my clutch is going bad at 45,000 miles grrrrr
i'm having it replaced and wondering if changing the flywheel is worth the extra $$$$. the replacement i'm looking at is made by RPS (as is the clutch), excellant quality and performance, weighs just under 12lbs.
i don't race just like good performance. i know this is the time to do it but don't know if it is something i need.....
please advise.

 

spec clutch and fly

 

If you don't race, skip the flywheel. Lightened ones are noisy and make launching more difficult due to less rotational mass.

Just my $.02

 

Agreed on the noise. Every aftermarket-flywheel MCS I've been in, has rattled at idle with the clutch out. For a daily driver, that could get annoying.

 

thanks for responding... is the power boost worth the chattering???
i probably will not spend the money on it, the clutch is an expense i was not anticipating as it is...

 

I keep hearing this. Can someone explain why?

I can't, for the life of me understand why a solid piece of aluminum would rattle. I guess I don't understand what the whole dual-mass thing is about. It's almost as if the stock flywheel is dampening the vibration of other parts ?

 

When your sitting at a light with the clutch out, your flywheel will actually move (slightly) with every hit of the cylinder. When it does, it'll chatter against things like the clutch. This is they UUC makes the clutch of their clutch/flywheel combo a spring hub design that has springs that will give to reduce chatter. It only happens when the clutch it out and your in neutral so if you don't mind, the engine will rev up and down much quicker.

 

is the clutch/flywheel combination in the mini made by UUC?

 

thats interesting to know!
I was thinking about if it was worth it. But you would have to be far along with mods to be bored enough it sounds to do that (for street use anyhow)

 

actually the springs in the clutch disc are there to cushion the transfer of troque from the flywheel to the driveline when engaging the clutch. the stock dampened flywheel achieves that as well as absorbing torsional pulses/vibrations from the firing cycles. the rattling noise with an un-damped fwheel comes from the transmission gears clacking around with the pulsing, throbbing, huge power impulses when idling.

 

Anyone know what the stock flywheel weighs???

 

26 pounds, if I remember correctly.

 

Wowzers!! That is one heavy sucker!! IIRC the one on the G35 is about 22 lbs, and I would assume it is MUCH bigger than the Mini one. People love going to a 14 lb flywheel on the G35, though there is an 8 lber that is a really @*@*$ to launch!!

 

I can personally testify to the fact that the additional "chatter" resulting from a lightweight flywheel is not that annoying at all. As a matter of fact, if you are in the cabin with the music on, or the windows up, it is hardly noticeable. Even when you are outside the cabin listening to the engine it is not as bad as I had perceived. Granted you can hear some chatter, but it is not "annoying" or "loud". I guess the chatter could be greater the lighter the flywheel, but if you stay in that 14-15 lb range you'll be fine. I believe the stock flywheel weighs in at a hefty 35+ pounds, so eliminating that rotational mass will put a tremendous amount of additional energy into the tires.

I recently rode in a MCS with the clutch/flywheel addition and holy crap a difference it makes, especially on the low end. I had been debating because of the "chatter" issue, but after riding in a MCS with one installed I no longer have any doubt that those will be my next mods.

 

[QUOTE]
Is there any way you can record the sound it makes I curious, since this is a mod I been thinking about!

 

The sound is not that bad and you can rarely hear it in the cockpit. If you want you can call me and ill let you listen to my car over the phone

Randy
M7 Tuning

 

I have a 15# flywheel (made by RPS) and a Spec 2 clutch. There are no problems launching the car, but this was not the case when I drove an MCS with an 8-10# flywheel. The weight savings with my flywheel does allow for quicker starts and getting up to engine speed.

However, there is a definite chatter in neutral with the clutch out. I've gotten used to it, however, others have found it to be somewhat annoying. I guess "beauty" is in the ear of the beholder ---

If you are going to replace your clutch, consider the flywheel as well, because the labor cost of doing the jobs separately would be prohibitive to most.

With all that said, if you plan on autox or tracking your car, and if you don't have a 2005 with factory LSD, then I'd strongly encourage you to consider a LSD. While pricey, IMO a LSD is an important drivetrain mod. Again, the time to do one is when you are having the clutch work.

 

All good points and on a side note there was an add in a tuner magazine for a company with a SEVEN pound flywheel. Good luck with that one! I beleive awhile back there was some postings here about a member that had installed and quickly removed ( $$$) a 9 lb unit . There is certainly a point where light is TOO light. We have found that the RPS flywheel distrubuted exclusively thru us as a M7 product is the perfect combination of improved performance and minimum amount of negative aspects .

