Drivetrain Turbo MCS is here?
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6th Gear
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From: a canyon, south Bay Area
And the more powerful EVO 9 is coming-out soon...
To point I was making is that it's just not power, as in horsepower. A 30k MCS (20 + 10 in mods) would have a much better weight to hp ratio than a 30k EVO 8 (ie, stock). Dollar for dollar, or bang-for-the-buck is what many of us go by...
The massive torque and AWD make the EVO impressive. The MINI can't go there, at least not easily or cheaply... Again, two different cars... I still cringe when I see one. It really is too bad they look the way they do...
To point I was making is that it's just not power, as in horsepower. A 30k MCS (20 + 10 in mods) would have a much better weight to hp ratio than a 30k EVO 8 (ie, stock). Dollar for dollar, or bang-for-the-buck is what many of us go by...
The massive torque and AWD make the EVO impressive. The MINI can't go there, at least not easily or cheaply... Again, two different cars... I still cringe when I see one. It really is too bad they look the way they do...
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From: So Cal
Originally Posted by meanboy
That rear diffuser sure makes the MR look bizarre! My wife picked out the Mini so I have to go along with her on that one.
How's your phantom grip holding under all that hp?
How's your phantom grip holding under all that hp?
the aluminum roof in the MR is cool... wish Mini would do something similar
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From: the great country of california
Originally Posted by TonyB
And the more powerful EVO 9 is coming-out soon...
To point I was making is that it's just not power, as in horsepower. A 30k MCS (20 + 10 in mods) would have a much better weight to hp ratio than a 30k EVO 8 (ie, stock). Dollar for dollar, or bang-for-the-buck is what many of us go by...
The massive torque and AWD make the EVO impressive. The MINI can't go there, at least not easily or cheaply... Again, two different cars... I still cringe when I see one. It really is too bad they look the way they do...
To point I was making is that it's just not power, as in horsepower. A 30k MCS (20 + 10 in mods) would have a much better weight to hp ratio than a 30k EVO 8 (ie, stock). Dollar for dollar, or bang-for-the-buck is what many of us go by...
The massive torque and AWD make the EVO impressive. The MINI can't go there, at least not easily or cheaply... Again, two different cars... I still cringe when I see one. It really is too bad they look the way they do...
So EL has it right because he has traction and brakes..now seats, I am not sure about that one.
P.S. He has sparcos so he has the total package!
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From: the great country of california
Originally Posted by El Diablito Rojo-N20Mini
so far so good... no problemo
the aluminum roof in the MR is cool... wish Mini would do something similar
the aluminum roof in the MR is cool... wish Mini would do something similar
The price is bit high for the MR at 35k and no sunroof!
But I guess that's cause racers don't need sunroofs.
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From: So Cal
Originally Posted by meanboy
Yes, and I agree. However, without the rest of the package you aren't really getting that much bang for the buck. It's no good to have all that hp without brakes or traction. And without good seats you can't drive it the fullest, and the EVO has some really good seats. They keep you in place very nicely.
So EL has it right because he has traction and brakes..now seats, I am not sure about that one.
So EL has it right because he has traction and brakes..now seats, I am not sure about that one.
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From: So Cal
Originally Posted by meanboy
That's the one thing all minis need if driven to their fullest..LSD.
The price is bit high for the MR at 35k and no sunroof! But I guess that's cause racers don't need sunroofs.
The price is bit high for the MR at 35k and no sunroof!
But I guess that's cause racers don't need sunroofs.
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6th Gear
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From: a canyon, south Bay Area
Well, if the MINI came from the factory with that type of power and purpose, I'm sure BMW would make sure that it had the corresponding support (additional mods) that you mention...
For that 10k delta, one can have brakes and seats as well... and still have a better weight to hp ratio than a comparably priced EVO 8. Getting 180 whp (about 200 bhp) out of an MCS (needed to match the EVO's ratio) is very easy to do. I've seen such numbers achieved for less than $2k:
intake/exhaust = approx $1k
pulley/ecu = $1k (there are cheaper combos)
That puts the MINI in the ballpark with the EVO 8, weight to hp-wise... and that leaves $8k for brakes (mine were $1k), seats ($2k for really nice ones) and still more power-adders, if desired.
So, like I said before, dollar-for-dollar, a 30k MINI can easily have more power for its weight than the same money spent on an EVO 8.
The point is, the EVO remains faster for other attributes for which the MINI lacks...
