Suspension R56 lowering springs: options and specs
#126
08-20-2010, 10:54 AM
I see many folks are helping with rates, but give a single number and then say "progressive". Unfortunately, progressive springs can only be described by a chart. Probably why a lot of springs are not posted to rate.
Just looking at a spring does not tell the whole truth. Many of the "progressive" are really built in tenders. The tight section is fully collapsed at ride height.
I have seen several assertions that lowering on stock shocks will cause the shock to fail. No explanation. I could see pounding the bump stops shaking the entire car apart, but that is no additional load on the shock.
Likewise, I have seen the assertion that a stiffer spring is harder on the shock. I would think the opposite. Stiffer spring, less travel, easier on the shock while it shakes your car apart.
What I can't understand is going through the trouble of changing springs and not discarding the horrible MSC shock while you are at it.
Just looking at a spring does not tell the whole truth. Many of the "progressive" are really built in tenders. The tight section is fully collapsed at ride height.
I have seen several assertions that lowering on stock shocks will cause the shock to fail. No explanation. I could see pounding the bump stops shaking the entire car apart, but that is no additional load on the shock.
Likewise, I have seen the assertion that a stiffer spring is harder on the shock. I would think the opposite. Stiffer spring, less travel, easier on the shock while it shakes your car apart.
What I can't understand is going through the trouble of changing springs and not discarding the horrible MSC shock while you are at it.
#127
08-23-2010, 10:51 AM
Wondering if I'll have rubbing issues.
I'm hoping to reduce the ridiculous wheel gap on my R56 via a set of H&R springs. However, most of the time I drive my MINI it is fully loaded with passengers as well as whatever junk we have to pile in. I'd say to be on the safe side the car will have a total of 500 pounds in it most of the time. Has anybody run into any rubbing issues with similar payloads? Hoping to avoid making my daughters and wife walk everywhere.
#128
08-23-2010, 11:13 AM
I'm hoping to reduce the ridiculous wheel gap on my R56 via a set of H&R springs. However, most of the time I drive my MINI it is fully loaded with passengers as well as whatever junk we have to pile in. I'd say to be on the safe side the car will have a total of 500 pounds in it most of the time. Has anybody run into any rubbing issues with similar payloads? Hoping to avoid making my daughters and wife walk everywhere.
#129
08-23-2010, 11:25 AM
#130
08-23-2010, 11:52 AM
I can only assume your daughters are very small.
Look, you must cosider how the car functions, and then worry about cosmetics. Lowered means not enough travel unless you buy coilovers designed to maintain full travel. Riding on the bump stops may look cool, but it is very dangerous as you will not keep the tires on the road when you hit a bump. You can loose control in a corner or if hitting a bump under breaking. You did mot mention changing shocks, which are dangerous as supplied. I would not carry children in a STOCK MCS.
Look, you must cosider how the car functions, and then worry about cosmetics. Lowered means not enough travel unless you buy coilovers designed to maintain full travel. Riding on the bump stops may look cool, but it is very dangerous as you will not keep the tires on the road when you hit a bump. You can loose control in a corner or if hitting a bump under breaking. You did mot mention changing shocks, which are dangerous as supplied. I would not carry children in a STOCK MCS.
#132
08-23-2010, 10:29 PM
Just wanted to add to this thread.
1) H&R has a great reputation. When reading info about their sport springs no where does it say on their site something to the effect of "hey we recommend you don't use these on stock struts/shock". I think they would because their reputation would be directly effected by bad consumer experiances. If anything it reads like "hey this is a quick and easy upgrade, go for it"
2) I used to own a 2005 Scion TC and purchased it used with 10,000 miles. It was really low. The local dealership said it was the lowest (with springs) they had seen. I asked them to check the suspension. It ended up just being a set of H&R super sport springs. They had about a 2+ inch drop.
I drove that thing for 75,000 miles on New England roads all year round with a complete disregard for pot holes and we have tons of them. With low profile tires may I add. I literally beat the thing.
I never had an issue with the stock shocks/struts. No issue at all.
My 1995 Toyota Celica lowered via springs drove it for 110,000 miles
My 2000 Honda Civic lowered via springs drove it for 180,000 miles
My 2005 Scion TC lowered via H&R springs drove it for 75,000 miles
So I call crap when I hear individuals claiming that lowering springs will damage your stock shock/strut.
