Drivetrain Randy Webb's new exhaust
6th Gear
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,922
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From: Midwest
Originally Posted by xsmini
So Randy, where is the sign up list for this thing?
Nik
I do have a few questions though:
Can you order a JCW kit without the exhaust?
B/C THAT CRAP DOESN'T SOUND ANYWHERE NEAR THIS GOOD!Does the JCW intake sound like the alta because that thing is HOT!??
Mike
oh man I just got drool all over my keyboard!
4th Gear
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 378
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From: Jacksonville FL
Randy,
Someone brought up the idea of cutting out the additional 90degree bends and having the exhaust exit similar to the dual exhaust on other cars. I know there is one system out there (forget name) that does this and includes a new valance. Would this improve the gains any and maybe lower the cost a bit by eliminated 4 additional bends in the system (after factoring the cost of the valance of course)? Just curious, I know others might prefer to keep the center exit though.
Someone brought up the idea of cutting out the additional 90degree bends and having the exhaust exit similar to the dual exhaust on other cars. I know there is one system out there (forget name) that does this and includes a new valance. Would this improve the gains any and maybe lower the cost a bit by eliminated 4 additional bends in the system (after factoring the cost of the valance of course)? Just curious, I know others might prefer to keep the center exit though.
2nd Gear
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 131
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Originally Posted by doomsdaybob
Randy,
Someone brought up the idea of cutting out the additional 90degree bends and having the exhaust exit similar to the dual exhaust on other cars. I know there is one system out there (forget name) that does this and includes a new valance. Would this improve the gains any and maybe lower the cost a bit by eliminated 4 additional bends in the system (after factoring the cost of the valance of course)? Just curious, I know others might prefer to keep the center exit though.
Someone brought up the idea of cutting out the additional 90degree bends and having the exhaust exit similar to the dual exhaust on other cars. I know there is one system out there (forget name) that does this and includes a new valance. Would this improve the gains any and maybe lower the cost a bit by eliminated 4 additional bends in the system (after factoring the cost of the valance of course)? Just curious, I know others might prefer to keep the center exit though.
6th Gear
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,652
Likes: 6
From: Lansdale, PA
Don't forget that exhaust gas cannot be modelled as a steady-state flow. It pulses and pressure waves can do very unexpected things. This should be required reading for anyone doing exhaust design:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg.../-/0837603099/
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg.../-/0837603099/
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6th Gear
Joined: Sep 2004
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Originally Posted by ChiliCooperS
MY QUESTION EXACTLY! SPIDERX YOU HAVE IMO THE BEST EXHAUST ON THE MARKET IN YOUR CAR RIGHT NOW!
I do have a few questions though:
Can you order a JCW kit without the exhaust? B/C THAT CRAP DOESN'T SOUND ANYWHERE NEAR THIS GOOD!
Does the JCW intake sound like the alta because that thing is HOT!??
Mike
oh man I just got drool all over my keyboard!
I do have a few questions though:
Can you order a JCW kit without the exhaust?
B/C THAT CRAP DOESN'T SOUND ANYWHERE NEAR THIS GOOD!Does the JCW intake sound like the alta because that thing is HOT!??
Mike
oh man I just got drool all over my keyboard!
I'm sure you got my PM
I don't know about the JCW intake as I had a Dinan before the Alta and the Alta is twice as loud as the Dinan.
I think that Randy could offer this exhaust in a few versions. get your orders in .....
Thanks for the compliments and the support.
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6th Gear
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Originally Posted by andy@ross-tech.com
Don't forget that exhaust gas cannot be modelled as a steady-state flow. It pulses and pressure waves can do very unexpected things. This should be required reading for anyone doing exhaust design:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg.../-/0837603099/
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg.../-/0837603099/
2nd Gear
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 131
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Originally Posted by andy@ross-tech.com
Don't forget that exhaust gas cannot be modelled as a steady-state flow. It pulses and pressure waves can do very unexpected things. This should be required reading for anyone doing exhaust design:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg.../-/0837603099/
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg.../-/0837603099/
6th Gear
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,652
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From: Lansdale, PA
Ummmm ... you're welcome? :smile:
Originally Posted by Samurai Will
I'm really not sure who you think you are impressing, Andy. You assume right off that I use steady state flow characteristics in my models, as well as assuming that I don't know what I am doing. This is a common mistake you make when dealing with a lot of people as you hide behind your keyboard. Have you read that book yourself? Do you understand the characteristics of pressure waves in an exhaust system? Can you truly explain the why or why not of using steady state flow vs. pulsed flow? Or when it becomes an issue? Or where in the system the pulsed waves die off and the flow equalizes to a steady state flow environment? Or why? Because if so, feel free to enlighten us with your very own scientific analysis, and explain what is wrong with what I have shown and why the WMS exhaust may be hurting itself by virtue of design. Or are you just trying to inflate your NAM image with your "mad Google skillz"? If you are unable to provide anything more than a comment based on your own ineptitude, please do not seek to appear smarter or more capable than you really are and keep quiet.
6th Gear
Joined: Oct 2002
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From: Lansdale, PA
2nd Gear
Joined: Aug 2004
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I could say the same for you. You know well and good that posting the link to that book was aimed square at you berating my analysis, veiling your lack of knowledge behind a link. Nothing I said was in any way anything but fact.
6th Gear
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,652
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From: Lansdale, PA
I posted that link since it points to a book that actually is helpful for EVERYONE (myself, you, etc.) if they want to understand exhaust design. I actually have the book and it is very useful. I'm sorry if you have misinterpreted my link as a jab at you, but that was not my intention. This is a discussion about a new exhaust design. If you feel that technical information posted here is someway "berating your analysis, and veiling my lack of knowledge" then you may want to step back from the PC and go for a walk or something. Check out the book, I bet you'll find it interesting.
