Drivetrain HDI now available direct from DDM
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Joined: Aug 2004
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Originally Posted by camelpilot
I know both sides to the story. Trust me. I've heard them both. And I am definitely not airing the details here, but one thing I will continue to ascertain is the HDI is, and always will be a WMS design. I have seen proof, via communication channels, how DDM were asking WMS how certain parts to the box should be specd.
Also, not related, but does DDM even have a MINI?? (I'm genuinely curious)
Also, not related, but does DDM even have a MINI?? (I'm genuinely curious)
6th Gear
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,196
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From: Hampton, VA
Originally Posted by Patagonian GT
I've tried to order twice from Randy and come up short both times in getting back at me in a timely fashion (a topic for other threads, not this one). I called Dave and he picked up and we talked for ten minutes. I don't care who's right or wrong but I know who's earned my business (don't make me work hard to spend my money!!).
One bit of feedback on the design - the metal tab that holds the battery connections needs to be tightened up - the box just rattles around. I'll bend it in a vise to get it to push the box against the HDI for stability when I remove the hardware to paint black.
Since someone asked...pics of our coated HDI (ignore the red nonsense...it's getting refinished tonight, though it does serve to help to make the product standout from an otherwise OEM look):
One bit of feedback on the design - the metal tab that holds the battery connections needs to be tightened up - the box just rattles around. I'll bend it in a vise to get it to push the box against the HDI for stability when I remove the hardware to paint black.
Since someone asked...pics of our coated HDI (ignore the red nonsense...it's getting refinished tonight, though it does serve to help to make the product standout from an otherwise OEM look):
I think you missed the bolt heads on your IC cover though
6th Gear
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,196
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From: Hampton, VA
Originally Posted by thatatvguy
Looking forward to hearing/seeing this!
It's amazing how things can get twisted around.
BTW, Bob, I went by DDM today and was going to get you some updated pics, however, he still has the car apart. I figure you know what that looks like.
Dave is a super nice guy..... he took an hour to chat with me about all kinds of stuff - including things not associated with MINIs. I'm just adding my voice to the praises of DDM Works.
PS the pics of the black DHI look good.
It's amazing how things can get twisted around.
BTW, Bob, I went by DDM today and was going to get you some updated pics, however, he still has the car apart. I figure you know what that looks like.
Dave is a super nice guy..... he took an hour to chat with me about all kinds of stuff - including things not associated with MINIs. I'm just adding my voice to the praises of DDM Works.
PS the pics of the black DHI look good.
So.....you took Dave away from working on Bob's car for an hour. He's trying to get it finished to get the kit to Monterey and maybe MTTS.
Then you come here and tell everyone
What were you thinking??
Originally Posted by obehave
It's not me this time
Originally Posted by obehave
So.....you took Dave away from working on Bob's car for an hour. He's trying to get it finished to get the kit to Monterey and maybe MTTS.
Then you come here and tell everyone
What were you thinking??
Then you come here and tell everyone
What were you thinking??
You seriously crack me up!!
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6th Gear
Joined: Sep 2004
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Originally Posted by Patagonian GT
I've tried to order twice from Randy and come up short both times in getting back at me in a timely fashion (a topic for other threads, not this one). I called Dave and he picked up and we talked for ten minutes. I don't care who's right or wrong but I know who's earned my business (don't make me work hard to spend my money!!).
One bit of feedback on the design - the metal tab that holds the battery connections needs to be tightened up - the box just rattles around. I'll bend it in a vise to get it to push the box against the HDI for stability when I remove the hardware to paint black.
Since someone asked...pics of our coated HDI (ignore the red nonsense...it's getting refinished tonight, though it does serve to help to make the product standout from an otherwise OEM look):
One bit of feedback on the design - the metal tab that holds the battery connections needs to be tightened up - the box just rattles around. I'll bend it in a vise to get it to push the box against the HDI for stability when I remove the hardware to paint black.
Since someone asked...pics of our coated HDI (ignore the red nonsense...it's getting refinished tonight, though it does serve to help to make the product standout from an otherwise OEM look):
4th Gear
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 437
Likes: 0
From: Greenville, SC
Originally Posted by obehave
So.....you took Dave away from working on Bob's car for an hour. He's trying to get it finished to get the kit to Monterey and maybe MTTS.