1) H&R has a great reputation. When reading info about their sport springs no where does it say on their site something to the effect of "hey we recommend you don't use these on stock struts/shock". I think they would because their reputation would be directly effected by bad consumer experiances. If anything it reads like "hey this is a quick and easy upgrade, go for it"
2) I used to own a 2005 Scion TC and purchased it used with 10,000 miles. It was really low. The local dealership said it was the lowest (with springs) they had seen. I asked them to check the suspension. It ended up just being a set of H&R super sport springs. They had about a 2+ inch drop.
I drove that thing for 75,000 miles on New England roads all year round with a complete disregard for pot holes and we have tons of them. With low profile tires may I add. I literally beat the thing.
I never had an issue with the stock shocks/struts. No issue at all.
My 1995 Toyota Celica lowered via springs drove it for 110,000 miles
My 2000 Honda Civic lowered via springs drove it for 180,000 miles
My 2005 Scion TC lowered via H&R springs drove it for 75,000 miles
So I call crap when I hear individuals claiming that lowering springs will damage your stock shock/strut.
#134
08-24-2010, 03:43 PM
Agreed.
I just think, it all comes down to budget. I have seen plenty of opportunities to grab a new set of H&R springs for about $180. Spend some time with a friend on a Saturday afternoon and suddenly your car is 1.5 inches lower. Even if you end up needing an alignment you're still under $280.
Can't beat that.
#137
09-08-2010, 02:07 PM
I have a question for whoever can answer it for me...I have a meannn looking mini and it would put it on a whole different level if it was lowered...Im also 19 and in college so 2000 for a koni adjustable coilover kit is pretty rediculous for me..H&R spring seem to be the answer for me but I have a few questions regarding my stance and overall wear of the car.....
1. With the springs installed, do I need to buy new control arms as well? or can I just do springs.
2. If I do only springs how serious is the shock wear REALLY because I have heard every single possible answer to this question and if it does wear them down...how serious is it REALLY.
3. How mad will the oversteer understeer be with the car lowered because i know it definitely tilts out the back wheels, and for me considering my mini is doing 110+ mph every day and its hitting turns VERY fast all day. I'm 19, dont really feel like dying because my springs f*cked up my stance. My dad had a lowered 911 Turbo and he spun it out and totalled it because the toe and camber in the back were not OK after the car had springs installed.
Someone help its a life decision hahaha
1. With the springs installed, do I need to buy new control arms as well? or can I just do springs.
2. If I do only springs how serious is the shock wear REALLY because I have heard every single possible answer to this question and if it does wear them down...how serious is it REALLY.
3. How mad will the oversteer understeer be with the car lowered because i know it definitely tilts out the back wheels, and for me considering my mini is doing 110+ mph every day and its hitting turns VERY fast all day. I'm 19, dont really feel like dying because my springs f*cked up my stance. My dad had a lowered 911 Turbo and he spun it out and totalled it because the toe and camber in the back were not OK after the car had springs installed.
Someone help its a life decision hahaha
#138
09-08-2010, 02:51 PM
Join Date: May 2009
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I have a question for whoever can answer it for me...I have a meannn looking mini and it would put it on a whole different level if it was lowered...Im also 19 and in college so 2000 for a koni adjustable coilover kit is pretty rediculous for me..H&R spring seem to be the answer for me but I have a few questions regarding my stance and overall wear of the car.....
1. With the springs installed, do I need to buy new control arms as well? or can I just do springs.
2. If I do only springs how serious is the shock wear REALLY because I have heard every single possible answer to this question and if it does wear them down...how serious is it REALLY.
3. How mad will the oversteer understeer be with the car lowered because i know it definitely tilts out the back wheels, and for me considering my mini is doing 110+ mph every day and its hitting turns VERY fast all day. I'm 19, dont really feel like dying because my springs f*cked up my stance. My dad had a lowered 911 Turbo and he spun it out and totalled it because the toe and camber in the back were not OK after the car had springs installed.
Someone help its a life decision hahaha
1. With the springs installed, do I need to buy new control arms as well? or can I just do springs.
2. If I do only springs how serious is the shock wear REALLY because I have heard every single possible answer to this question and if it does wear them down...how serious is it REALLY.
3. How mad will the oversteer understeer be with the car lowered because i know it definitely tilts out the back wheels, and for me considering my mini is doing 110+ mph every day and its hitting turns VERY fast all day. I'm 19, dont really feel like dying because my springs f*cked up my stance. My dad had a lowered 911 Turbo and he spun it out and totalled it because the toe and camber in the back were not OK after the car had springs installed.