Originally Posted by Samurai Will
I could say the same for you. You know well and good that posting the link to that book was aimed square at you berating my analysis, veiling your lack of knowledge behind a link. Nothing I said was in any way anything but fact.
2nd Gear
Joined: Aug 2004
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If you actually have that book, then perhaps you can post some useful information that you have gleaned from it, rather than just a link.
If your intention truly was only to post a link to a book people might find useful, then I owe you an apology. However, posting the book without actually giving some indication of what specifically you were refering to, and specifically pointing out modelling, which so far as I can see you haven't done, and I have, seems to indicate that you were in fact aiming that directly at me.
If your intention truly was only to post a link to a book people might find useful, then I owe you an apology. However, posting the book without actually giving some indication of what specifically you were refering to, and specifically pointing out modelling, which so far as I can see you haven't done, and I have, seems to indicate that you were in fact aiming that directly at me.
6th Gear
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,652
Likes: 6
From: Lansdale, PA
Originally Posted by Samurai Will
If you actually have that book, then perhaps you can post some useful information that you have gleaned from it, rather than just a link.
If your intention truly was only to post a link to a book people might find useful, then I owe you an apology. However, posting the book without actually giving some indication of what specifically you were refering to, and specifically pointing out modelling, which so far as I can see you haven't done, and I have, seems to indicate that you were in fact aiming that directly at me.
If your intention truly was only to post a link to a book people might find useful, then I owe you an apology. However, posting the book without actually giving some indication of what specifically you were refering to, and specifically pointing out modelling, which so far as I can see you haven't done, and I have, seems to indicate that you were in fact aiming that directly at me.
Anyway, there are some really neat ideas about measuring pressure at different points and about syncronizing it with engine speed through some arcane methods (the book WAS written a while ago). I suspect that modern, inexpensive electronic pressure transducers and logging software could help us a lot.
BTW, as far as "hiding behind my keyboard", I'd gladly meet up with you and lend you this book if you were local to me. At SEMA, I had lengthy discussions with Jan (el diablito) as well as with Jeff (from Alta), both of whom I had disagreements in the past on the forums. I don't hide, behind a keyboard or in real life.
6th Gear
Joined: Jan 2005
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From: New Brunswick, NJ
Originally Posted by andy@ross-tech.com
I've been following the continuous-flow modelling that you did of the exhaust and am interested to see what you have come up with. Maybe you could work with Randy to incorporate some elements of his design with some elements of yours:
Originally Posted by andy@ross-tech.com
Don't forget that exhaust gas cannot be modelled as a steady-state flow. It pulses and pressure waves can do very unexpected things. This should be required reading for anyone doing exhaust design:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg.../-/0837603099/
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg.../-/0837603099/
This is a thread about Randy's exhaust, not one for you to critique others'. If you were skeptical about Will's design, you would/should not have written what you wrote in your first post- with a thumbs up, no less, you seemed to support. Then, lo and behold, you're changing your entire tone, "should be required reading for anyone doing exhaust design." I think everyone here understood the undertones in your statement, and that this much is not appreciated. I beg you now to not stand in the way of this thread, because everyone else wants to learn here, not to teach.
Please do not keep this thread off topic by acting like the forum's professor. Back to Randy's exhaust, please. Will was saying how he had real life experience and how a similar design was LOUD. I can attest to that. From the videos, I can tell that this new one is very loud, too. I even sounds like through the camera mic.
2nd Gear
Joined: Aug 2004
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Originally Posted by andy@ross-tech.com
Anyway, there are some really neat ideas about measuring pressure at different points and about syncronizing it with engine speed through some arcane methods (the book WAS written a while ago). I suspect that modern, inexpensive electronic pressure transducers and logging software could help us a lot.
BTW, as far as "hiding behind my keyboard", I'd gladly meet up with you and lend you this book if you were local to me. At SEMA, I had lengthy discussions with Jan (el diablito) as well as with Jeff (from Alta), both of whom I had disagreements in the past on the forums. I don't hide, behind a keyboard or in real life.
BTW, as far as "hiding behind my keyboard", I'd gladly meet up with you and lend you this book if you were local to me. At SEMA, I had lengthy discussions with Jan (el diablito) as well as with Jeff (from Alta), both of whom I had disagreements in the past on the forums. I don't hide, behind a keyboard or in real life.
I appreciate the offer, but I'm on the opposite coast for now. Maybe that will change in the near future, but we'll have to see. I'm sure we'll have a lot to talk about.
6th Gear
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,816
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From: New Jersey
Originally Posted by doomsdaybob
having the exhaust exit similar to the dual exhaust on other cars. I know there is one system out there (forget name) that does this and includes a new valance.
3rd Gear
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 182
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Originally Posted by FlynHawaiian
how about a group buy where we get like 25 or more orders we get 100 bucks off 
Just from the people that expressed intrest in this thread we would already have a big enough group for a pretty serious group buy. I'd be in for sure, anyone else? Randy is a group buy even a possiblity(once they are in production that is
)?
6th Gear
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 15,478
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Originally Posted by benthevegan
This is a great idea!!!!!!!!
(this is tongue in cheek
)
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6th Gear
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Originally Posted by ChiliCooperS
THESE VIDEOS ARE AWESOME. BETTER THAN ANYTHING IN THE EXHAUST REFERENCE THREAD. I have one question for spider though; what abouts is the diameter of the tips?
Mike
Mike
5th Gear
Joined: Feb 2005
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From: Raleigh, NC
Originally Posted by Samurai Will
You assume right off that I use steady state flow characteristics in my models, as well as assuming that I don't know what I am doing.
