Drivetrain RPM Stage 2 Impression Post (Thanks Mario!)
#1
RPM Stage 2 Impression Post (Thanks Mario!)
WOW guys! It has been YEARS since I've posted. My work situation changed four years, so I have less time to play around online during the day. Being busy is a great problem to have! I've remained active in my local community (driveway repairs) and post/comment on the Facebook groups a few of my personal friend in real life are active on. Why am I posting? Quick RPM impression post, before/after video, a warning, and a glowing review of Mario.
Who am I? I have a love/hate relationship with my 142K 09 Clubman S with the N14 engine. For a few years it would break like clockwork every 3K miles and I'd have the full circle denial/anger/acceptance before fixing it in the middle of the night while borrowing a car to get to work. I have a minivan of kids now, A year and a half ago when I bought the Honda Odyssey and did NOT trade in the wife's Corolla, I had the magical experience of NOT BEING INCONVENIENCED when the MINI decided to pull it's dumb sh*t! At about 130K I dropped/cracked the trans to install a wavetrac LSD and put a new clutch in thanks to a few strained pressure plate fingers creating a hot spot and starting to slip. The car has taught me enough that I've been able to get into a super cheap old Harley-Davidson powered one-off and rebuild it from scratch piecemeal as it breaks. Without going into too much detail there, the MINI (and youtube) has taught me how to make a wiring harness from scratch for the chopper, make a gas tank out of a beer keg, rebuild the top end of that twenty year old VERY simple V-twin motor, drill&tap, mount tires, diagnosis and fix no-run issues, rebuild starters, etc. etc.
Who is Mario? I've talked to Mario on and off for the last three years. I bought an Evolve R tune four years ago just a few months before Manic came on the scene. I had some underlining mechanical issues which presented only as being unable to achieve top end power on the tune. I fortunately had a local friend with a dyno at the time and Mario was generous with his knowledge and gave me some suggestions of potential problems to chase down. Turned out to be a clogged fuel filter combined with carbon build up which either alone would pop a CEL but together worked fine thanks to the self adjusting ECU EXCEPT for loss of top end power. Later on my wastegate bushing gave out and with some advice from Mario I rebuild my stock turbo. At the time he offered to sell me on an uprated turbo and I declined. With the Evolve tune I would achieve peak boost at 4500rpm and I thought it would be stupid to put a big turbo on the car, gain more turbo lag, and give up some of my mid-range for a little on the top end.
What mods? FMIC, catless DP, JCW intake, GFB DV+, NKG 1422 plugs
What is this RPM tune? I heard from Casey and a few others who had changed from Manic to RPM that RPM was smoother. I expected the car to 'feel' different, but I'm a pessimistic guy and had no expectation of a performance change. BOY WAS I WRONG. Besides from being very smooth, PEAK BOOST OF 20PSI AT 3200rpm! WHAT THE HECK!? I asked Mario if they are using an anti-lag strategy by pulsing the injectors on exhaust stroke and cycling spark a second time to increase pressure in the exhaust manifold. He says no, it's merely more fuel at the appropriate time and advanced ignition timing. I won't go into detail of how the Harley has taught me about ignition timing, but long story short on a chopper you can manually advance the timing (for better performance at high revolution) by manually turning the cam timing plate clockwise or counterclockwise. Advance too far, you start to get knock at low revolution. Retard too far and the engine falls on its face during high revolution. That is a simple system and in our cars the ECU can time the advance curve differently for idle vs WOT vs any acceleration pattern.
One of my complaints with Evolve R was boost cut. If the temp betweens days was too large, the car would overboost on passing and I'd get a CEL with half power. The RPM tune just does not overboost past the requested amount. My gauge shoots straight up to 20 and stays there. It's rock solid. I NOW UNDERSTAND WHY THESE GUYS ARE PUTTING BIGGER TURBOS ON THE CARS. Next time my turbo cuts out, I'll be going big too knowing Mario can tune it to spool immediately with gains in both low end and top end. NO LOSS IN LOW END GRUNT!
Now a bit of a warning. I told Mario I would make a before/after video for 40-80 roll and 0-60 in a curve. I have only made the first one and I need some time to relearn the car's behavior before attempting the 2nd after video. I'll put the links below but what I want you to see is my MISTAKE. I know how this car used to behave intimately from driving it daily for four years and wrenching on it myself. I got INAPPROPRIATELY close to the car in front of me because I expected to be at least a car length further back than the RPM tune put me. BE CAREFUL and take the time to relearn how your car behaves. I am so glad I made the video so I can show you my close call and you can learn the easy way from me.