Someone help its a life decision hahaha
-110mph daily and driving like a lunatic probly isnt a good idea anyway but if you are gonna, I'd invest in some better tires at some point.
-I'm also 19 and do the same thing and I run KW coils I got for $750 on the marketplace
#140
09-08-2010, 02:54 PM
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#141
09-08-2010, 02:58 PM
-It will def wear out ur struts faster, sent you an email regarding that
-110mph daily and driving like a lunatic probly isnt a good idea anyway but if you are gonna, I'd invest in some better tires at some point.
-I'm also 19 and do the same thing and I run KW coils I got for $750 on the marketplace
-110mph daily and driving like a lunatic probly isnt a good idea anyway but if you are gonna, I'd invest in some better tires at some point.
-I'm also 19 and do the same thing and I run KW coils I got for $750 on the marketplace
Yeah i have dunlop direzza z1 star specs on team dynamics wheels. and ur saying i could def just get shocks and the camber and all that wont get screwed up to the point where it hurts my handling rather than help it?
#142
09-08-2010, 03:15 PM
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H+Rs will net you a good amount of camber, but not enough to be dangerous. If you're really paranoid about it let out like 3psi from each back tire and you'll get more contact. I run all my tires are 35 pounds and at more camber than you will run, with less quality tires (until friday) and heavy stock rims. Granted, I go through a set of tires every 10-15k miles too though so tire life may be compromised...I think that has more to do with my love of that pull handle between the seats and my tendency to throw the car around and show off in front of those big heavy muscle cars that think we drive R/C cars
#143
11-05-2010, 08:19 PM
I'm still debating on whether or not to lower my MC. But i don't want to spend a thousand for coil overs. My budget is only for a set of lowering springs.
How many of you install camber kit after installing lowering springs?
For those who have installed lowering springs without camber, do they have a negative impact on the tires?
Is a camber kit even necessary?
How many of you install camber kit after installing lowering springs?
For those who have installed lowering springs without camber, do they have a negative impact on the tires?
Is a camber kit even necessary?
#144
11-06-2010, 10:09 AM
I used the H&R lowering springs and nothing else. I am getting no uneven tire wear. I really like the look of the front but for me the back still sits too high. I'd like it about an inch lower but I'll have to go to coil overs to get that. With the H&R springs the rear tires do not bow out at all. I view it as the same stance it would probably have if you drove around with a couple of people in the back seat, not that many of us ever do that.
One side note... if you are going to install the springs yourself, as I did, then make sure the nut holding the top plate to the shock is tight (I had to use an impact wrench because doing it manually the shock rod spins). Otherwise you end up with this annoying rattle when you hit bumps. It's not that difficult. I did it in a few hours, no spring compressor, no lift.
Bottom line, if I had to do it all over again and had the cash I'd go with coil overs so I could get the rear lower, but for the price I'm happy.
One side note... if you are going to install the springs yourself, as I did, then make sure the nut holding the top plate to the shock is tight (I had to use an impact wrench because doing it manually the shock rod spins). Otherwise you end up with this annoying rattle when you hit bumps. It's not that difficult. I did it in a few hours, no spring compressor, no lift.
Bottom line, if I had to do it all over again and had the cash I'd go with coil overs so I could get the rear lower, but for the price I'm happy.
#145
11-06-2010, 10:33 AM
I used the H&R lowering springs and nothing else. I am getting no uneven tire wear. I really like the look of the front but for me the back still sits too high. I'd like it about an inch lower but I'll have to go to coil overs to get that. With the H&R springs the rear tires do not bow out at all. I view it as the same stance it would probably have if you drove around with a couple of people in the back seat, not that many of us ever do that.
One side note... if you are going to install the springs yourself, as I did, then make sure the nut holding the top plate to the shock is tight (I had to use an impact wrench because doing it manually the shock rod spins). Otherwise you end up with this annoying rattle when you hit bumps. It's not that difficult. I did it in a few hours, no spring compressor, no lift.
Bottom line, if I had to do it all over again and had the cash I'd go with coil overs so I could get the rear lower, but for the price I'm happy.
One side note... if you are going to install the springs yourself, as I did, then make sure the nut holding the top plate to the shock is tight (I had to use an impact wrench because doing it manually the shock rod spins). Otherwise you end up with this annoying rattle when you hit bumps. It's not that difficult. I did it in a few hours, no spring compressor, no lift.
Bottom line, if I had to do it all over again and had the cash I'd go with coil overs so I could get the rear lower, but for the price I'm happy.