Randy
M7 Tuning
www.m7tuning.com

 

I had a stage 1 clutch and a 9.5 pounder flywheel on my miata. I learned how to drive manual on that too!! I loved how quick it gripped, and i about had a heart attack when i found out how squishy everything is in the mini.

I'd love to have a different clutch and a lightened flywheel in the mini... even with driving 80 miles a day

 

I have the spec stage 2 clutch and flywheel. Once you learn how it responds it is no problem to drive. It does sound like a diesel at idle and when bogging the motor at low rpm. There is also some gear noise when engine braking at higher rpm in lower gears. It does not bother me or my passangers.

It does rev up faster, it's easier to rev match/double clutch and the car does accelerate quiker in lower gears.

I recently installed motor mount inserts and that made it even easier to drive, no juddering or lurching, but definitely more vibration (not noise) while idling. Gear changes are smoother too.

If you can tolerate an alta intake, this should be no problem. I wouldn't go back and I already want a clutch with even more grip.

 

One of the things that I am not happy about with the mini is the slow throttle response. It seems like you have to mash the throttle to even get the revs to jump a little. Then if you take it out of gear with the engine at high revs, the car takes a while to drop down (I am assuming it is the electronic gas pedal). I was thinking that a lightweight crank pulley (maybe a 2 or 4% one) might help with the throttle response. I wouldnt' think as much as a flywheel, but maybe enough to be noticed? I put a lightweight underdrive crank pulley on my G35 and really noticed a difference. Anyone have any ideas??

 

Of course you can't take it from me as I have a vested interest but our 2% lightweight crank pulley drops over 6 lbs and is a noticeable improvement in throttle response. My installer who knows my car better than I do noticed it immediately and certainly approved the mod. If you want I can give you his number to get his opinion.

Randy
M7 Tuning

www.M7tuning.com

 

I found that the slow response time when taking foot of accelerator, and consequent slow or clutch slipping shifting on upshifts, to take a lot of fun out of the car. I think this was due to the ECU programming and emissions issues of the MCS. I found that the MTH program adjusted this aspect of the program to reduce the response time (lag). At least as much as could be expected given the boat anchor they put on as a flywheel. I'm sure we lose 1 - 2 mpg due to the mass of the flywheel in round town driving.

I rode with Peter of M7 in his S and was amazed how quickly he could shift, and still match speeds of engine/transmission without clutch slippage. I believe he had lighter flywheel and probably MTH.

 

okay... Randy and M7... i have never ever said anything against you in the past i have just sat quitely on the sidelines when you have made comments that i do not 100% agree with... but i cant let this one go...


I do not agree with your comments about a flywheel being too light... that would be the same as saying your crank pulley is too light or a 6 lbs rim is too light...

I have had incrediably lightweight flywheels on every car i have ever owned except for my x5 4.4 (its a friggin auto) all of the flywheels i have had on my cars have ranged in weights from 5.5-9lbs depending on the car... everytime i put the flywheel in i have never noticed a difficult time driving the car or having a very difficult time launching. I have read about people stating that too light of a flywheel makes the car undriveable or unstreetable and i can personally attest that this is not true! Hell each time i put a flywheel in my car my girlfriend would say wow this is sooo much easier to drive now! seriously my opinon... and this is just my opinon from LOTS of experiance is that driveability and streetability and lightened flywheels are urban legends that have been passed around every message board on the internet!

Now i hope i don't get attacked for stating that their is no such thing as too light... afterall the flywheel can't be so light and weak that it will shatter... thats obvious...

okay... done venting... this is just something that i feel very strong about because MOST people have never driven a car with a really really light weight flywheel or maybe they have driven a car with a moderatly light flywheel... but never a 6lbs or something like that... seriously guys its not that hard to drive the car with a 6lbs flywheel... if my girl friend could do it... then im sure you can

and yes i do realize that you put light weight crank pulleys and wheels on for other reasons other than less strain on an engine...

anyways... just my $.02

 

I've never driven a car with an aftermarket flywheel, but let me relate some info- did you know that a significant number of people who bought Carrera GT's ended up trading them in because they were undriveable [starting on any slope, for instance]. Why? The flywheel in one of those weighs <4 lbs, to memory, and it was an incredible problem for everyday drivers [whether fashion slave/celebrity or not] and its light-weight flywheel. This is, again, based on induction.