Then you come here and tell everyone
What were you thinking??
Then you come here and tell everyone
What were you thinking??
Well, I won't tell you what he was working on when I got there.
Originally Posted by thatatvguy
Dave is a super nice guy..... he took an hour to chat with me about all kinds of stuff - including things not associated with MINIs.
minus 1 hour work on SpideyX's car You might want to register under a new name here on NAM .hey, lets all call and speak to Dave - just kiddy SpideyX.
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6th Gear
Joined: Sep 2004
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Originally Posted by Bahamabart
minus 1 hour work on SpideyX's car You might want to register under a new name here on NAM .hey, lets all call and speak to Dave - just kiddy SpideyX.
Manufacturer
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 92
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Hello everyone,
I was made aware of the post earlier in this thread accusing us of stealing the intake from WMS, and have been trying to figure out what to say in reply to that post all afternoon. After the amount of work we put into that product it really hurt to be accused of stealing the product from WMS.
The poster said that he had heard both sides of the story, although I do not believe that I have ever talked with him, and hence he has not heard or seen our overwelming evidence that the intake is of our design, and had made his judgement without all of the facts. This is unfortunate, and the judgement he made, based solely on the story that WMS had told him, was certainly biased in their favor. I understand a friend and customers loyalty to a vendor, as that has helped in our success also. However, I did not want anyone to go on believing what was stated in the earlier post was accurate. There are only two people that really know what went on, and even both of us seem to have different ideas of who said what, and what the general timeline of how the DDM intake was developed.
Everyone is free to go on believing whatever they want. To argue back and forth on this board and air dirty laundry about another vendor is unproffesional, childish and I will not be a part of it. However there have been patterns with WMS that I have seen after talking with several other MINI vendors and doing some research on NAM, and DDMWorks has not been the first person accused of stealing an idea from WMS.
I have nothing personally against Randy, as I wish him the best. Hopefully he will be able to re-organize his small part time business and supply the level of customer service that has become expected by customers and other vendors.
Meanwhile, DDMWorks will continue to design exciting new products like the M62 supercharger kit, intercooler diverter, etc. and deliver those products in a timely manner and provide the best customer experience we can to the MINI community.
Take Care,
Dave
I was made aware of the post earlier in this thread accusing us of stealing the intake from WMS, and have been trying to figure out what to say in reply to that post all afternoon. After the amount of work we put into that product it really hurt to be accused of stealing the product from WMS.
The poster said that he had heard both sides of the story, although I do not believe that I have ever talked with him, and hence he has not heard or seen our overwelming evidence that the intake is of our design, and had made his judgement without all of the facts. This is unfortunate, and the judgement he made, based solely on the story that WMS had told him, was certainly biased in their favor. I understand a friend and customers loyalty to a vendor, as that has helped in our success also. However, I did not want anyone to go on believing what was stated in the earlier post was accurate. There are only two people that really know what went on, and even both of us seem to have different ideas of who said what, and what the general timeline of how the DDM intake was developed.
Everyone is free to go on believing whatever they want. To argue back and forth on this board and air dirty laundry about another vendor is unproffesional, childish and I will not be a part of it. However there have been patterns with WMS that I have seen after talking with several other MINI vendors and doing some research on NAM, and DDMWorks has not been the first person accused of stealing an idea from WMS.
I have nothing personally against Randy, as I wish him the best. Hopefully he will be able to re-organize his small part time business and supply the level of customer service that has become expected by customers and other vendors.
Meanwhile, DDMWorks will continue to design exciting new products like the M62 supercharger kit, intercooler diverter, etc. and deliver those products in a timely manner and provide the best customer experience we can to the MINI community.
Take Care,
Dave
4th Gear
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 772
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From: Denver, CO
Originally Posted by Dave@ddmworks
Hello everyone,
I was made aware of the post earlier in this thread accusing us of stealing the intake from WMS, and have been trying to figure out what to say in reply to that post all afternoon. After the amount of work we put into that product it really hurt to be accused of stealing the product from WMS.
