Haha yea...you don't want to run more than 20.

But I just learned from MINI that it triggers the boost pressure too high fault code at 1875 mBar ~ 27 psi. The fact that they have the upper threshold set so high before triggering a fault code tells me that the motor can actually handle more than we all think......if the motor was as fragile as everyone assumes, they would set the threshold much lower, seeing as it is there for safety's sake.

...I won't conclude that yet though, but plausible.

 

me too......... especially with the other goodies

 

Work? I dont think I could contain myself! I would be out there during the night installing that thing. I see what your doing. Your keeping the thread subscribers in suspense hehe.

 

Mike wrote:
Sorry to jump in, but where did you get the gt28rs for that price. I am interested

 

After some internet price checking:

$1000 gt28rs turbo
$600-800 intercooler
$150 oil and coolant lines
$600-$1800 turbo back exhaust
$600-$1100 for a tune

A total on the high-average side is $4850.

Unless you're buying non-branded eBay crap, getting some sort of sponsorship or discount, or buying used parts, your numbers are off by a good bit.


I think a direct-fit, upgraded JCW turbo is definitely a more economical solution.

 

That is for my full conversion. Yes they are accurate prices. No its not ebay crap. Your not comparing apples to apples. My build is a complete overhaul of turbo, exhaust, intake, intercooler and basically the base supporting mods for a larger turbo. Which should yield much higher results than just a bolt on jcw turbo(which is what we are talking about here). Doing the GT28rs bolt on kit looks like a much wiser choice in my opinion.

ATP GT28rs turbo kit direct bolt on for the mini good for up to 350hp.
$1995.00 on the really high side. I have seen them in the $1700.00 range.

Upgraded jcw turbo.
700.00 for the used turbo
830.00 for the work
Total:1530.00

And at your lowest pricing for a full complete build with the $1000.00 turbo is $2950.00. I also did not include any gauges or monitoring. Tack a few hundred more on for that but you should have them whenever you start upgrading beyond stock. I wasnt trying to get crazy with breakdowns but if you want we can.

I picked up my turbo for another car project by calling up a vendor and asking them if they could beat a competitors price. I got an insane deal and yes that is not normal. $1000.00 is a good price to find them at.

I am very curious about his build I would love to see the numbers and how its comes out. I am not ******* his build at all. It just is not the approach I would take. I see the upgrade as a small step and it would probably leave me in the position wishing I had more. You know how the addiction is. Once you start upgrading you cant stop. Like I said before its people like him that help push the upgrades of a car to the next level.

 

You seem to have missed my point. Unless you're building a drag racer, I think you'll find the Cooper to be a bit traction limited in street kit. A direct bolt-on turbo is probably a better choice for a lot of people than something that requires more extensive modding.

An upgraded JCW turbo bolts on, allows use of the factory downpipe, and doesn't require new oil and coolant lines (but as a rule, the oil return line should be replaced.) Oh, you seem to have omitted an intake for the GT28 as well.

I know the bug. I've had three turbo Mitsus, two turbo GTIs, a TDI jetta, and an RX7 that I got out of when I decided a turbo would be too expensive. I threw away all sorts of money on some of those cars. And, given the option, I'll probably be buying turbocharged cars for a long time.

There's always more power to be had. Unfortunately, I don't think the Cooper S is a good chassis for 300+ hp.

We'll see how all of this turns out. Hopefully I'm wrong because I'd love to see a well sorted aftermarket kit developed by the time I'm out of warranty.

 

Got the turbo installed and my alta turbo back I had sitting in my garage for many months. It looks like my guess on adjusting the wastegate was right on. The car is producing the same boost as the stock turbo, 14psi max. It also does not seem to come on any later than it did in stock form, this could be due to the larger exhaust. I had expected a bit of lag from the larger wheels.

Seat of the pants: the traction light seems to be coming on a bit more than it did before but other than that it really only feels slightly faster, as expected from the turbo alone. I'll need to drive it a bit more to be sure.

