My Cosmic Blue All4 is 'awaiting transport." Meanwhile, like most of you I suppose, I'm reading and viewing everything I can about the car in anticipation.

Well a couple of recent reviews have given me pause and placed me on the verge of buyer's remorse. First is the White Roof Radio and Motoringfile review by Detroit Tuned's Chad Miller. In a generally favorable discussion, he points out a few negatives, including two that were big to me: a less-than-comfortable driver's seat and disappointing gas mileage.

Then there was a New York Times review by Ezra Dyer that pointed out that the car's quarter-mile time was exactly the same as the Toyota Sienna minivan. I didn't need to hear that.

If you add to those negatives the complaints on this board about the Mini Connected interface (I'm a techie type, so Mini Connected was a huge selling point) and the issues with the rail, and I'm a bit concerned.

For background, my current ride is an '02 Cooper that's nearing 100,000 miles.

The Motoring file review is here.
The New York Times review is here.

I'd be grateful for your thoughts.

 

Only you know how you feel and only you will know what to do but since you asked...here are my 2¢:

IMHO it's not the speed of the MINI - I've had faster cars. It's the handling. You can floor an a$$ van or humongoid SUV in a straight line and get the same 1/4 mile time. That's vanilla automobile talk/specs. It will never be as fun nor will the experience be as unique as it will be in a MINI. If it's the techie stuff I'm not sure how widespread the issues are but as a techie you must be aware that with most new technology there are issues/bugs to be worked out.

I suggest you talk to your MA before "your" car arrives. Tell him about your concerns and ask what your options are. Will he let you test drive it before doing the paperwork and if you don't like it will he let you shop the lot or run an unclaimed inventory at the VPC and allow you to select another vehicle? Whatever happens...good luck to you. It'll work out as it's supposed to.

 

Lest we forget the motivation behind most review$

'nuff said.

Congrats and Good luck with your new CM desite the B$ reviews


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How much of a deposit did you leave them? They probably will be able to find another buyer for this particular car if you back out. I, too, was disappointed when I saw that gas mileage in Chad's writeup.

 

If you like the style, love MINI and want the CM, then don't have any remorse.

I find our CM is fast enough, poor mileage, I drive a 4.7V8 Jeep GC as our 3rd car, I think 17 is poor avg mileage.

When our CM gets 33 on the Hwy here in Colorado I do flips of happiness.

I do hope you enjoy your CM, you will get used to the seats. I find them very good.

I'm about 5'9 and 190, I fit fine.

 

Day to day I expect to get around 27 MPG or so, the All4 will suck away some gas milage but the extra handling at speed around corners or in snow or rain, I think make it a decent tradeoff. I do think part of the lower MPG in the review is from a combination of a lot of people, plus some aggressive driving.

Having an '02 (I have an 03 myself), you should be used to making the tradeoff between getting good mileage and stomping down the pedal for some fun! :-)

As for the seat, we'll see but in test drives I thought the seat seemed pretty comfortable.

Two things - as the other response mentioned, a big part of getting the MINI is the handling. No way the Sienna steering is as direct. Nor will it corner as well. Just because Toyota has built an impressively powered minivan, does not mean you should be dissatisfied with the base power of the Countryman.

Also even though the quarter-mile time is the same, I'm guessing the MINI is at least slightly more responsive when you get on the pedal.

Also anticipate aftermarket mods to help improve power, if the base power is not quite enough (though again in test driving I felt like it was pretty good compared to my '03 MCS). You are going to have a lot more power upgrade choices with the Countryman than you would with the Sienna.

I'm also a techie type, and I think we'll see that improve. There are already some cool things in there, and MINI can do a lot with software updates to make the thing even better. If you're a programming techie type the thing to do is reverse-engineer the MINI Connected software, and then build something even better around it...

 

Well I read the reviews and didn't find either one overwhelmingly negative. Overall I'm still pleased with our choice in the CM to replace our crew cab truck. 24MPG will be a dream LOL. And, it was a brand new car from what I could tell so I'm sure that will improve as the CM settles in.
I guess I just must be easy to please, I've almost never had a complaint about the comfortability of an car seat I've ever sat in. I would have to ride on a milk crate I guess to have a problem.
All reviewers have to find some points to have issues with, I don't think I've ever read a perfect review of anything, ever. So if those are the biggest issues, than fine.
I don't expect the CM to handle exactly like my MCS, how could it? But it is still way more fun and responsive than all the other 4door small SUVs we tried. A bit of roll in the corners is not the end of the world, it can fill some needs my MCS can't. There are tradeoffs in anything.
Annette

 

I wouldn't say that about either MotoringFile or White Roof Radio. Those guys are MINI enthusiasts and loyal to the brand. If you follow them, you'd know that they are predisposed to be positive about MINI products.