The tune is really quite impressive. If you want more power, clean your carbon on a 20K interval using walnut blasting, and don't worry about losing low end if you go a size bigger on turbo. If you've never changed plugs before know that some old spark plug sockets will get stuck in the cylinder head. You need a spark plug socket that is less than 22mm circumference. Your local parts store will carry both types so bring a caliper to measure. You don't want to be using your socket extension to stuff bunny bread into a stuck socket.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7oCO...ature=youtu.be
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHIO...ature=youtu.be
Who am I? I have a love/hate relationship with my 142K 09 Clubman S with the N14 engine. For a few years it would break like clockwork every 3K miles and I'd have the full circle denial/anger/acceptance before fixing it in the middle of the night while borrowing a car to get to work. I have a minivan of kids now, A year and a half ago when I bought the Honda Odyssey and did NOT trade in the wife's Corolla, I had the magical experience of NOT BEING INCONVENIENCED when the MINI decided to pull it's dumb sh*t! At about 130K I dropped/cracked the trans to install a wavetrac LSD and put a new clutch in thanks to a few strained pressure plate fingers creating a hot spot and starting to slip. The car has taught me enough that I've been able to get into a super cheap old Harley-Davidson powered one-off and rebuild it from scratch piecemeal as it breaks. Without going into too much detail there, the MINI (and youtube) has taught me how to make a wiring harness from scratch for the chopper, make a gas tank out of a beer keg, rebuild the top end of that twenty year old VERY simple V-twin motor, drill&tap, mount tires, diagnosis and fix no-run issues, rebuild starters, etc. etc.
Who is Mario? I've talked to Mario on and off for the last three years. I bought an Evolve R tune four years ago just a few months before Manic came on the scene. I had some underlining mechanical issues which presented only as being unable to achieve top end power on the tune. I fortunately had a local friend with a dyno at the time and Mario was generous with his knowledge and gave me some suggestions of potential problems to chase down. Turned out to be a clogged fuel filter combined with carbon build up which either alone would pop a CEL but together worked fine thanks to the self adjusting ECU EXCEPT for loss of top end power. Later on my wastegate bushing gave out and with some advice from Mario I rebuild my stock turbo. At the time he offered to sell me on an uprated turbo and I declined. With the Evolve tune I would achieve peak boost at 4500rpm and I thought it would be stupid to put a big turbo on the car, gain more turbo lag, and give up some of my mid-range for a little on the top end.
What mods? FMIC, catless DP, JCW intake, GFB DV+, NKG 1422 plugs
What is this RPM tune? I heard from Casey and a few others who had changed from Manic to RPM that RPM was smoother. I expected the car to 'feel' different, but I'm a pessimistic guy and had no expectation of a performance change. BOY WAS I WRONG. Besides from being very smooth, PEAK BOOST OF 20PSI AT 3200rpm! WHAT THE HECK!? I asked Mario if they are using an anti-lag strategy by pulsing the injectors on exhaust stroke and cycling spark a second time to increase pressure in the exhaust manifold. He says no, it's merely more fuel at the appropriate time and advanced ignition timing. I won't go into detail of how the Harley has taught me about ignition timing, but long story short on a chopper you can manually advance the timing (for better performance at high revolution) by manually turning the cam timing plate clockwise or counterclockwise. Advance too far, you start to get knock at low revolution. Retard too far and the engine falls on its face during high revolution. That is a simple system and in our cars the ECU can time the advance curve differently for idle vs WOT vs any acceleration pattern.
One of my complaints with Evolve R was boost cut. If the temp betweens days was too large, the car would overboost on passing and I'd get a CEL with half power. The RPM tune just does not overboost past the requested amount. My gauge shoots straight up to 20 and stays there. It's rock solid. I NOW UNDERSTAND WHY THESE GUYS ARE PUTTING BIGGER TURBOS ON THE CARS. Next time my turbo cuts out, I'll be going big too knowing Mario can tune it to spool immediately with gains in both low end and top end. NO LOSS IN LOW END GRUNT!
Now a bit of a warning. I told Mario I would make a before/after video for 40-80 roll and 0-60 in a curve. I have only made the first one and I need some time to relearn the car's behavior before attempting the 2nd after video. I'll put the links below but what I want you to see is my MISTAKE. I know how this car used to behave intimately from driving it daily for four years and wrenching on it myself. I got INAPPROPRIATELY close to the car in front of me because I expected to be at least a car length further back than the RPM tune put me. BE CAREFUL and take the time to relearn how your car behaves. I am so glad I made the video so I can show you my close call and you can learn the easy way from me.
The tune is really quite impressive. If you want more power, clean your carbon on a 20K interval using walnut blasting, and don't worry about losing low end if you go a size bigger on turbo. If you've never changed plugs before know that some old spark plug sockets will get stuck in the cylinder head. You need a spark plug socket that is less than 22mm circumference. Your local parts store will carry both types so bring a caliper to measure. You don't want to be using your socket extension to stuff bunny bread into a stuck socket.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7oCO...ature=youtu.be
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHIO...ature=youtu.be
#2
#4
I'm running BFGoodrich sport comp 2 (Thanks Way for the suggestion six years ago! On my third set!) and haven't gotten any wheel spin with the RPM tune during rolling situation. Part of that could be having a limited slip diff though.