I didnt really take many pictures but I can post up what I took on Monday while checking the forum at work. The turbo looks stock so unless the pictures had the wheels in them it would just look like I took the stock turbo off and back on.

So now it's time for a tune, Jan said the remote tune should be ready by the end of the month.

 

Any updates Ellessar on your hybrid turbo and Jan tune?

 

The Jan tune has made a difference on my hybrid setup. I don't think it's perfect yet but much better than running without. Before the Jan tune I was having trouble getting the car to boost consistantly. It would boost up to say 13psi then drop down to 8psi. I say its not perfect because I still have some odd boost behavior but think that soon Jan will have a tune for the hybrid setup.

 

Any dyno numbers with the jan tune and the hybrid turbo?

 

No Dyno numbers to post yet and honestly I don't have a huge amount of time right now to work on the car. Hopefully things will slow down a bit at work and I'll get a weekend to myself.

 

Are you running one of Jan's canned tunes or was this a tune on a dyno?

 

It was not done on the dyno. I don't think it's the same as the canned tune. Jan sent a few different tunes for me to try before the one im currently using, tune 5.

 

Does the GT25r40R exist. Doesn't seem to come up on the google search.


Ray

 

No...There is only GT2554R and the GT2560R

 

So which one do I want for 100hp increase?

Ray

 

The 54 is better suited for our motor...

But you can get close to 100whp/100wtrq increase putting a JCW turbo on an S....it's a direct swap, no custom fabbing required and the motor will still look stock under the hood.

 

or if you want to do the little work and save about 400 bucks (maybe more depending on where you get the JCW turbo) you can just go hybrid setup with a K04-023 compressor wheel and a similar turbine fin with 12 fins rather than the stock 10... that makes just shy of 100whp more at 19 psi at redline.... about 50-70whp elsewhere...

so to Unclemeat... not to attack at all but it seems your math is just a little off with the K03/4 Hybrid concept numbers you came up with "This shouldnt rule out a hybrid upgrade for a non-JCW CooperS, but expect peak performance of about 250 crank HP from a K04." i'm making 250WHP and using basic concept that FWD cars lose approx 15% in drivetrain loss that puts my crank around 290 crank @ 19psi... that's 20 above your approximation of 270 crank with JCW turbo. then again this isn't factoring in the compression difference between the S and JCW cars.. higher compression could be helping these numbers i'm making. but quite honestly i'dlove to get my hands on a JCW turbo and see how that works on my car as well... get a back to back of this and a hybrid...

 

Sweet- Where or who do I send the turbo to for this upgrade?

Thanks again.


Ray

 

I had mine done at a company called Blousch, wait period/turn-over is usually around two weeks so if your mini is a daily driver, i'd suggest waiting for the kit to be sold (it's close trust me, but because its' so close thats why i'm not giving out any specifics on the tuning/exactly what's done to the turbo) but keep an eye on Alta/Helix13... the kit is a collaboration of the two together as well as some Jan input as well

 

Ok. Let's go another direction here. I have a 2009 factory JCW. I have the Alta stage 3 running the "race or dyno tuned map". On a mustang dyno I got 220whp and 260 wtq. I bought a new MCS not JCW turbo from the dealer and sent it to Alta for upgrading. Got it this past Friday & put it on. One of the things me and my employee noticed is the upgrade MCS turbo inlet is .058" smaller then the factory JCW. And the OD is smaller to. Jeff gave me 3 maps to start out with. The first one peaked at 16 psi and the car was slow. So I jumped to the 3rd one which peaked at 18 psi and still slow. So I went back to the Stage 3 race map and the power is back but not sure if it's any quicker. I made data logs of all my runs and sent them to Jeff. As far as I can tell looking and the recordings all is well. Jeff said to get the MCS turbo and not the JCW for upgrading. At this point my concern is I upgraded a MCS turbo that is now at the JCW level. Not I big deal I can send them the JCW turbo for upgrading. My goal here is to see 275-300hp at the wheels. Or should I consider this as an option...