For that 10k delta, one can have brakes and seats as well... and still have a better weight to hp ratio than a comparably priced EVO 8. Getting 180 whp (about 200 bhp) out of an MCS (needed to match the EVO's ratio) is very easy to do. I've seen such numbers achieved for less than $2k:
intake/exhaust = approx $1k
pulley/ecu = $1k (there are cheaper combos)
That puts the MINI in the ballpark with the EVO 8, weight to hp-wise... and that leaves $8k for brakes (mine were $1k), seats ($2k for really nice ones) and still more power-adders, if desired.
So, like I said before, dollar-for-dollar, a 30k MINI can easily have more power for its weight than the same money spent on an EVO 8.
The point is, the EVO remains faster for other attributes for which the MINI lacks...
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Ok I have to say that mini can put out lots of torque as in what the stock Evo 8 does. I just ordered my JB/B MCS yesterday and I have already ordered a Twincharge kit which would put mt at 295 hp and 295 ft/lbs of torque. Tell me, that is more than the Evo 8. I know you guys want slips and number but that Will have to wait until Mid April as Me and Detroit Tuned are going to be working on this. I am dead Excited, haven't been sleeping yet, although I do Own an '04 MC CVT but this wait is totally different because i can see and feel all the power I will be using. Also the day I pick it up, is the day i drop the Miltek header and cat-back on.
BTW I think i will be spending 30k in mods.
BTW I think i will be spending 30k in mods.
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6th Gear
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From: a canyon, south Bay Area
A stock EVO 8 gets about the same torque, a bit less, but at about 3,500 RPMs though. Can't wait until the weather improves to see some 1/4 mile times! Congrats on the purchase.
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Thanks as for the weather is clearing up here, sunny and about 50''s i think, I am not yet able to d some quarter miles as yet i don't have it yet, but i should see some quarter Miles on my MC CVT thats been Modded for a bit.
When I did the mods, aparantly I forgot to do some quarter miles. As for iw as doing my secret stuff. and No it wasn't illegal in any way.
When I did the mods, aparantly I forgot to do some quarter miles. As for iw as doing my secret stuff. and No it wasn't illegal in any way.
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From: So Cal
Originally Posted by Maximusmini
Ok I have to say that mini can put out lots of torque as in what the stock Evo 8 does. I just ordered my JB/B MCS yesterday and I have already ordered a Twincharge kit which would put mt at 295 hp and 295 ft/lbs of torque. Tell me, that is more than the Evo 8. I know you guys want slips and number but that Will have to wait until Mid April as Me and Detroit Tuned are going to be working on this. I am dead Excited, haven't been sleeping yet, although I do Own an '04 MC CVT but this wait is totally different because i can see and feel all the power I will be using. Also the day I pick it up, is the day i drop the Miltek header and cat-back on.
BTW I think i will be spending 30k in mods.
BTW I think i will be spending 30k in mods.
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From: So Cal
Originally Posted by Maximusmini
Ryephile and I have been scouring the net. It is believed I am going to be the most engine modded Mini in Michigan. Also the fastest. We will be using SPI's twincharge kit.
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From: So Cal
Originally Posted by TonyB
El, I guess you haven't heard yet, but Maximusmini is getting v.2 of the kit. Hubbie didn't know how to break it to ya...
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From: the great country of california
Originally Posted by TonyB
Well, if the MINI came from the factory with that type of power and purpose, I'm sure BMW would make sure that it had the corresponding support (additional mods) that you mention...
For that 10k delta, one can have brakes and seats as well... and still have a better weight to hp ratio than a comparably priced EVO 8. Getting 180 whp (about 200 bhp) out of an MCS (needed to match the EVO's ratio) is very easy to do. I've seen such numbers achieved for less than $2k:
intake/exhaust = approx $1k
pulley/ecu = $1k (there are cheaper combos)
That puts the MINI in the ballpark with the EVO 8, weight to hp-wise... and that leaves $8k for brakes (mine were $1k), seats ($2k for really nice ones) and still more power-adders, if desired.
So, like I said before, dollar-for-dollar, a 30k MINI can easily have more power for its weight than the same money spent on an EVO 8.
The point is, the EVO remains faster for other attributes for which the MINI lacks...
For that 10k delta, one can have brakes and seats as well... and still have a better weight to hp ratio than a comparably priced EVO 8. Getting 180 whp (about 200 bhp) out of an MCS (needed to match the EVO's ratio) is very easy to do. I've seen such numbers achieved for less than $2k:
intake/exhaust = approx $1k
pulley/ecu = $1k (there are cheaper combos)
That puts the MINI in the ballpark with the EVO 8, weight to hp-wise... and that leaves $8k for brakes (mine were $1k), seats ($2k for really nice ones) and still more power-adders, if desired.
So, like I said before, dollar-for-dollar, a 30k MINI can easily have more power for its weight than the same money spent on an EVO 8.
