It has been determined since Pure13's findings that there is at least one more car (safety sean) that has the same map as Pure did. There were 3 other Evotech cars at the May PSMINI dyno day that obtained low numbers, and they're being contacted in hopes of having their ECUs checked as well.

It looks like we've moved past Pure13's issues but in light of the discovery of other examples, this issue will be further investigated and hopefully resolved to the satisfaction of all parties.

 

OK let's review.

Pure13 bought a product that was not as-advertised. He did not know that the fuel/ignition maps were not altered until the Jan tune (because very few people have the ability to view fuel maps on their own). Upon discovering the problem, you expected him to give Jan the finger and pass off this extremely-rare-three-months-in-the-making opportunity? "Thanks for reading my software Jan, but now that I know there's a problem, I'm going to pass up the opportunity to fix it and see if I can get some resolution out of a vendor who merely distributes the product."

Fact: pure13's product was not as advertised. He has a right to say so without resolution from the vendor, regardless of what action he takes next. I deal with this ALL the time in retail management. Let me tell you how that goes... "I bought Product X here 2 weeks ago and it broke." "Would you like me to exchange it for you?" "I already got a new one from Vendor Y"... do I then berate the customer for not giving me the opportunity to fix the problem? No. I give them their money back and thank them for shopping with us in the first place.

I have nothing against Madness here. While I believe that the distributor is responsible for the quality of the products they choose to sell, in this case, Madness had no way to verify the quality of the product they were selling. Now that they know, I am sure they are taking steps with Evotech to improve it because I believe they are a reputable vendor. If they chose to do nothing and continue selling the product, I would be a little more worried.

One thing I am getting tired of seeing is that no one can ever post an opinion or experience here without getting ripped apart.

 

So pure13 shows up to build upon what he thinks is a 230whp car (according to MM site info) and finds out that he has a 188whp car.
I asked several posts ago:
If there is nothing wrong with the Evotech software where is the missing 42whp? When was the last time a MINI got that kind of HP bump with just the hardware in that particular package?
Anybody have an answer yet?
As a couple of others have stated, either here or on psmini.org, when the car is on the dyno and there are other cars waiting in line, there's no time to sit and wait for a dealer response.

 

I do not see where anyone mention a name and the word free ? That must be the air thing you were talking about.

I wonder how you buy one product have a problem do not wait to get it taken care of and get another? The excuse even by some NAM moderator to take advantage of a "tune party" to justify reasoning of some things discussed here. That is just Bad Business ethic's !


You have to think about how this started. Instead of perhaps a personal experience with Evo Tech from start to resolve and asking for other experiences would have been more appropriate. Instead it was some what different?

"fishy"

You know the truth/facts eventually comes out. It may take some time but it always does. And some things are like Pandora's box to.

 

IMO Mini-Madness does not advertise there packages as WHEEL hp but rather, simply hp. At 188.8whp *1.15 for drivetrain loss he was at 217hp. Still 15-20hp shy of the claimed number, this 15-20 hp could easily be found in simple retuned fuel maps by Evotech which seem to be the only thing missing.

Now with the RMW tune and 203.7whp * 1.15 he is right at 234hp. Right where he should be based on the packge.

Now I would find it hard to believe that a "canned" tune could make as much power as a custom tune...but there is no reason it couldn't bring him to 225-230hp which is pretty close to as advertised.

 

WTF ! ! !

Are you even capable of reading and comprehending the written word?

As posted before.......pure13 was in Tacoma for a scheduled tune by Jan to try and eek out a bit more from his car. He had already commited to buying Jans tune and the dyno time BEFORE finding out his Evotech was garbage. When Jan downloaded the map from his car the only mods done to it were the traction control (DSC) and the RPM limit. Pure13 didn't know he had a problem with the Evotech tune until Jan pointed out the problem (other than lower expected dyno results). I saw the file. No other changes were made. Why would he refuse to get a custom tune just to try and get a fix from MM? MM didn't screw-up, Evotech did. MM was simply the retailer.

As for the free comment........So Pure13 was at a tune party? That means he got free work.Kind of like Tupperware. Heck I would have done that myself. Look familiar, it should it's from your post........

 

That's it. You're done. You talk about facts then dispute them. You continuously contradict yourself. At this point I don't even remember what we are arguing about, because if you consider yourself a purveyor of facts, then there would be no arguement.

 

If MM lists BHP rather than WHP and what you have posted above is correct, I have no issues with rephrasing my questions to reflect that. But your post, as polite as it is, still doesn't answer my questions.

 

Apparently it is in the software which did not include fuel/ignition tuning whatsoever.

Apparently not, as adjustments to the fuel/timing/magical torque-increaser that Jan did actually made the advertised horsepower.

This would support the position that the Evotech software caused the Madness "Stage 3" kit to perform under expectations and advertised claims. While the hardware included is now proven at the levels claimed, the software seems to have let it down.

I hope Madness gets this sorted with Evotech as they are obviously providing a good hardware package that just needs proper tuning support.

 

Well said ScottinBend. Some guys have no clue about ECU tuning. We had the same Evotech issue in Detroit. I don't believe that MM would even know of the problem if they send the ECU out, which they most likely do. The facts are the facts.

 

I think billzcat got it for you. Basically...the 18hp that is missing is due to the software...it is an Evotech problem. The MM hardware can most certainly support the number, but the lack of actual fuel/timing tuning is where it is fallng short. I guess that is what a lot of the craziness in this thread is about

 

Yep......too many bozo's not actually reading the post and then jumping to conclusions......

 

First of all you have no position to tell me I am done! BIG( )

I guess I did mention the word free. ops my bad. But I think the point went where it I wanted it to go.

Scottbend is right about one thing and I quote his post " Yep......too many bozo's not actually reading the post and then jumping to conclusions......"

This thread should have been Moderated a long time ago

 

Why?

 

As far as i can tell, the OP has a reason to gripe about what he paid for and what he received.
I think that the issue should be taken up with the chip maker though, not the distributor.
It should be as simple as a phone call to the distributor. let him know the problem, and the distributor should take the part back and either exchange it with another, or refund the money in full.

 

Yep..........too many bozo's and yes you are done.

oh.....oops my bad

 

This thread is starting to exemplify NAM hypocrisy

 

off topic:
I don't think so not by anything you can do !


on topic:

I guess will all just have to see what progress is made this week with Evo Tech and Mini Madness on this issue. During the weekday when there tech people available to contact.

 

I think everyone should take a break from this thread until George and Jan can converse on the topic...I know, a little too much to ask, but worth a try

 

Thats easy enough to do...