I would have used a harsher term than "speculating" but, yes, I agree.

Mark

 

OK Adam lets stop the games and answer a direct question. Are you in any way at all concerned that WMS (Webb motor sports) is now or ever has been involved in attempting to pass counterfeit ALTA super charger pulleies?????????? A simple yes or no should lay this thread to rest

RAT

 

I'm not saying they are a bad company, or the guys are bad guys - but really - what does your post have to do with this one?

 

Adam -


WHO is the vendor you are accusing?

 

Do I really need to answer this question? Anyone else not get the point?

 

Seriously - fine they did something really cool for you in the past - what does that have to do with creating a hype thread with no proof as of yet, and unanswered direct questions from multiple people?

 

You're saying that they're fabricating a story about criminal fraud (trademark infringement). That's a pretty strong accusation without, as far as I can tell, anything in the way of evidence.

Mark

 

You don't see the irony of that statement? Let me rephrase it for you (directed at Alta):

"You're saying a vendor is commiting criminal fraud (trademark infringement). That's a pretty strong accusation without, as far as I can tell, anything in the way of evidence."

Am I the only one with a brain here? Should I be speaking in sheep? baaahh baaaah

Yes - I need proof to believe something. You don't start a smear campaign without it and expect EVERYONE to believe you.

 

Who is Alta smearing again?

They already said people are working with vendor(s) to resolve the problem before making more info public. How about giving it a few days and seeing if you get the info you are looking for?

 

Again - dripping with irony.

Who indeed? If things are being worked out privately - WHY POST THIS THREAD?

 

for all your input.

We simply want to protect the consumer from being mis-led into a purchase of a product that isn't what they thought that it was. The apparent copies as well as similar pulleys do NOT have an ALTA™ logo. (It would have to have an ALTA™ logo to be considered trademark infringement which is not what we are stating here.) The issue stems from consumers (that outside of this board) alerted us directly that they had purchased an item they thought was an ALTA™ part. When it arrived the invoice/packing slip said "ALTA 15% Pulley", the part contained did not have a logo, a warranty card, decals, instructions etc. Each customer contacted us and asked us "Is this your part?" We said no. This had been repeated several times in the course of two business days. At this point we felt it necessary to alert the online populus to this problem. This is not a marketing scheme or otherwise. It is a genuine attempt to help the customer as well as protect the image of the brand. There may be more than one vendor that has either intentionally or un-intentionally misled a customer. (As was the case with those customers that I have personally spoken with both via e-mail and telephone.) We will not blatantly call out any vendor. The customer should contact the vendor themselves to reach a resolution to the problem. We wish to be kept abreast of the progress only so we can better track the practices of our vendors. Their business as well as the retail customer is EXTREMELY important to our success and we do not want our products associated with this type of deception. We trust those parties involved to do what is right. At no point throughout this entire thread have we mentioned any vendor by name.

Thank you again.

Adam
ALTA Performance
503-643-4677 xt 203

 

I have to assume that Alta does have evidence. I at least find that more likely than your guess that they're making the whole thing up. That you, personally, have are not privy to that evidence doesn't prove to me that it doesn't exist. That you're enganging in wild speculation here is abundantly clear, however.

Uh, yes, clearly that's it.

Sure. It's more succinct and and the information content is about the same.

Who is he smearing? You complain that he doesn't name names and then turn around and say he's engaging in a smear compaign. I don't see how both can be true.

Mark

 

Because maybe they're trying to find as many people as possible who might have ended up with these fake pulleys... Because maybe Alta knows its a problem yet isn't fully aware of the scope of the problem but is trying to figure it out.

I really am amazed at how people have gone about trying to twist a warning that merely says check your pulley... This is what a genuine one looks like, if the pulley you thought was ours doesn't look like this... than it's not one of ours despite what your vendor said...

Alta the alerted to the community about possible fraud but choose not to attack the reputation of any vendor... And their motives are questioned... Amazing.

 

that last alta post clears it up, as far as I am concerned. this about a product trying to benefit from alta marketing, not about the integrity of same product.

As another poster mentioned, nothing new about knock-offs, and no reason to automatically question their quality. as I recall, Alta made a gage mount package that was remarkably like the Promini and Pilo's intake was a direct copy of the Rogue.

 

Yes, I agree, without providing any specific details ALTA™ has set the stage for a witch hunt, and the notorious quibblers are foaming at the mouth.

ALTA™ needs to come clean and provide more information.

 

Too much is being made of this......Alta has warned that counterfiets are on the market. If you have purchased from a reputable company i.e, Webb Motorsports you should be fine. If you purchased from an unknown off ebay or any other individual good luck and hope nothing happens.

Now get off the computer and go for a drive!

 

I'm not sure, but I think this may be all my fault by having different pulleys available from one vendor.

My mistake was not having different items listed in my invoicing software (Quickbooks).

As far as I know, there are less than 5 folks who had an incorrect invoice, and I have already made it known that if anyone has a gripe with any of my products, to contact me immediately. I will do whatever it takes to maintain my integrity and make sure my customers are happy.

I think it all started with a customer who is on the East Coast in the eastern time zone. He received a polished pulley and pulley removal loaner tool along with an Alta diverter all in one box. The pulley he received didn't say Alta, yet the invoice did (clearly my fault). When he couldn't get a hold of me at 6:20am Mountain Time, he called Alta (and it amazes me they were available, since I talked to the customer at 9:30am my time - that's great customer support from those guys!).

Alta was unaware that I had purchased any other pulleys or that any were polished. This of course caused a disruption. I spent a lot of time on the phone with Adam at Alta explaining what had happened and called the customer in question after the conversation as well. I also offered to overnight an Alta pulley to him and let him keep the other polished pulley. After speaking with me, the customer decided to install the polished unit.

