here's one for ya

local dealer says problem with performance is that the gas in the tank has too much ethanol....

I ask, how did they deterimine this in the 20 min they had the car

as I'm aware of no rapid field test that would show this.

Anyone want to convince me there is a field test for ethanol percentage in gas?

I know of one for water...but dealer says his test is for % ethanol and the tank has 18% versus posted content of 10%

I toss the BS flag....

 

the way we test for ethanol is by taking an amount of gas and clean bottled water. you shake it for a minute or so and then let it settle. we have specific syringes that have markings on them for this test.

the ethanol will comnbine with the water and the gas thats left is the actual amount of fuel in the fluid. theres a chart that bmw gave us which then simplifies the mathematical formula for what percentage ethanol there is in the fuel.

so actually taking a fuel sample from a mini takes less then 5 min. and adding the water and waiting can actually be a 20min. job.

i'm sorry for the crappy description, i guess it's easier to do the test than to actually explain it.

 

I think that you gave an excellent answer. I nevere knew that you could test this way. Very cool to know.

 

Sorry guys.

We have a tester now ( just like testing pool water ) which tells us the ethanol content in the gas sample we took. Takes 10-15mins to get gas from the car.

Lift you back seat bottom up and you'll see the gas tank access panels to the pump and level sender. pop either one up and theres ur gas.




Alcohol Detection Procedure


MODEL
All Models


SITUATION
Fuel Blends containing a high percentage (above 10%) of alcohol, mainly ethanol, are becoming more commercially available. Usage of E85, or any other high alcohol content blend (e.g. E30) in MINI vehicles, will cause various drivability complaints (cold start problems, stalling, reduced performance, poor fuel economy, etc.), may cause excessive emissions, and may cause irreversible damage to engine, emission control and fuel delivery systems due to incompatibility of materials with alcohols. Refer to SI M13 01 06 Alcohol Fuel Blends in MINI Vehicles for complete details.

In order to correctly diagnose various drivability complaints caused by fuel blends with a high level of ethanol content, the BMW Group is providing you with an alcohol detection test tool.

Distribution of the following tool will be through the Automatic Tool Shipment Program. Additional tools may be purchased through your PDC. All prices on this bulletin are introductory prices and are only valid during the Automatic Tool Shipment.

Alcohol Detection Test Tool
Order PN 83 30 0 420 667
Price= $15.00


PROCEDURE
Safety Precautions:

• Gasoline is highly flammable; observe normal precautions for working with flammable liquids. Perform all tests away from any source of ignition. A class B fire extinguisher must be available.
• Wear protective eye protection with side shields and Nitrile rubber gloves for handling syringe.
• Please adhere to any applicable OSHA regulations when handling Gasoline.
• Dispose of the mixture according to local, state and federal regulations.

1. Fill a clean container with gasoline drawn from the fuel system of the affected vehicle then fill another container with water. Only a small amount of fuel is needed to perform the test (5 ounces of each fluid).
2. Slowly draw 3cc of water into the syringe. Note: To remove air, draw at least 5cc to 6cc of water, invert the syringe and squirt the water out until the top rim of the rubber plunger is at the 3cc mark.
3. Slowly draw gasoline into the syringe until the fluid reaches the 12cc mark.
4. Place your finger over the tip of the syringe, vigorously shake the syringe for one minute. Relieve built-up pressure by occasionally removing your finger.
5. Place the syringe on a flat surface with the nozzle pointing up, allow the syringe to stand for one minute.

If alcohol is present in the fuel, it will separate from the gasoline and dissolve in the water. This water/alcohol mixture will be in the lower part of the syringe. Record the reading at the boundary of the two liquids, refer to the table below to determine the percentage of alcohol in the fuel.

Empty the syringe and rinse thoroughly with water, allow drying and apply a silicone lubricant to the rubber plunger before storing.

Boundary Line
% Alcohol

9.0cc
0%
5.0cc
45%
8.6cc
5%
4.5cc
55%
8.1cc
10%
4.1cc
60%
7.7cc
15%
3.6cc
65%
7.2cc
20%
3.2cc
70%
6.8cc
25%
2.7cc
75%
6.3cc
30%
2.3cc
80%
5.9cc
35%
1.8cc
85%
5.4cc
40%
1.4cc
90%


WARRANTY INFORMATION
Components damage/malfunctions, or any drivability problems caused by use of fuels containing more then 10% ethanol (or other oxygenates with more then 2.8% oxygen by weight) will not be covered under MINI warranties with respect to defects in materials or workmanship. Please document the results found on the vehicle repair order whenever performing this test.

 

What if you didn't know the initial water content of the fuel,,,,a much more common problem?

Not knowing the initial water content/contamination, is the test accurate for ethanol? or ethanol plus water with water being unknown????

 

bad gas would be a high combination of both water & ethanol. so even if it's not the "extra" ethanol that's causing the problem, the combination of the two is. So it's still bad gas.