So I have an ecu remap, I inspected my graph and saw that I make the most power at 6850 rpm after power drops but not by much. The torque drops at around 5100rpm, but gradually. In a drag race, should I be shifting at the point where the car makes its most power, which in my case is 6850 or take it down till 7300 so that my rpm will be higher down in the next gear? which is better to opt for and why?

 

I say meet in the middle and shift at 7000 it is only a few hundred RPM either way

 

If you have the shift timing just before redline you should be just fine in a drag race situation.

 

R-53... Why do I sense the proverbial "booby trap"?? Dunno but I'll preface my input w / THAT question. Oh & Jan sez Minis AIN't drag race cars . Man~ I feel all ALONE in the middle of the kill zone now.This one isn't gonna get ugly eh ??!Ok (safety aside & AUSSIES INVITED !!!) You use ONLY the amount of critters to do "the job"--in this case~ HORSES; if you exceed that amount you need to take the TIME and $$ to buy them "feed" & give em a place to stay! Something that's NOT in your favour as you've already got ENOUGH to do the J.O.B. More mouths (rpm / torque) & more speed (fuel) is a WASTE all the way around !So hence forth~ the shift light and or rev limiter! (ALL the aforementioned ARE interchangeable & can be in ANY order) IF 6850 IS "MAX" & your confident that your "horses" are well "cared for" than that's IT bro !! STICK & STAY & MAKE IT PAY~~~otherwise you're just wastin your time and THAT IS what drag racin's ALL about !! Can I get an AMEN Can I hear a HALLELUJAH ~~~~~ OBEY

 

I cant remember where I read it or who said it (old age) might of been Warren Johnson or Bob Glidden but it was to shift 500rpm above peak power.

It frustrated me for years with the stock rev limit at 6850.

The 12.96 without nitrous was shifting at 8k in 1st 2nd and 3rd with 25 inch slicks and a 02 gearbox.

 

Whether or not the mini is a drag car is another debate.

I think shifting 500rpm earlier than peak power wont do any justice.

Whats the point of the extended limiter on mini's if the power drops in that region anyway?

 

Wow Paul...What a "GOD SMACK !! Especially Glidden; what the NHRA did to him was just criminal. The PROFESSOR~~ he didn't gain that moniker by "chance" and IF either one said it~~ than~~SO BE IT! I just do what I was taught and WHAT worked then; still works NOW~~~QUICKLY ! AND more importantly~~economically cuz thats the ONLY way "we" could exist~~ then (and now). I'm a founding mbr of the N.C.T.A (arch-rivals of the S.C.T.A) so I feel I do have "some" creds. I still know a number of these guys and possibly can get one to comment. Dean Shaw (W.R H.) lives not too far from me here in Oregon (w / REAL gas) Mario & Stevie san Paolo are still kicken (Spaghetti Bender) so I'll try . Oregon IS the Drag Racers "brazil" if ya know what I mean and ALOT still goes on here. Just not much press but a BUNCH of R & D. Pedregon Bros~~eh the list IS endless. They may LIVE elsewhere but quite a bit of info falls down to So .Cal. from here as it IS~~heh heh~~ "downhill".I'm a bit mixed up on what the other post says 500 BEFORE?? I'm not sure thats what Paul said (yes paul-age) Gonna have to backtrack & look. Here we go !! OH~~~~~~HAPPY EASTER~~~~~~~ OBEY

 

Well I did read it and R-53 I;m not sure if what I read is / was what you meant ?? So I guess (sorry) Please clarify?! And Paul my MAN ya know I just got to thinkin EITHER one of THOSE guys WOULD say that~~~~~~~and then ~~kick you A** !! heh heh OBEY

 

OK..R-53 / "check" & Sand -Man (inside joke) Just got off the ph w/ some really grumpy OLD / Antique (s.m.) MEN. That IS a KEY word. What they say can't be repeated here; an interpretation would be WHAT !! And then lots of x^&$$%%$# concluding w / a request of where to send a bill. Since nobodys responded I shall leave you w/this. In High School we did a thing that I think R-53 is referring to and "we" called it power shifting 'which is VERY articulate way of keeping your foot on the pedal & pushing it thru the floorboard (now pan) while wonderiing IF you'd make it to the other end & if so what would be left while "goin thru the gears".After a couple of these runs you & your buds towed what was left of your car back home & went to work on it so you could get to school on monday morning. Not being wealthy and with the advancement of timing equipment (no more stop watches) we found that if you watched the tach & "felt things" thru the seat while NOT playing an a.m station on the "wonder bar" you could shift at what "seemed" like peak power /drop a few R's hit the next gear do the same things and you went FASTER and got to DRIVE home instead of gettin towed (most of the time) With that I bid you Adeiu~~~~ OBEY

 

I think if you are still making more power at your new redline than you will be at the beginning of the next gear, then go ahead and take it all the way. I too have a 7300 rpm redline and if I'm in the scenario where I want the best acceleration, i wind it out all the way.