#146
11-06-2010, 11:43 AM
I don't want others to be mislead by your comments so I'll put my two cents in here and others can comment also. Changing shocks DOES NOT change the height of a car. Only the springs do that. If I want the rear lower than it is now I have to take out both the current struts and springs and replace them with coil overs (plus other mods from what I understand). By definition coil overs are coil springs over the top of shocks and they come as one unit. The H&R rears springs would have to be discarded.
#147
11-06-2010, 11:52 AM
I don't want others to be mislead by your comments so I'll put my two cents in here and others can comment also. Changing shocks DOES NOT change the height of a car. Only the springs do that. If I want the rear lower than it is now I have to take out both the current struts and springs and replace them with coil overs (plus other mods from what I understand). By definition coil overs are coil springs over the top of shocks and they come as one unit. The H&R rears springs would have to be discarded.
#148
11-06-2010, 11:58 AM
6th Gear
sorry phillip but bsandgat is correct - unless you have the old school air shocks where you hook up a compressor to them and change the internal pressure. Those are for LIFTING and not lowering.
Im 20 and in college so springs was all I could really afford but shocks are definitely one of the next upgrades i do.
Stock shocks don't handle being lowered very well over the long term.
Coilovers are expensive but they are the best route (in general). I had a set of cross coilovers on my 07 S and absolutely loved them.
Last edited by MotorMouth; 11-06-2010 at 12:05 PM.
#149
11-06-2010, 12:03 PM
sorry phillip but bsandgat is correct - unless you have the old school air shocks where you hook up a compressor to them and change the internal pressure. Those are for LIFTING and not lowering.
Now you are correct. The shocks will be one of the next things to change - because they are going to wear out a heckuva lot faster than normal.
Now you are correct. The shocks will be one of the next things to change - because they are going to wear out a heckuva lot faster than normal.
read the description.
#150
11-06-2010, 12:09 PM
6th Gear
http://new.minimania.com/web/Item/G2.../InvDetail.cfm
read the description.
read the description.
Upgrade your MINI Cooper and Cooper S with KONI adjustable Sport Shocks for improved ride control and improved handling. Can be used with original equipment springs or with a performance spring upgrade. KONI has long been a leader in performance shock technology.
For 2007+ R56 MINI Cooper and Cooper S Hatchback, 2007+ R55 MINI Cooper and Cooper S CLUBMAN, and 2009+ R57 MINI Cooper and Cooper S Convertibles.
Why the industries first adjustable shock is still the best:
* Big handling improvements
* Reasonable ride quality
* Best KONI shock for all lowering springs
* Re-buildable and re-valveable for custom vehicle setups
* Yellow exterior finish
* Lifetime Limited Warranty
At the softest setting (with stock springs), these shocks offer slightly softer compression with a slightly stiffer rebound when compared to the stock shocks. Eliminates the 'bounciness' with the stock shocks. Depending on your driving style, you can stiffen the shocks for more spirited driving or track applications.
Last but not least, KONl's shocks are built to last a lifetime. Once you have bought a set of KONl's shocks for your car, they usually will outlive it. KONI street shocks carry a lifetime warranty to the original purchaser for as long as you own the vehicle.Sold as a pair. Select Front pair or Rear pair from the pull-down menu.
For 2007+ R56 MINI Cooper and Cooper S Hatchback, 2007+ R55 MINI Cooper and Cooper S CLUBMAN, and 2009+ R57 MINI Cooper and Cooper S Convertibles.
Why the industries first adjustable shock is still the best:
* Big handling improvements
* Reasonable ride quality
* Best KONI shock for all lowering springs
* Re-buildable and re-valveable for custom vehicle setups
* Yellow exterior finish
* Lifetime Limited Warranty
At the softest setting (with stock springs), these shocks offer slightly softer compression with a slightly stiffer rebound when compared to the stock shocks. Eliminates the 'bounciness' with the stock shocks. Depending on your driving style, you can stiffen the shocks for more spirited driving or track applications.
Last but not least, KONl's shocks are built to last a lifetime. Once you have bought a set of KONl's shocks for your car, they usually will outlive it. KONI street shocks carry a lifetime warranty to the original purchaser for as long as you own the vehicle.Sold as a pair. Select Front pair or Rear pair from the pull-down menu.
3. How mad will the oversteer understeer be with the car lowered because i know it definitely tilts out the back wheels, and for me considering my mini is doing 110+ mph every day and its hitting turns VERY fast all day. I'm 19, dont really feel like dying because my springs f*cked up my stance.