This is a clear fault of mine, and the mistake stemmed from miscommunication. I apologize to anyone who misunderstood or wasn't clearly explained the item (I don't believe that happened more than the above mentioned times). Most of my customers were not concerned until they saw the post and worried that their pulleys would fall off! That fear aside, I don't think anyone felt duped. I was in no way ever trying to market these or pass the ET units off as Alta units. Those of you who are my customers know that.

Again, I stand by all pulleys installed by me or shipped out the door. They are of the highest material quality, specification, and finish. All carry my warranty. Just as a side note, the only pulleys I now have in stock are the newest Altas. They are now stamped with 15%, but were not always (I think the first 100 or so I did had no markings other than Alta, and they were shipped to me from Alta with no stickers or cards).

I certainly hope that explains my responsibility in this mess, and allays any fears about products. If there is anything else I can explain, I would be happy to. I am being as honest as I possibly can (probably more information than was really needed).

Randy Webb
Owner, Webb Motorsports
720-841-1002 Order/Tech
303-683-4424 Shop
720-344-0447 Fax
randy@webbmotorsports.com

 

I applaud Randy for his detailed post. I'm not even sure if this whole thing is even about him in the first place, but he comes through with facts.

Alta needs to do the same.

 

Thanks, Randy.


>I don't think anyone felt duped.


I didn't feel duped. Just wasn't sure which
pulley I got while I thought you only sold the
Alta one.

It's all clear now and Im enjoying my car, so
Im fine with the German polished one.
I read that it's even better than the Alta one
somewhere....

ps: and for the record, I never contacted Alta
last night cause I had faith. You did a great
job on my car so didn't think there was anything
to worry about.

 

I'm actually hoping that no one reads my comments!!! as I have decided not to read the last two pages of this vendor-members accusation ping pong thread based on professional competition between vendors that inevitably drags in followers of one or another vendor to defend or denounce the other mostly based on personal feelings and not factual evidence. Therefor i m hoping NAM will make an effort in finding a solution in ending long meaningless arguments THAT CREATE NOTHING BUT CONFUSION. An open forum is constructive only when all members involved act as impartial responsible participants, when this is no longer the case a strong and disciplined mediation is required for the benefit of all.

 

Hai, so desu ne!

 

I can say for a FACT that the pully I recieved was not what I expected. Alta is doing what any vendor should. Your reading a bunch of alterior motives. Let me ask you this, what SHOULD a vendor do when they learn that a bunch of customers are recieving product that the customer expected was from Alta wasn't? Wouldn't have been irresponsible to not let the community know about what was happening? And no, I won't say where I bought it, because I prefere to straighten out my business in private. I don't know if what I recieved was better or worse, but I expected to see Alta on the pully and didn't, and besides all that, if the others COST LESS but that cost isn't passed on to the customer, then it's a bit fishy. Also, what about re-sale value? or interroporability with other diameters from Alta (like going from 15% to 19%). I thank Alta for speaking out. Let the people who have issues deal with thier suppliers. If they don't get satisfactory resolution, I'm sure you'll hear about it here.

Another way to put it is your assumption that Alta is blowing smoke is just that, an assumption. All it takes is one real person that can put their name to the fact that the package they recieved didn't meet expectation, and Alta is validated. Consider me that person.

Matt

 

Thank you for being the first actual person to come forward. It's a start. Are you one of the people that contacted Alta?

They should provide the name of the vendor resposible to prevent anyone from purchasing the product in the first place. That is protecting. Letting the product be purchased and then saying 'oh look out it might be fake' - doesn't protect anyone at all.

The community has not been alerted to anything so far - no names have been brought out. It's common knowledge that there are knockoffs of just about everything out there, that is not new information from anyone. Taking care of business in private is fine - HOWEVER this is NOT being handled in private at ALL. This is a huge thread on a large community board pinned to the front page - as far from private as you can get. You can't have your cake and eat it too. If Alta is to be protecting the public, they can ONLY do so by naming vendor to prevent purcahases of the knock-offs. If you don't name your source, you're not doing any good either.

All valid claims, and ones which should be addressed with a vendor name to make any of it meaningful.

Well a claim against an unknown vendor is an assumption as well isn't it.

 

I installed Matt's at a pulley party, and have been in contact with him tonight and the issue has been resolved. He was not under the impression I had sold him an Alta however. I hadn't stated that, and didn't push that through marketing or by any other means.

The pulleys I have used - all three types - are interchangeable. I've done it. They literally caliper the same.

For resale, let folks know you have a Webb Motorsports pulley, and the resale will be fine.

I test for Alta. I track the car more than anyone on the planet (I was supposed to be at Pueblo today!), and if there are issues, I find them. I put my name behind anything I have installed or sold.

Hope that helps! I will continue to clear things up as needed, and take full responsibility for any misunderstanding.

Randy

 

My situation has been resolved satisfactorally. I was surprised by the original transaction and my vendor has stood up and corrected the error. What I was speaking to was the fact that Alta was not lying.......

I'm not one of the people who contacted Alta, so that mystery is still open.

But I think I disagree with the notion that some things are not what they seem in the marketplace does have information content. A buyer is allerted to the fact, and can EXPICITLY ask for confirmation or guarantees. And Alta is just being prudent with announcing there's an issue, and working with vendors to get it straightened out. If they didn't get satisfactory resolution, then it's time to spill the beans..... But letting the community know early is the right thing to do, at least as it seems to me.

Matt

Since Randy spilled the beans, all it was that I was surprised it didn't say Alta. I got mine a while ago, but wasn't too bothered at all. I assumed I'd get Alta because that's what's on his site, but whatever.... I'm happy, he's happy, let's all be happy together!