 

WW Fish are you gona blow a seal (or a polarbear) on this one?
All the poor lil guy wants is his car to go faster in a strait line, No it might not be as fun as playin on the twisties, but if it is his thing I say GIT-R-DONE. I will admit to strait lining my car just to see how quick she realy is and the ol MINI aint to bad.
What the shifting 500 rpm early is all about is basicly reaction speed, it takes time for your brain and body to think and shift. If you see you are geting close on the tach (500 RPM) by the time your knoggin can tell your extremities to make a gear change you are already at peak power. Its like nailing a good holeshot if you wait to see green it is too late, see the 3rd yellow and youll be right on target, or if your brain is built like some sorta super computer you will red light.
In the end the only way to know where to shift/launch is to practice, develop a technique and give er hell. Drag time is cheap(if your car holds togeather) the last test and tune I went to was $30.00 and I made 5 runs that afternoon. So my suggestion is experiance through exparementation, you just gotta play with it to know what works.

 

because the gear is shorter its still most likely faster than if you were to shift...

 

also when you shift, your rpms will be higher up in the power range with the new rev limiter

 

Wow fish, you really have a lot to say

He asked this:


And you gave him this



Holy moley

Longboard

 

for a bit more scientific answer to the op's question, see this thread from the archives on thrust charts

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ft-points.html

 

but not exact. The idea of doing a "thrust chart" to see your accelleration vs speed is a good one. It's hard to do via math alone, as there's something called effective mass that takes into acount that a lot of parts rotate at engine speed not wheel speed. At lower gears they take more energy to spin up.

Anyway, the "constant mass" thrust curve is an OK place to start, but if you're really serious, you'd measure it with an accelerometer based data aquisition system or by dynoing the engine in different gears.

Then the only other question is do you hold a gear at the end of the race because you wouldn't gain back the time lost to the shift. If you're serious about drag racing, choose the gearing, tire diamter etc. such that you reach the end of the gear run as you pass the final timing light.

Matt

 

MATT Gets the chocolate easter bunnie !! Nobody else is even close !! Rick $30 ?? Where? That might even get me to drag MY Mini there! HAPPY EASTER! I KNEW this was a set-up OBEY

 

Awesome times Paul .... that is what i used to run in the 1/4 mile with my Ram SRT10.

 

Adding to the top is huge on a road coarse.

Not too sure where this conversation wants to go........

If you're thinking drag racing.... Webster is serious, breaking into the 12s - STOCK - is not for the average Mini owner, like I said the man is serious. You can use all the science you want, read charts, talk to Austin Coil, it all comes down to how well you know your car & your own ability.

Hey Fish, now we're in it

 

This cars are a blast to drive and handle like a porsche I don't think i would make it a 1/4 mile car no replacement for displacement .... with that said these cars are awesome.

 

You win.The Mini is a really good roll & go, drag racer??? The replacement for cubic inches is cubic dollars - Tom Walkenshaw

 

Fish to answer your Question, Bandemere Speedway in Morrison CO, every Wednsday and Sunday for test and tune $30.00 for racers $15.00 for spectators, or stop by the Colorado State Patrol office and they have free race passes Thats right run your car for FREE!

As for dragging any FWD car geting them to stick is the big issue. It really dosn't matter on precice shift points unless you are a big time racer that is there to flat out compete against a sanctioned field of cars. Close enough is good enough for 99% of people at test and tunes.
If you really want your numbers to drop work on your launch technique, I went from a 15.5 to a 14.8 just by droping tire psi and geting the car to somewhat stick.

 

You're supposed to shift where your peak HP occurs. Stock R53s peak at 6,000 RPM, and you should shift there, not at the 6,750 RPM redline. If your new dyno chart shows a peak at 6,850 RPM, you shift at that point. Or you can shift a little earlier, say 6,700 RPM. Get a shift light installed to help you out. In the drag race world, it's always better to shift too early rather than too late. By shifting early, you continue to stay in the portion of the power band that continues to increase. Shifting too late puts you over that line and can actually slow you down.

 

Ok Matt .. Guess you already devoured that bunnie like the last evo and along comes Jumpin J.J. Another Bunnie IS due !! OBEY

 

This is quite poor advice for a stock R53, as they have a very linear power band due to the supercharger.



Based on stock 2002-2004 Cooper S gearing with a 205/45/17 OEM tire size;

If you were to shift at 6950rpm (limiter stock) you would be making just about peak power of 140whp. Going to second gear would net you at 4367rpm which would bring you down to 98ish whp.

As per your advice on the most power / fastest way;

If you shift at 6000rpm as you suggest, first your peak power shifting at 6000rpm would be 130whp. Going to second gear would net you at 3770rpm and about 85whp.

So in total you have missed out on about 10whp peak power, and 12-15whp whp after shifting. I did not bother calculating the torque as it is fairly flat stock, which is what you are discussing.

How exactly is this faster again?