BTW, the White Roof Radio audio review is much more extended than the MotoringFile article and can be found here (Countryman discussion begins around 42:00): http://www.whiteroofradio.com/woofca...edium=feed&utm

 

That seemed a bit odd to me, so I went and looked up specs - while that is technically true 0-60 is faster in the Countryman, at 7.6. vs. 7.9 for the sienna - oddly as you say the quarter mile ends up about the same amount of time, although the Countryman is still 0.1 sec faster...

Toyota data:

http://www.insideline.com/toyota/sie...omparison.html

Countryman data:

http://www.insideline.com/mini/count...and-video.html

Also look at the slalom figures, 59 MPH for the Sienna and 67 for the Countryman. Now THAT's why you buy a MINI!

Note that the tested speed is with the sunroof and runflats, so if you ordered without the sunroof that would improve things a bit and replacing the runflats would improve things further (though I personally am getting both sunroof and love runflats).

See, so cheer up, you'll be pulling ahead of minivans in no time even if the mom next to you at the light really stomps on it!

 

Also, the MPG will be better without the All4, which is what we're getting. YAY, us!
Annette

 

So just who is paying these people to say negative things? I'm sure you can fill us in

 

reviews are good for observations that may or may not be important to an individual. This car meets my need perfectly. Mileage is good with the all4 unless you drive it hard, which i probably true of the non All4 S. I wanted an AWD car that was fun with mileage over 30 MPG. Also, I am pleased with the comfort of the seats. I would be more interested in the long term reviews for reliability and safety

 

Ever hear of competition or bias? If not maybe then you are living in some sort of bubble ? I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

Did I say someone was "paying these people to say negative things" or are you simply just trying to put words in my mouth ?

I'm sure you can fill us in


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I feel your pain, but am here to mitigate it. I think you'll enjoy your car, if your expectations are realistic...

#1: It's true, the seats basically suck. They're fine for normal trips, but anything over two hours might be tough. I haven't driven it that long in one sitting yet. The main problem, IMHO, is lack of thigh and overall leg support. The seats lack an ability to angle the lower seat, which to me is ridiculous at this pricepoint. The Corvette is another car that is held in high esteem, but its seats are regarded as simply RIDICULOUS--I think the MINI's seats should be more supportive.

#2: Overall speed. This is no sports car; it's a fun, sporty, useful car. Hit the sport button and you'll feel more (artificial) weight in the steering, faster throttle response, and a (slightly) louder exhaust. It's plenty quick for what it is, and I have the ALL4. This won't bother you.

#3: The mileage. I'm getting just over 23 in city driving according to the car's computer. I primarily take short trips. I hope this improves, but I don't know how much it will the way I drive. You'll obviously do worse trying to beat those minivans down to the stoplight! Supercharged and turbocharged gasoline-engined MINIs never did that great on mileage. Diesels or hybrids will serve you better here, if that's your goal.

#4: MINI Connected: As Charlie Sheen would say, "WINNING"! No complaints here either. The Pandora app is amazing, and the nav system if fine to me, and the HK stereo is the best OEM unit I've heard in a while. Considering what it does, it's impressive, and will likely only improve.

So, don't worry! You'll enjoy it. Pimp it out a bit to your liking, and it will smile back at your every time you get in it. It's a unique, different car that appeals only to some of us. You knew its limitations going in, but felt its positives outweighted them. Don't focus on the negative. Enjoy it!

 

Uh, oh. Just read today's Wall Street Journal and Dan Neil reviews the Countryman. Interestingly, there's a link to a video review on the WSJ website that's almost totally positive and a much more detailed print review that's mixed. He spends a lot of time on whether Mini should have stayed true to the brand, which is of no interest to me. He seems to like the styling and the interior appointments. The part that gave me pause was his description of the handling. He writes, "when the road goes twisty, the Countryman can come unstuck in ways that are positively un-Mini."

The link is here.

 

if your having second thoughts go back to the dealership and test drive again, and decide for yourself.

