You don't need the factory models... Think of it this way, most of the parts are on the order of a foot or greater in size. A good tape measure will give you about a quarter of an inch accuracy. That will be good enough to get you the general trends in what's going on, if not better. You don't need 5 significant figures to get usefull answers.

There is a free demo of this software http://www.susprog.com/ It's not too expensive.


And this thread has links to lots of high end stuff, including a plug in for SolidWorks.... http://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=23573

Also, for those that don't want to run the software, but do want to learn about suspension theory, some of the help files with the software packages are very informative.

Matt

ps you can get education versions of either Pro/E or Solidworks for $100-$200 that have a licence that's good for a couple of years, depending on the version you get.

 

Point taken.

You have no idea how often we have to use a "tape measure" to get dimensions in the world of Product Design. And then our guesses become the "5 significant figures" gospel. That's probably why my first response is to try to get the data from the original source.

Thanks for the great links. SusProg3D looks like a great program, and eng-tips is always a great source of information and level-headedness.

Thanks again,
John

 

When I help kids with math, they always get very mad when I take away thier pocket calculators. I only give them back when they don't need them! We all tend to get used to the high end tools at our disposal when all we usually need is a piece of paper and a little thought!

Computers and the like have really destroyed the understanding of significant figures.... Oh well.

Matt

 

You would be surprised (or maybe not ) about how many senior level Engineering students still don't understand the significance of significant figures. We had one group in my senior design class that spec'd a part to a hundred thousandth. That's +-.00001 . One of the reasons I enjoy FSAE so much; I actually design a part that I can make. Most young Engineers have never been in a machine shop.

Having factory drawings would have been very nice. Trying to get the most accurate model is always good. The suspension is very touchy when it comes to component lengths. Being 1/4" off may actually be a lot. When I was doing the Europa model, changing the lower link (control arm) length by 1/4" changes camber over a degree. In my case, the whole reason I made the model was because I was making adjustable lower links. I wanted to determine the correct length of the tube so I could safely adjust the heims in from the stock length and not run out of threads.

 

Has anyone had these installed long enough to collaborate the "longer lasting tires" claim on Mini Mania's site?

 

Well, I've had them on for about 2 weeks and approx. 500 miles, and I can't notice any bumpsteer per se.
I have about an inch drop with Konis and actually find no difference in cornering, turn-in, under or over steer, etc.
Not sure if these are that great a benefit except for those perhaps who ar real autoX fanatics.
No tire issues either. Good or bad, but then only 500 miles!

 

If you've got a good alignment, the tires will last. Camber settings will have more to do with tire life than these gizmos...

Matt

 

Well, still trying to sort that out. Car's been realigned twice and is still going through front tires like they're free. Every time tread wear has been even across the tire so something else has to be going on.

front: -1.50, 1/16"
rear: -1.00, 0

Open to suggestions

 

means pressures and alignment are good. Last thing left is driving style!

Matt

 

Assuming all else is equal, meaning same tires as before, same alignment as before, same driving venue/style as before, what is wearing faster? The entire tire evenly across the tread, inside, outside?


Your front alignment setting is not aggressive, but I wouod not be surprised to see more wear on the inside of the tire if you are driving lots of straight highway miles with 1/16" toe out, but not by a lot.

 

That's what I keep telling my wife! It's her daily driver

She claims to not be hammering it, which is why I'm curious about Mini Mania's claim to increase tire wear...

 

As posted above, tire wear for the most part has been even across the tread. I've even been fine tuning tire pressures between brands to get even wear in the centers. The only thing I find slightly strange is the front right wears a little quicker than the front left, but they're pretty close. And I have the factory LSD with the JCW tune, which I mention because it does allow a little bit of wear spin before engaging the traction control.

 

But I bet she's pretty agressive in turns!

Matt

 

"...between brands..." The only way to give the PSA a chance from a tire wear perspective is to keep all else the same. Also, tire wear ratings give us guide, but tread design can also play a key role in wear as a tire heats up...I know some big blocky tread designs that wear and grip really well but when they heat up they get very squirmy and wear incredibly fast.

 

I can't give you any long term test results, but I installed these after work today. I like the way the car turns, seems quicker to turn to me. No scientific method used to test it, but in my mind there is a difference. And only took about half an hour, so not like that hard to undue if I do find something wrong later on. I have an appointment for the alignment so I don't know if anything really changed.

 

The garage I park in at work has all left hand turns from the ground floor all the way up and back down. It can be a lot of fun if you're an early riser and get there when the garage is empty.

I'm not accusing your wife of anything, I'm just sayin'...

 

No worries, I accuse her of having a HEAVY right foot all the time! LOL