#6
Post what you think when you try out. Are you coming from stock or Manic or Evolve like I did? Make sure to use a spark plug socket with circumference less than 22mm so it doesn't get stuck in the cylinder head when you install the new NKG 1422s!
#7
*any standard 5/8" spark plug socket works.. use or find one with a magnetic insert, so you dont drop the plugs into the head.. dont use any grease, anti-seize etc and always remove and torque plugs on a cold engine.
**Also - the 1422's are gapped ~.020-.022 ..which i found to be a little tight for daily driving, I installed a new set recently and opened the gap to .024 and am happier with how its running now cold and at idle vs before, still no misfires or stumbles under high RPM or boost.
**Also - the 1422's are gapped ~.020-.022 ..which i found to be a little tight for daily driving, I installed a new set recently and opened the gap to .024 and am happier with how its running now cold and at idle vs before, still no misfires or stumbles under high RPM or boost.
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#8
*any standard 5/8" spark plug socket works.. use or find one with a magnetic insert, so you dont drop the plugs into the head.. dont use any grease, anti-seize etc and always remove and torque plugs on a cold engine.
**Also - the 1422's are gapped ~.020-.022 ..which i found to be a little tight for daily driving, I installed a new set recently and opened the gap to .024 and am happier with how its running now cold and at idle vs before, still no misfires or stumbles under high RPM or boost.
**Also - the 1422's are gapped ~.020-.022 ..which i found to be a little tight for daily driving, I installed a new set recently and opened the gap to .024 and am happier with how its running now cold and at idle vs before, still no misfires or stumbles under high RPM or boost.
I used the tape trick to widen my thin walled spark plug socket for OEM plugs to widen the circumference to figure out how big I could go before getting stuck... pretty tight at 22mm and didn't go further with the tape...
If you do get a too big socket stuck, bunny bread and a socket extension.
The following users liked this post:
RChandler (10-21-2020)
#9
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Ian Landesman (10-17-2018)
#10
The following users liked this post:
Ian Landesman (10-17-2018)
#11
#12
Has anyone actually got a before and after dyno stage 2/3 Rpm vs stage 2/3 Manic that they are prepared to share online or via pm, I see loads of positive reviews, but not so much back to back data so far
Perhaps my frustration has been compounded by my visits to various European Rpm sites offering a princely 20-ish bhp as an upgrade?
if I have missed a post somewhere please point me in the right direction,
I "need" more power for 2019
Perhaps my frustration has been compounded by my visits to various European Rpm sites offering a princely 20-ish bhp as an upgrade?
if I have missed a post somewhere please point me in the right direction,
I "need" more power for 2019
#13
Has anyone actually got a before and after dyno stage 2/3 Rpm vs stage 2/3 Manic that they are prepared to share online or via pm, I see loads of positive reviews, but not so much back to back data so far
Perhaps my frustration has been compounded by my visits to various European Rpm sites offering a princely 20-ish bhp as an upgrade?
if I have missed a post somewhere please point me in the right direction,
I "need" more power for 2019
Perhaps my frustration has been compounded by my visits to various European Rpm sites offering a princely 20-ish bhp as an upgrade?
if I have missed a post somewhere please point me in the right direction,
I "need" more power for 2019
#14
There would be other supporting mods to move from a stage2 map to stage3 (for most folks who dont have access to 100oct at the pump).. like WMI, a larger turbo for example... the difference in power output between the 2 maps, would be largely based on these mods, not so much the reworked fuel/timing of the MAP itself. I would think that the '20bhp' (approx at the crank) is likely their quoted difference in power just switching between the MAP settings.. which is what .. ~15hp at the wheels. I would never run a stage3 MAP on 91oct here in CA, unless I was on meth.. or running methanol. :D
#15
so basically
Alientech is a at home flash tool
you buy the flasher
they send it to you,
you plug it in to the obd2 port
it reads the vin
an I believe base map as well
you email that file to who ever your tuner is
Then they will send the new file over in a email
you download the new file onto the flasher
plug it back into your obd2 port
flash the new tune onto the car
#16
Has anyone actually got a before and after dyno stage 2/3 Rpm vs stage 2/3 Manic that they are prepared to share online or via pm, I see loads of positive reviews, but not so much back to back data so far
Perhaps my frustration has been compounded by my visits to various European Rpm sites offering a princely 20-ish bhp as an upgrade?
if I have missed a post somewhere please point me in the right direction,
I "need" more power for 2019
Perhaps my frustration has been compounded by my visits to various European Rpm sites offering a princely 20-ish bhp as an upgrade?
if I have missed a post somewhere please point me in the right direction,
I "need" more power for 2019
Solid line was Full Bolt Ons, JMTC S42 on 93 octane RPM Stage 3 Map B (21PSI)
You can see that peak numbers are similar but even with less boost and lower octane the RPM tune carried power up top better than Manic
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