 PM
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I have the IControl from Advanced Navigation. I hooked it up to the harness at the radio head unit to get power and to mute the radio. The plug-n-play harness that they offer only works with the HK radio.
So far I am very pleased and the sound through their speaker is first rate.
Alan
 
  #11  
Old 12-13-2005, 01:49 PM
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I was planning on ordering the OEM from Mini for built-in BlueTooth what problems are being encountered with this factory set up? I have a Audiovox 6600 phone with bluetooth, I understand that the phone and "receiver" nee to be "tuned" for the two to work propertly but is that a big problem to deal with? Is the factory bluetooth capable of voice dialing?

Sorry for all the questions but I would like to go factory if possible but if there are too many problems I don't want to spend the money on it.
 
  #12  
Old 12-15-2005, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by krenzkes
I was planning on ordering the OEM from Mini for built-in BlueTooth what problems are being encountered with this factory set up? I have a Audiovox 6600 phone with bluetooth, I understand that the phone and "receiver" nee to be "tuned" for the two to work propertly but is that a big problem to deal with? Is the factory bluetooth capable of voice dialing?

Sorry for all the questions but I would like to go factory if possible but if there are too many problems I don't want to spend the money on it.
For what it's worth, I just got an '04 MCS with HK & the Mini Bluetooth option. My phone is a Motorola, 330 I think, bluetooth. The phone paired instantly and the whole system works great. People I've talked to say I sound very clear. The integration with the car is wonderful, muting the stereo etc. You can easily change the volume while in a call too. And, if I dial out on my phone (as opposed to having voice dial from the car's 36 contact list (x 4 - each contact can have 4 phone numbers associated with it), I just hit the button and the car's system takes over the call. Storing new contacts is easy, the system's interface is too. The only thing I noticed is the car's voice activation control seems to like a certain enunciation when I tell it to 'save entry' to complete a new stored number.

No experience here with any other system except the Mini Bluetooth, but it works and works well for me!
 
  #13  
Old 12-15-2005, 08:30 PM
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Originally Posted by krenzkes
... I understand that the phone and "receiver" nee to be "tuned" for the two to work propertly but is that a big problem to deal with?
Tuned? I'm not so sure about that. Bluetooth devices either work or don't work, there's no tuning involved. Bluetooth is an annoying spec, with lots of nasty corners and ambiguities. Ask anyone who's worked on a BT product of any kind.

What this means is that it's always worth testing yourself or seeing if the car kit vendor has tested with your phone. The former is usually easier because, as I mentioned earlier, there's only so much interoperability testing a vendor can do without affecting the profit margin on the product.

To reassure you a bit, as long as your phone supports the Hands Free Car Kit Profile, which it likely does, you have a very reasonable chance of it working with any car kit. You may have to play with phone orientation a bit to get a clear/consistent signal all the time. But this usally means just turning it in the cupholder.

So find someone who has the kit you want and try and pair with it. That's the best test.

--dwf
 
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Old 12-16-2005, 08:00 AM
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Ok, so in a week, I'll be getting Verizon's version of the Razr. If I purchase the kit from newmini...will that be all I need? I won't need anything else? Also, it will mute the radio, and play through the speakers, correct? Thanks!
 
  #15  
Old 12-16-2005, 08:22 AM
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Actually the kit you'll be getting from newministuff is just a wiring harness that will mute the radio and take the audio output from your bluetooth kit and route it to your stereo's speakers.

Before you even get the kit from newministuff, you will need to actually purchase a bluetooth car kit. Their harnesses are specific to the individual bluetooth kits. I believe they only carry harnesses for Nokia, Sony-Ericsson, and Parrot kits... Since you're in the states, it's not recommended that you purchase your bluetooth kit from newministuff, just the wiring harness. That's because with the exchange rate and cost of shipping, it's cheaper for you to by a kit in the US than get it from newministuff and have it shipped from the UK.

The good news is that your bluetooth phone should work with a bluetooth kit from any manufacturer. That's the beauty of a standard!
 
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Old 12-16-2005, 09:23 AM
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So I would have to purchase the Sony-Ericson, Nokia, or Parrot Bluetooth kit in order for the part from new mini to work? Is there something that would work with a motorola kit (mute radio & play through the speakers)?
 
  #17  
Old 12-16-2005, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Want-a-mini
So I would have to purchase the Sony-Ericson, Nokia, or Parrot Bluetooth kit in order for the part from new mini to work? Is there something that would work with a motorola kit (mute radio & play through the speakers)?
Newministuff doesn't sell the kit for the Motorola, but there are people in this thread that have this kit. So clearly harnesses exist, but with limited functionality.

A RAZR should work with anything recent, like the Parrott 3100 or certainly the Moto BT kit. After all, you'd hope they'd test their own phones with their car kits.

The big thing we like about Mike's harnesses is that they allow the phone buttons on the MFSW to work with the BT kits. Therefore you can hide the (small) interface module away (glovebox? armrest? parcel shelf?) for everyday usage, thus keeping your MINI looking stock.

--dwf
 
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Old 12-16-2005, 11:56 AM
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Ah, well, I do have a multifunction SW, but it's a 2 spoke, and I've read several threads on people trying to get that dead button to do something, but apparently, there's no use for it yet?
 