The poster said that he had heard both sides of the story, although I do not believe that I have ever talked with him, and hence he has not heard or seen our overwelming evidence that the intake is of our design, and had made his judgement without all of the facts. This is unfortunate, and the judgement he made, based solely on the story that WMS had told him, was certainly biased in their favor. I understand a friend and customers loyalty to a vendor, as that has helped in our success also. However, I did not want anyone to go on believing what was stated in the earlier post was accurate. There are only two people that really know what went on, and even both of us seem to have different ideas of who said what, and what the general timeline of how the DDM intake was developed.
Everyone is free to go on believing whatever they want. To argue back and forth on this board and air dirty laundry about another vendor is unproffesional, childish and I will not be a part of it. However there have been patterns with WMS that I have seen after talking with several other MINI vendors and doing some research on NAM, and DDMWorks has not been the first person accused of stealing an idea from WMS.
I have nothing personally against Randy, as I wish him the best. Hopefully he will be able to re-organize his small part time business and supply the level of customer service that has become expected by customers and other vendors.
Meanwhile, DDMWorks will continue to design exciting new products like the M62 supercharger kit, intercooler diverter, etc. and deliver those products in a timely manner and provide the best customer experience we can to the MINI community.
Take Care,
Dave
I was made aware of the post earlier in this thread accusing us of stealing the intake from WMS, and have been trying to figure out what to say in reply to that post all afternoon. After the amount of work we put into that product it really hurt to be accused of stealing the product from WMS.
The poster said that he had heard both sides of the story, although I do not believe that I have ever talked with him, and hence he has not heard or seen our overwelming evidence that the intake is of our design, and had made his judgement without all of the facts. This is unfortunate, and the judgement he made, based solely on the story that WMS had told him, was certainly biased in their favor. I understand a friend and customers loyalty to a vendor, as that has helped in our success also. However, I did not want anyone to go on believing what was stated in the earlier post was accurate. There are only two people that really know what went on, and even both of us seem to have different ideas of who said what, and what the general timeline of how the DDM intake was developed.
Everyone is free to go on believing whatever they want. To argue back and forth on this board and air dirty laundry about another vendor is unproffesional, childish and I will not be a part of it. However there have been patterns with WMS that I have seen after talking with several other MINI vendors and doing some research on NAM, and DDMWorks has not been the first person accused of stealing an idea from WMS.
I have nothing personally against Randy, as I wish him the best. Hopefully he will be able to re-organize his small part time business and supply the level of customer service that has become expected by customers and other vendors.
Meanwhile, DDMWorks will continue to design exciting new products like the M62 supercharger kit, intercooler diverter, etc. and deliver those products in a timely manner and provide the best customer experience we can to the MINI community.
Take Care,
Dave
Just because the owner of a business has multiple commitments (Randy is an airline pilot as well) does not mean the business is part time, or small. We have over 2500 customers, all but a few of which are MINI owners (the rest are Lotus owners).
As for the design of the intake, we were sent a working prototype which was completely changed through OUR ideas here at WMS (we had the cars to do it and the knowledge of the MINI). We would be happy to post some pics of before and after units. There are several design implementations that had no input at all from DDM.
Camelpilot has been here having his WMS head installed (he drove out from LA) and can attest to the health of our business. We currently have a Lotus Turbo conversion, an '06 Cooper S SCCA race car conversion, a TurboKompressor/many more things on an '02, a brand new Stage 2 WMS kit from the dealer, and a brake conversion/oil change on an '05. That doesn't count the folks who are in for routine installs or 1 day installs (like Camelpilot yesterday for a cylinder head).
We won't be dragged down into an immoral he said she said. We will continue to develop our own products and use our knowledge base to make the best products available for the MINI. In the future, those products will remain ours - we are building many of them in house now (Camelpilot saw our production facilities as well).
-Brian
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6th Gear
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,149
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Originally Posted by Brian@WebbMotorsports
Part time? Were you at your shop till 1am this morning and back at it again by 9:00?
Just because the owner of a business has multiple commitments (Randy is an airline pilot as well) does not mean the business is part time, or small. We have over 2500 customers, all but a few of which are MINI owners (the rest are Lotus owners).
As for the design of the intake, we were sent a working prototype which was completely changed through OUR ideas here at WMS (we had the cars to do it and the knowledge of the MINI). We would be happy to post some pics of before and after units. There are several design implementations that had no input at all from DDM.
