Drivetrain (Cooper S) MINI Cooper S (R53) intakes, exhausts, pulleys, headers, throttle bodies, and any other modifications to the Cooper S drivetrain.

Drivetrain Why no CARB certification for MINI mods?

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Old Aug 29, 2007 | 01:32 PM
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bee1000n's Avatar
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Why no CARB certification for MINI mods?

This is primarily a question for vendors, but maybe some others have input, too.

I'm just wondering why no one other than K&N offers intake/exhaust products that are CARB (California Air Resources Board) approved for road use in California. K&N's intake is the only product I've seen approved - even a large company like Dinan doesn't have CARB-approved products.

In doing some research for my dad, I found headers and intakes for Miatas that are approved which made me wonder why nothing for the MINI is. People have been modding Miatas for a lot longer than MINIs so I suppose there is a larger market to justify any expense required for the approval, but I don't even know what is required for approval in the first place.
 
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Old Aug 29, 2007 | 01:46 PM
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money
 
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Old Aug 29, 2007 | 03:10 PM
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bean's Avatar
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mozzarella: could you be a little more concise?
 

Last edited by bean; Aug 29, 2007 at 03:27 PM.
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Old Aug 29, 2007 | 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by mozzarella
money
Hit the nail on the head with that one.

Costs money to have the parts tested & approved. Like has been said so well.....MONEY
 
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Old Aug 29, 2007 | 03:50 PM
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Money and time...

it takes effort and the marginal cost per product sold is pretty scary for very small markets. Sad, but true. The Alta folks have been pretty up front about thier efforts and frustrations in this area....

Matt
 
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Old Aug 29, 2007 | 04:47 PM
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What steps must the manufacturer take to get something CARB-certified?
 
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Old Aug 29, 2007 | 05:00 PM
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Originally Posted by wilhelmh
What steps must the manufacturer take to get something CARB-certified?
Here is a link to the paperwork side. http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/forms/forms.htm

This has manuals, guidelines and lists of approved parts. http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/aftermkt.htm

In the end many small vendors find the process onerous and expensive for the small volume of parts sold.

The Miata you choose as an example has been in production for I think 20 years or so now. There are so many on the roads that it is feasible to spread the cost of certification over a large number of parts sold. No so for a Mini, not only are there many fewer on the streets but market is much smaller for potential vendors. The cost per unit will be much greater increasing the parts cost. Factor in that CARB cert costs are up front development costs and you will find that for a small vendor the cash is not there. Yes, the end up overlooking the probable biggest market, CA, but in the long run those in CA that want the parts seem to find a way to get around the rules.
 

Last edited by gnatster; Aug 29, 2007 at 05:08 PM.
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Old Aug 29, 2007 | 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by mozzarella
money
Yes. I think it is somewhere around $50000 per part just to have it tested to see if it qualifies
 
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Old Aug 29, 2007 | 07:17 PM
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Originally Posted by bee1000n
This is primarily a question for vendors, but maybe some others have input, too.

I'm just wondering why no one other than K&N offers intake/exhaust products that are CARB (California Air Resources Board) approved for road use in California. K&N's intake is the only product I've seen approved - even a large company like Dinan doesn't have CARB-approved products.

In doing some research for my dad, I found headers and intakes for Miatas that are approved which made me wonder why nothing for the MINI is. People have been modding Miatas for a lot longer than MINIs so I suppose there is a larger market to justify any expense required for the approval, but I don't even know what is required for approval in the first place.
It's not economically feasible for the small market vendors. It's a racket, like everything else the government regulates and controls.

I presume the parts in the JCW tuning kit are CARB approved. That may be our only legal power tuning option here in CA. But I say why start obeying the law now?
 
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Old Aug 29, 2007 | 07:28 PM
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I've heard from an insider at Dinan that they have completed the sertification process and arw just waiting for the final paperwork to be processed (How long CARB will take is anyones guess)
 
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Old Aug 30, 2007 | 01:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Fassbinder
I've heard from an insider at Dinan that they have completed the sertification process and arw just waiting for the final paperwork to be processed (How long CARB will take is anyones guess)
Heard the same thing myself, and I quote: "we just passed the California Air Resources Board test on our system so it will be 50 State Legal once we receive the EO number. Not a big deal in your locale but thought it would be nice to know we are "clean as a whistle!"."

As I understand it, since Dinan sells their parts packaged as "systems" they only need to CARB cert their S1 and S2 systems saving over certing each individual part.
 
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Old Aug 30, 2007 | 02:15 AM
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From: Weeblegabber West (aka WLA)
Originally Posted by bee1000n
This is primarily a question for vendors, but maybe some others have input, too.

I'm just wondering why no one other than K&N offers intake/exhaust products that are CARB (California Air Resources Board) approved for road use in California. K&N's intake is the only product I've seen approved - even a large company like Dinan doesn't have CARB-approved products.
This is why I have the K&N Typhoon CAI in my Wanda.
 
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Old Aug 30, 2007 | 09:09 PM
  #13  
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From: Long Beach, CA
Also, note there is no CARB restriction on cat-back exhaust systems, so that is a "freebie" mod as far as CARB goes.
 
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