http://www.atpturbo.com/mm5/merchant...ry_Code=COOPER

 

my .02 is say away from the ATP's GT28RS because it's not as well versed for our engine as some would think... spool won't be as great even though it's ball bearing instead of journal bearing, it's not twin scroll so it won't be used to the best possible potential... then there's all the other stuff you need for it to work... cut your hood, boost tube, oil lines, water lines... it's just more effort than is needed..

was the turbo inlet modified at all? or was it just modified in the housings? also did you get just compressor or turbine too? my setup has a modified inlet section that basically acts as a velocity stack. also my setup was getting 249whp on a mustang dyno, BUT i'm making only 233wtq... my o2 sensor is going tho so it's effecting what my car wants to do all time time cuz it's not reading AFR right all the time... once thats' back and fixed, i'll most likely be making much better power and more consistent power. i'll redyno after that's done and the boost is upped to approx 22psi... Also if you have an upgraded turbo, then you'd be running stage 4 not stage 3...

 

The GT28 is too big for the 1.6l motor.

I find it very weird that you have a factory JCW and bought a stock MCS turbo to get modified. You car essentially comes with a modified MCS turbo from the factory....which explains why u can't even tell if it's faster. As far as I know too...the JCW and S turbo's cost the same. I can get both for cheaper than anyone will get them for you, just for future ref.

If you want to see 275-300hp at the wheels you are going to need to go to a custom setup....and I'd recommend a GT2554R or something in the Mistu TD-04 size range. Alta made those kind numbers with a GT25 back in the days when they only had the UniChip to tune with! With a proper tune, it's easily a 300whp turbo. That was on an S though, which has higher compression than your JCW...but the GT25 should easily meet your needs.

And all I know....is I have a JCW turbo on my car, which the tune isn't even 100% complete for and it far exceeds my expectations and I see 0 need for anything bigger...1st and 2nd gear are useless. My front tires hate me

 

Wait that's what he did?? he had a JCW and bought a MCS Turbo to modify? no offense but what was he thinking? the JCW turbo is perfect for the MCS!!!!! the only reason i went hybrid was cuz i had a budget that couldn't get a $1000 turbo...

i still wouldn't get the GT25 (i believe alta used a GT2560R instead of the GT2554... but i remember outright that the spool was WAY off... it wasn't till like 4000 that any power came BUT once the power was there itwas WAY up there.... so you'd ahve the rev the crap out of your engine to get the most out of it and for those who are used to the lower end torque and now a race style turbo setup (higher revs higher power... u already know that thumper but some others may not...) the bigger turbo just may not be what they're looking for in terms of daily driving which is why i still suggest hybrid/JCW turbos... i would be extremely curious to see if my hybrid can flow a little more than the JCW turbo... i have to get a compressor map for mine somehow... because i know that some tunes the JCW turbo flows decently at 24 PSI on some JCWs... if i did my math correctly i think my turbo compressor wheel will flow the same while being in a higher efficiency plateau in the compressor map (that's just going off the maps i've seen for the K04-024 wheel... the fact that my housings are different that the turbo it's usually in will effect the characteristis). but yeah... thumper, if you're ever in the philly area and wanna crash at my place for a weekend, i'd love to swap info and maybe turbos for a day and see what the difference is between the two, or just drive yours and vice versa

Just curious, since you're running JCW turbo on yours, did you notice lack of spool? my power comes on just 200 rpms later than with the stock setup, and i can't for the life of me see why my torque is so much lower... not going to complain, my tires hate me no matter what even with traction control on, but the power seems so linear up till 3500 then it's just forget about it ahahah (that's one point where i'm making more than 60whp more than my untuned stage 4 setup and at old readline it's 98whp more than the untuned version...

i wonder if the failing O2 sensor could be making the power difference.... cuz if it's reading something different for AFR than what actually is that'll screw with power and timing and all that...