Camelpilot has been here having his WMS head installed (he drove out from LA) and can attest to the health of our business. We currently have a Lotus Turbo conversion, an '06 Cooper S SCCA race car conversion, a TurboKompressor/many more things on an '02, a brand new Stage 2 WMS kit from the dealer, and a brake conversion/oil change on an '05. That doesn't count the folks who are in for routine installs or 1 day installs (like Camelpilot yesterday for a cylinder head).
We won't be dragged down into an immoral he said she said. We will continue to develop our own products and use our knowledge base to make the best products available for the MINI. In the future, those products will remain ours - we are building many of them in house now (Camelpilot saw our production facilities as well).
-Brian
Just because the owner of a business has multiple commitments (Randy is an airline pilot as well) does not mean the business is part time, or small. We have over 2500 customers, all but a few of which are MINI owners (the rest are Lotus owners).
As for the design of the intake, we were sent a working prototype which was completely changed through OUR ideas here at WMS (we had the cars to do it and the knowledge of the MINI). We would be happy to post some pics of before and after units. There are several design implementations that had no input at all from DDM.
Camelpilot has been here having his WMS head installed (he drove out from LA) and can attest to the health of our business. We currently have a Lotus Turbo conversion, an '06 Cooper S SCCA race car conversion, a TurboKompressor/many more things on an '02, a brand new Stage 2 WMS kit from the dealer, and a brake conversion/oil change on an '05. That doesn't count the folks who are in for routine installs or 1 day installs (like Camelpilot yesterday for a cylinder head).
We won't be dragged down into an immoral he said she said. We will continue to develop our own products and use our knowledge base to make the best products available for the MINI. In the future, those products will remain ours - we are building many of them in house now (Camelpilot saw our production facilities as well).
-Brian
RSpeed in Atlanta was involved in the origination and development....I saw the working prototype before WMS was ever involved......I spoke with them this afternoon to confirm the level of completion vs its current form........obviously there is a pretty big diffference of opinion as to the origin between DDM and WMS..... since both parties have stated that,...... there is no point in argueing this out in a public forum, I think at this time it is time to stop and let the free market decide......Additionally, I have represented over 200 mfgs in a 25 year career and there are a myriad of reasons why vendors and dealers decide not to do business with each other ..... Dave and Randy know the reasons that the business relationship was terminated...... I see nothing positive to be gained from this thread going forward if this is its tone...... I think that it may be time for this thread to be locked......unless it can get back to the original discussion
Banned
Joined: Aug 2004
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How about locking it?
If DDM is a vendor, let them post their intent to sell the HDI.
You started this thread as a thinly disguised Vendor Announcement. By your own admission, you knew that there was a certain controversy surrounding this item. If you want to avoid the ensuing controversy I suggest you have Dave do what Peter, Randy, Eric and countless others have done - apply for Vendor status and post announcements as such.
If DDM is a vendor, let them post their intent to sell the HDI.
You started this thread as a thinly disguised Vendor Announcement. By your own admission, you knew that there was a certain controversy surrounding this item. If you want to avoid the ensuing controversy I suggest you have Dave do what Peter, Randy, Eric and countless others have done - apply for Vendor status and post announcements as such.
Banned
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,328
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Originally Posted by Dave@ddmworks
Hello everyone,
I was made aware of the post earlier in this thread accusing us of stealing the intake from WMS, and have been trying to figure out what to say in reply to that post all afternoon. After the amount of work we put into that product it really hurt to be accused of stealing the product from WMS.
The poster said that he had heard both sides of the story, although I do not believe that I have ever talked with him, and hence he has not heard or seen our overwelming evidence that the intake is of our design, and had made his judgement without all of the facts. This is unfortunate, and the judgement he made, based solely on the story that WMS had told him, was certainly biased in their favor. I understand a friend and customers loyalty to a vendor, as that has helped in our success also. However, I did not want anyone to go on believing what was stated in the earlier post was accurate. There are only two people that really know what went on, and even both of us seem to have different ideas of who said what, and what the general timeline of how the DDM intake was developed.
Everyone is free to go on believing whatever they want. To argue back and forth on this board and air dirty laundry about another vendor is unproffesional, childish and I will not be a part of it. However there have been patterns with WMS that I have seen after talking with several other MINI vendors and doing some research on NAM, and DDMWorks has not been the first person accused of stealing an idea from WMS.