 

Seriously? This is not the MCS, or even a sports car in any stretch of the imagination. This is like complaining that my MCS won't seat 8 people. I wonder if the reviewer was annoyed by those pesky extra doors, too?
Maybe you should cancel your order and get an MCS instead. If flying around the twisties is your ultimate goal then you bought the wrong vehicle I'm thinking. If having a nice utility vehicle that is more fun and responsive than what has come to be expected of this class, then you should be sitting pretty. It's a taller, longer, heavier, 4 door vehicle and will probably drive a bit differently than the lower, lighter, 2 door MCS. It will also be roomier on trips, will be able to carry more stuff and will even be easier to get in and out of.
I'm pretty sure a Cayenne handles differently than a Cayman, too.

Annette

 

I too was disappointed with the MPG, but it seems to be improving as I retrain my foot using the realtime MPG gauge. My all around driving is about 25.9. My highway driving on my first road trip was 30.5. I have been looking at a Mini for years and just didn't want to go without AWD, so when the CM was announced I jumped at the chance assuming that Mini would be true to their gas squeezing reputation and I'd be getting mid to high 30's, but unfortunately that didn't happen. But, that's the compromise for AWD - I don't purport to know what other AWD vehicles get, but I'm thinking the CM must be pretty good in comparison.
As to the seats - I'm amazed that some view them negatively! I love the way they grab your backside and hold on tight. They are the most comfortable car seats I have experienced.
Bottom line: this car is a blast and I'm glad I waited for AWD.

 

Just Do It!

 

Mini's are no Sienna, CM or otherwise.

Yes, actually the 2004 Sienna (the first of the made in USA, large size ones) could actually suck the headlights out of most contemporary body on frame SUV's on long pulls up the Sierra passes. Saw many a red faced Expedition and Suburban owner literally leaning forward when I (legally) passed as if that would speed up 5,000+ pound body on frame behemoths. But otherwise as pointed out, completely different vehicle than a Mini of any variety. Humongous. Bound to get front and rear bumper dings given its size. Cornered better than the SUV's but still a relative land yacht. Had to install rear air bladders to stiffen it a bit for towing, or to carry the 7 person full load without wallowing like a porpoise. And by the way, I doubt the stereotype soccer parent who drives them would even know the 0-60 times. In a different universe than a Mini.

Oh yeah, then the vaunted Toyota quality. Let's see, there was the recall for the power steering hoses that didn't quite survive the cold. Oh, and then the AT cooling lines. Oh, and then the radiator recall/replacement. All seemingly related to didn't quite cut it in the cold weather. But wait, then the rear liftgate shocks years later for essentially the same thing. You think a German company wouldn't properly cold weather test their car? Those aside, then there was the auto tranny the dealer managed literally to break when tightening an access plate to fix a leaky seal. Oops, two tranny pulls AND a motor pull later they realized they damaged the internals and replaced it under the extended warranty. Call it $8-10,000 on Toyota's or the dealer's nickel. The fuel economy: Putting aside that I think 30MPG on a 2010 MCS 6 speed that I have would be a pipe dream in mixed suburban driving, the Toyota barely made 15. Rarely saw 20MPG on a totally flat all freeway drive at steady 65 (i.e. best case). Of course, they made sure to calibrate the trip computer to tell you it was 17-18 when it was really 15; I know by dividing gallons trip meter miles at fill up by gallons purchased. Last, that great Toyota body panel steel. I guess they do it to save money in production and maybe lighten the porker weight a bit, but I have never appreciated the relatively thin steel Toyota seems to use that makes them more prone to everyday door dings. I know from owning it the steel was obviously thinner than the Mini, or Chrsylers, Ford's and Audi's I have owned. False economy.

Having said all that, Toyota was a decent haulmobile, much better thn our prior Chrysler T&C. No Mini is a haulmobile though; think X5 to even get into a somewhat similar zone. Toyota Sienna AWD is an okay but not top notch AWD system in the same zone as the Mini--reactive, FWD based, uses brakes to modulate. Not at all in the same zone as the Audi quattros I have owned, or a Subaru AWD system. Still will still get by 95% of the time, at least with true winter tires, and less weight penalty than the quattro's. But, again the Sienna is very different vehicle than a Mini set up. Indeed, if you are seriously thinking Sienna, look instead at a Lexus RX. Same floorpan and drivetrain fundamentally as the Sienna, but at least a fair number of notches closer to CM in basic seating, somewhat smaller, etc.

 

You are saying money drives reviews. How would Chad of Detroit Tuned be monetarily influenced by saying something bad about cars he makes a living working on?

Just explain your point and no assumptions will be needed.

 

"***-ume" -I hate that word.

I bet this has something to do with my earlier comment on another thread about "Smurf Blue"


L8R
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Nope. I've never seen you before until this.

Make your point.

 

Chad has since said that the non-leather seats are much more comfortable. Of course some would have us think that he was paid to say that