I want to replace my springs with the eibach pro kit spring set up, but I have been reading that this change will cause negative camber which will require purchasing adjustable control arms,to correct, true or false? does anyone have an i dea as to the cost of the adjustable arms? do the arms help in improved ahandling of the car or just camber control and ride smoothness? and finally is it not better to change the coil cover since it further improves handling, or will i need the control arms replacement in any event? Do i sound confused! trust me i am.....

many tnx

 

coils require corner balance, and defenitely control arms, most control arms run in the area 250 or so

control arms isn't a must have option, but highly recommended, you will get excessive rear camber that can cause extra tire wear... your call

 

miniaq,
Aloha and welcome to NAM.
Whenever you add any lowering springs kit you will risk changing the negative camber in front and rear and affect the toe settings as well.
Some owners just live with the resultant changes to the alignment while others do an alignment to adjust the toe settings to stock specs.

If your rear camber is too negative outside the stock spec settings then your handling may be adversely affected. Mine was, I got H-sport springs and negative camber was -2.4 degrees in the rear.

If you add the springs and the handling is OK with you then leave it alone and rotate the tires regularly like every 3000 miles. Expect a little more wear on the inner edge.

If you want to adjust rear camber back to stock settings you will need adjustable rear lower control arms (about $240 per pair). There are a total of four control arms. All four could be changed but the upper control arms are for adjusting toe more easily and not required. This adds to labor costs roughly 1-2 more hours. Plus alignment is about $90.

An alignment to within factory specs would give you the smoothest ride and best wear on your tires. Your choice. Hit a pothole and your alignment can get worse if it is a little off to begin with.

 

thank u for all the help, and here i was thinking i can lower the car just by throwing in some shorter springs!

anyway do u think since i am getting the springs i should order the control arms at the same time to avoid taking the car back and.....secondly are all alignment places qualified to do these modifications or do i need a specialist? I live in the L.A. are.

 

It's a toss up. there are some owners that have gone only with the springs and no alignment and they are OK as far as they are concerned. You pay labor for spring install plus more for rear control arm install so doing it all at once is a bit better but everything adds up. Having the control arms that are adjustable means when you do the alignment you can ask for any setting for rear camber from less than -1.0 to -2.0 degrees. I ran my MCS with -0.7 for 6+ months and it was pretty good/smooth but not aggressive enough for autocross and track. Now I have -1.2 in the rear and -2.2 in the front for camber (I have front camber plates). You only need the lower rear adjustable control arms not the set of four.

Alignments are best done by alignment specialist not your average garage unless they have the equiptment for custom settings not just stock settings.

In the So. Calif area try Steve's. Check the So. Cal forum for more info and garages.

 

curiously, the mini suspension geometry is like this:

front: camber and toe stay constant over the full compression range of the strut. So if you put on lowering springs, there is no camber change.

rear: as the schock compresses, the camber goes more negative, up to 3 degrees. Toe is unchanged. So here, when you lower the car with different springs, you bring on the negative camber.

consider what happens when you corner though: the outside suspension will compress, depending on spring stiffness and anti-sway bar stiffness and dynamically, shock stiffness. this produces no camber change in front (this is good, so you retain that setting you had determined was optimum), but the rear still goes more negative, reaching whatever is dictated by the amount of compression.

Now the point of negative camber settings is to optimize the tire contact patch under hard cornering due to body lean, not suspension compression. If your car is rolling more, you will probably need a more negative setting in the front, but the rear will tend to take care of itself.

ultimately, the hot-shoes determine the settings emprically, by driving the car in corners then measuring tire temp across the width of the tread. camber is adjusted to get an even reading outside, inside and center on each tire. In order to do this, you need to be able to make that adjustment trackside. If you take the (good) advise of others for your settings, bear in mind that settings are specific for anti-sway settings, ride height and spring stiffness, shock stiffness.
for what it's worth, i'm running Leda coilovers all around, set at mid-range stiffness for the track, H&R swaybars front and rear, toe at 0.0 front and rear and 2deg neg camber front, 1 deg neg rear. And I still haven't taken the time to do tire temps readings or really play aroung with the settings.