I have nothing personally against Randy, as I wish him the best. Hopefully he will be able to re-organize his small part time business and supply the level of customer service that has become expected by customers and other vendors.
Meanwhile, DDMWorks will continue to design exciting new products like the M62 supercharger kit, intercooler diverter, etc. and deliver those products in a timely manner and provide the best customer experience we can to the MINI community.
Take Care,
Dave
I was made aware of the post earlier in this thread accusing us of stealing the intake from WMS, and have been trying to figure out what to say in reply to that post all afternoon. After the amount of work we put into that product it really hurt to be accused of stealing the product from WMS.
The poster said that he had heard both sides of the story, although I do not believe that I have ever talked with him, and hence he has not heard or seen our overwelming evidence that the intake is of our design, and had made his judgement without all of the facts. This is unfortunate, and the judgement he made, based solely on the story that WMS had told him, was certainly biased in their favor. I understand a friend and customers loyalty to a vendor, as that has helped in our success also. However, I did not want anyone to go on believing what was stated in the earlier post was accurate. There are only two people that really know what went on, and even both of us seem to have different ideas of who said what, and what the general timeline of how the DDM intake was developed.
Everyone is free to go on believing whatever they want. To argue back and forth on this board and air dirty laundry about another vendor is unproffesional, childish and I will not be a part of it. However there have been patterns with WMS that I have seen after talking with several other MINI vendors and doing some research on NAM, and DDMWorks has not been the first person accused of stealing an idea from WMS.
I have nothing personally against Randy, as I wish him the best. Hopefully he will be able to re-organize his small part time business and supply the level of customer service that has become expected by customers and other vendors.
Meanwhile, DDMWorks will continue to design exciting new products like the M62 supercharger kit, intercooler diverter, etc. and deliver those products in a timely manner and provide the best customer experience we can to the MINI community.
Take Care,
Dave
Additionally your simultaneous declaration of not engaging in dirty laundering and wishing WMS the best was almost immediately followed by comments insinuating that WMS pathologically accuses others of stealing their ideas and that his service to other vendors is suspect.
While you can certainly make the claim that Camelpilot knows only Randy's side of the story, I can make the same point with SpiderX.
In the meantime, if you're going to be a Vendor on this forum, I would hope that the Admins require you to do what WMS, M7, Helix, Craven, Alta, etc have done - actually become one.
4th Gear
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 400
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From: Leesburg, VA
Originally Posted by Skiploder
In the meantime, if you're going to be a Vendor on this forum, I would hope that the Admins require you to do what WMS, M7, Helix, Craven, Alta, etc have done - actually become one.
he's one step ahead of you See the purple highlight and 'manufacturer'? Yeah....it's been like this since he first postedhttps://www.northamericanmotoring.co...er.php?u=26467
Banned
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,328
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by MiniMargie
he's one step ahead of you See the purple highlight and 'manufacturer'? Yeah....it's been like this since he first postedhttps://www.northamericanmotoring.co...er.php?u=26467
man·u·fac·tur·er
Pronunciation: -'fak-ch&r-&r, -'fak-shr&r
Function: noun
: one that manufactures;
ven·dor
Pronunciation: 'ven-d&r, for 1 also ven-'dor
Function: noun
: one that vends : SELLER
From the site guidelines:
VENDOR
If you wish to advertise and/or perform market research on North American Motoring, you must be a paying vendor. Click on Contact Us found in the Main Menu block to learn more.
This thread is titled "HDI Available Direct from DDM". While he may manufacture the HDI, he is also selling it. He is therefore a vendor. As illustrated by our friends at Websters, that's different from a manufacturer.
4th Gear
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 353
Likes: 0
From: Hollis, NH
Just received my HDI from Dave at DDM, today. Fast, friendly service - I can't ask for more.
Without the NAM forums, I would not have known about nor would have even cared who designed or makes the HDI; I figured it was Webb - and as far as I knew the only place to buy one. After WMS' failure to deliver my HDI order as committed, I was delighted to get the item in a timely fashion from DDM.
IMO, if WMS had delivered or kept me in the loop as to when delivery could be realistically expected, I would have been quite satisfied. Surely, this, and numerous similar threads would be of an entirely different tone.