The point is, the EVO remains faster for other attributes for which the MINI lacks...
While it sounds good on paper for weight to hp ratio, 14 or 15 to 1 whp to whp, the torque of the EVO 8 is what seperates the two. Stock it has 286lbs of torque and even with a 20% drivetrain loss that's still 228 lbs of torque at the wheels. It has more torque then HP..quite the opposite of the MCS. With that much more torque, the EVO 8 will beat a standard JCW/aftermarket in any drag race. It traps at 102-103 mph bone stock.
Placing a turbo(including the twincharger) on the MCS would seem to be the only solution to be competively in the hp area and taking into account the need for big brakes,etc, would cost more then then 10k.
One thing to consider is that some dealers have EVO 8's from the previous year that have not been sold and probably can be had for cheap. Once the EVO 9 rolls out this year it might be possible to buy a new 05 EVO 8 in the 25k range. That lessens the $$ gap quite a bit.
For pure performance, the MINI isn't top dog but it has a combination of things that make it a winner.
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6th Gear
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From: a canyon, south Bay Area
Originally Posted by meanboy
I don't think BMW would or could put out that type of factory support for that kind of $$. It's just not what they do.
While it sounds good on paper for weight to hp ratio, 14 or 15 to 1 whp to whp, the torque of the EVO 8 is what seperates the two. Stock it has 286lbs of torque and even with a 20% drivetrain loss that's still 228 lbs of torque at the wheels. It has more torque then HP..quite the opposite of the MCS. With that much more torque, the EVO 8 will beat a standard JCW/aftermarket in any drag race. It traps at 102-103 mph bone stock.
Placing a turbo(including the twincharger) on the MCS would seem to be the only solution to be competively in the hp area and taking into account the need for big brakes,etc, would cost more then then 10k.
One thing to consider is that some dealers have EVO 8's from the previous year that have not been sold and probably can be had for cheap. Once the EVO 9 rolls out this year it might be possible to buy a new 05 EVO 8 in the 25k range. That lessens the $$ gap quite a bit.
For pure performance, the MINI isn't top dog but it has a combination of things that make it a winner.
While it sounds good on paper for weight to hp ratio, 14 or 15 to 1 whp to whp, the torque of the EVO 8 is what seperates the two. Stock it has 286lbs of torque and even with a 20% drivetrain loss that's still 228 lbs of torque at the wheels. It has more torque then HP..quite the opposite of the MCS. With that much more torque, the EVO 8 will beat a standard JCW/aftermarket in any drag race. It traps at 102-103 mph bone stock.
Placing a turbo(including the twincharger) on the MCS would seem to be the only solution to be competively in the hp area and taking into account the need for big brakes,etc, would cost more then then 10k.
One thing to consider is that some dealers have EVO 8's from the previous year that have not been sold and probably can be had for cheap. Once the EVO 9 rolls out this year it might be possible to buy a new 05 EVO 8 in the 25k range. That lessens the $$ gap quite a bit.
For pure performance, the MINI isn't top dog but it has a combination of things that make it a winner.
Exactly what I've been saying... re the torque... and the AWD. We talk so much about more and more hp, but if one wants to compare it to an EVO 8 (try to equal its performance), as an example, those two items must also be factored-in as well. And I personally don't want a MINI with a larger engine, and AWD, ie, bigger and heavier. If so, I would have gotten something else from the get-go...
The MINI's platform has its limitations in getting power to the ground. Eventually, a point of diminishing returns is realized, to where more power translates less and less to better times...
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From: the great country of california
Originally Posted by TonyB
Oh, I didn't mean BMW doing it from the factory, but they buyer of the MCS, with 10k of play money to equal a new EVO 8's pricing...
Exactly what I've been saying... re the torque... and the AWD. We talk so much about more and more hp, but if one wants to compare it to an EVO 8 (try to equal its performance), as an example, those two items must also be factored-in as well. And I personally don't want a MINI with a larger engine, and AWD, ie, bigger and heavier. If so, I would have gotten something else from the get-go...
The MINI's platform has its limitations in getting power to the ground. Eventually, a point of diminishing returns is realized, to where more power translates less and less to better times...
Exactly what I've been saying... re the torque... and the AWD. We talk so much about more and more hp, but if one wants to compare it to an EVO 8 (try to equal its performance), as an example, those two items must also be factored-in as well. And I personally don't want a MINI with a larger engine, and AWD, ie, bigger and heavier. If so, I would have gotten something else from the get-go...
The MINI's platform has its limitations in getting power to the ground. Eventually, a point of diminishing returns is realized, to where more power translates less and less to better times...