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Old 12-16-2005, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by dwfrank
Newministuff doesn't sell the kit for the Motorola, but there are people in this thread that have this kit. So clearly harnesses exist, but with limited functionality.

A RAZR should work with anything recent, like the Parrott 3100 or certainly the Moto BT kit. After all, you'd hope they'd test their own phones with their car kits.

The big thing we like about Mike's harnesses is that they allow the phone buttons on the MFSW to work with the BT kits. Therefore you can hide the (small) interface module away (glovebox? armrest? parcel shelf?) for everyday usage, thus keeping your MINI looking stock.

--dwf
I don't believe that anyone is using Moto kits to route sound through the stereo, however they are probably connecting up and using the radio mute connection. With the Moto kits I believe the audio out is routed to an external speaker. All of the kits on the market come with external speakers.

As for what will work with the Razr, provided that the Razr supports the Bluetooth handsfree or handsfree car kit profiles (which I'm pretty sure it does, Moto is good about that) then it should work with anybody's kit.

Again, Bluetooth is a standard, so as long as your device supports the needed profiles (like handsfree etc...) then it will work with any other device that requires the same profile...
 
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Old 12-18-2005, 08:04 PM
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Still need answer!!

I still have not recieved a simple answer to my original question; What EXACTLY do I need to use the MFSW and NAV with my bluetooth phone? What wiring harness? Will the system communicate with my Motorolla RAZR phone without hard wiring? I am not very techinical when it comes to electrical systems, so the simpler the better.

BLUF (bottom line up front)
 
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Old 12-18-2005, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by MGMRAM
I still have not recieved a simple answer to my original question; What EXACTLY do I need to use the MFSW and NAV with my bluetooth phone? What wiring harness? Will the system communicate with my Motorolla RAZR phone without hard wiring? I am not very techinical when it comes to electrical systems, so the simpler the better.

BLUF (bottom line up front)
First, I would pick your BT car kit. The three top choices are:
  1. Motorola 1000 blnc
  2. Parrott 3100
  3. Nokia CK-7W
Naturally, the Moto should be better tested with your RAZR. But it's also spendier. I would Google around for reviews of RAZRs with all 3 and see the pros/cons. Buy the one you decide is best.

Second, head over to NewMINIStuff's phone interface page. While Mike (he runs the site) doesn't list the wiring harness separately from the kits for all 3 (he does list the harness for the Nokia separately), I believe he will sell them separately to us over here.

Third, attempt to install yourself, or find an installer. There are lots of tips in this forum, so search a bit. Chellenges:
  • Installing the mic in an ideal location for you
  • Finding a place for the kit hardware; some recommend behind the dash just inside the drivers door. The kit's BT antenna will likely be here, so you want to test it with the place you normally put your phone when in the car. Yes, BT is rated at 10m/30ft. But that's before you factor in all the metal and radio frequencies in the cockpit.
  • Finiding the right place for your kit's control panel. You'll be using it to set things up (initial pairing, voice tags, other data from your phone), and then occasionally. The send/end will be on the MFSW.
  • Wiring it all to look stock
Hope this is more helpful than the BT digressions/rants.

--dwf
 
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Old 12-18-2005, 10:53 PM
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Actually that's not quite correct...

The ONLY kit that new ministuff lists as working with NAV and the MFSW buttons is the Nokia CK7w https://www.newministuff.com/new/sho...uctshow&id=205

The other kits can be installed in a MINI with NAV and MFSW but they can't interface with the NAV and MFSW.

ANY Bluetooth hands free car kit on the market will work with your RAZR. No wiring needed with any bluetooth kit to connect it to your phone.

Only buy the wiring harnesses from newministuff if you are in the US. Do NOT buy the bluetooth kit from him. Not because Mike isn't a really knowledgable guy who provides terrific customer service... Actually because the kits are much cheaper if you buy it in the US than if you buy it from him in the UK and then have to deal with the exchange rates and the shipping.

Shoot and e-mail to [email protected] and he will tell you exactly which wiring harness you need to order from him for the radio and bluetooth kit you're looking for. Honestly I never remember which is the wave and which is the boost radio...
 

Last edited by mbabischkin; 12-19-2005 at 04:33 PM.
  #23  
Old 12-19-2005, 01:23 AM
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I am in South Korea.
I heard that it is impossible to use 'the R/T and the telephone mark buttons' of the steering wheel in this country. Nokia CK7w is not sold here.
But, I am searching how to use them..
Are there somebody to let me to know the best way using them?
 
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Old 12-19-2005, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by uglyduck
I am in South Korea.
I heard that it is impossible to use 'the R/T and the telephone mark buttons' of the steering wheel in this country. Nokia CK7w is not sold here.
But, I am searching how to use them..
Are there somebody to let me to know the best way using them?
The reason why you're probably being told that the two phone buttons can't be used is because I would bet that the MINI kit that uses those buttons aren't available to you. Here in the US we've been told the same thing up until a few months ago, despite the fact that we knew that in the UK people were doing otherwise...

Why not just order the entire kit, wirning harness and CK7w kit from newministuff and have them ship it to Korea? The only reason why it's suggested that people in the US buy the kit seperately from the harness is because the kit is available for sale in the US for less than it would cost to purchase it overseas and ship it in...
 
  #25  
Old 12-19-2005, 08:24 AM
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as an fyi - it is [email protected]

I just sent him an email.
 

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