Without the NAM forums, I would not have known about nor would have even cared who designed or makes the HDI; I figured it was Webb - and as far as I knew the only place to buy one. After WMS' failure to deliver my HDI order as committed, I was delighted to get the item in a timely fashion from DDM.
IMO, if WMS had delivered or kept me in the loop as to when delivery could be realistically expected, I would have been quite satisfied. Surely, this, and numerous similar threads would be of an entirely different tone.
Thread Starter
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6th Gear
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,149
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by Skiploder
Your point being?
man·u·fac·tur·er
Pronunciation: -'fak-ch&r-&r, -'fak-shr&r
Function: noun
: one that manufactures;
ven·dor
Pronunciation: 'ven-d&r, for 1 also ven-'dor
Function: noun
: one that vends : SELLER
From the site guidelines:
VENDOR
If you wish to advertise and/or perform market research on North American Motoring, you must be a paying vendor. Click on Contact Us found in the Main Menu block to learn more.
This thread is titled "HDI Available Direct from DDM". While he may manufacture the HDI, he is also selling it. He is therefore a vendor. As illustrated by our friends at Websters, that's different from a manufacturer.
man·u·fac·tur·er
Pronunciation: -'fak-ch&r-&r, -'fak-shr&r
Function: noun
: one that manufactures;
ven·dor
Pronunciation: 'ven-d&r, for 1 also ven-'dor
Function: noun
: one that vends : SELLER
From the site guidelines:
VENDOR
If you wish to advertise and/or perform market research on North American Motoring, you must be a paying vendor. Click on Contact Us found in the Main Menu block to learn more.
This thread is titled "HDI Available Direct from DDM". While he may manufacture the HDI, he is also selling it. He is therefore a vendor. As illustrated by our friends at Websters, that's different from a manufacturer.
with regard to "thinly disguised"..... I don't think I disguised it at all...... there was no intention to disguise anything...... I think I just made the announcement for DDM as a favor and again I and I am sure Dave felt we were in the rules of NAM before I did it.....my previous comment and commitment apply.
As far as controversy......and what I know..... I choose not to be baited into that discussion...thank you
pug poo picker-upper
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 9,803
Likes: 30
From: California
To the first order Manufacturers build parts, and Vendors sell them. Both designations are made by NAM only if the company has an agreement in place and is a site supporting company. This is semantics in titling in this case, as both are totally legitimate ways to support the site.
In DDM's case the manufacturer designation was made initially due to their development phase of the M62 project that they wanted to be able to discuss more openly on the forum. The HDI sales started after they became a "manufacturer" in title on the site. That said, it is really just a titling difference. "Manufacturers" and "Vendors" both have agreements in place with Mark in order to be on the site.
In DDM's case the manufacturer designation was made initially due to their development phase of the M62 project that they wanted to be able to discuss more openly on the forum. The HDI sales started after they became a "manufacturer" in title on the site. That said, it is really just a titling difference. "Manufacturers" and "Vendors" both have agreements in place with Mark in order to be on the site.
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6th Gear
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Originally Posted by Dave
To the first order Manufacturers build parts, and Vendors sell them. Both designations are made by NAM only if the company has an agreement in place and is a site supporting company. This is semantics in titling in this case, as both are totally legitimate ways to support the site.
In DDM's case the manufacturer designation was made initially due to their development phase of the M62 project that they wanted to be able to discuss more openly on the forum. The HDI sales started after they became a "manufacturer" in title on the site. That said, it is really just a titling difference. "Manufacturers" and "Vendors" both have agreements in place with Mark in order to be on the site.
In DDM's case the manufacturer designation was made initially due to their development phase of the M62 project that they wanted to be able to discuss more openly on the forum. The HDI sales started after they became a "manufacturer" in title on the site. That said, it is really just a titling difference. "Manufacturers" and "Vendors" both have agreements in place with Mark in order to be on the site.
pug poo picker-upper
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 9,803
Likes: 30
From: California
Originally Posted by SpiderX
So Dave can I assume the announcement was within the guidelines?
This is not an issue they should be badgered over. They are a site supporting company. There is no issue here as far as I'm concerned. They have an agreement in place. They have done the right thing.