Hi all,

I've got a 2010 Clubman S with no Compression on all four cylinders, it's got 86K miles, and had the timing chain replaced by a dealer prior to my purchase at 56K. I'm not sure what went wrong, as I pulled the valve cover when I checked the compression (yes I know that it wasn't necessary) and both cams spun so the HPFP and Vacuum pump aren't seized, and they seemed to be in sync with each other though I don't have a cam tool to check and see if they are in complete alignment. I will be getting a cam tool soon. It was running fine before it wouldn't start. Ran one day and then the next it wouldn't start then next. Kept up on the oil changes, and oil level, didn't see a check engine light before hand or anything. It didn't make any noises either.

As for the rebuild questions:
What is the most reliable timing set? And do I need one with the Vanos gear and regular gear, or no?
Does anyone have a recommendation on a good machinist in New England or there about that can do a head rebuild/resurface and replace the valve guides if needed?
If needed what are your recommendations for bottom end parts for this engine if a bearing spun or there's piston damage that also effected the bottom end? Sneed4Speed seems to have some good parts but I'm open to others.
Having some engine experience with engines, being that there might be piston damage (and that I'm in there already) would it be wise to do a quick resurface of the cylinders and put in new pistons if needed or new rings at the least?
Given that the engine will be torn down what components should I replace other than the HPFP, Vacuum pump, turbo cassette, water pump, and possibly valve cover (it had a good about of oil in the PCV area)?
Any thoughts on transmission service while that's out with the engine (it's an automatic with the tiptronic option)?
I'm thinking, and I've conferred with someone that's rebuild a good number of engines, that it might not be a bad idea to put a pin in the cam and crank gears once the timing has been set to prevent them from slipping, obviously there are some dangers with that if the HPFP or Vacuum pump seize, Thoughts on that option?

Thank you for your time, advice, and input. It's much appreciated, and I'll keep you guys updated as the rebuild progresses.
-Sharpsonwheels

 

The real question is how much do you want to spend?

when the valve cover is open, can you feel the rocker arms loose. if the valves were bent, then it is a cheap task (if you DIY).

how did that happen? perhaps the tensioner bolt got loose. it is somewhat known for that bolt to back out, check that area too.

pistons should be fine. and again, it is how much money you want to spend. if a shop is going to do the work, it will add up.

 

I'm willing to spend enough so that this doesn't happen again. The rocker arms didn't feel loose, though I didn't really check them, I more was checking the spring height on the valves, and they all seemed to be in about the same range when I measured them. As for the tensioner loosening I'll have to give that a check, might also be the crank bold got loose. I'll be doing the work, only thing I'd need a shop for is to resurface the valve seats, and the cylinders if they got damaged. I'm just looking to bullet proof this motor as much as possible during this rebuild.Thanks for the info, I'll report back what I find.

 

It is hard to bullet proof anything, but point is taken...I never hear of piston resurface! sure you can change rings and bearings. the head doesnt need to be resurfaced either...just a good clean decarb will be good. others might have other opinions, but personally I look for the most economical option there is.

 

Right it is hard to do that, but there are some things that most engines have that this one doesn't, keyed timing equipment for example. If the valves need to be replaces the valve seats would need to be resurfaces so the new valves can be lapped in, not the whole head, right? Right I'm trying to balance cost with reliability, though I'm willing to spend more to get that.

 

that should be fine...

Start a list from priority to least including actual cost. you can always ask the shop to clean and install the parts for you...when i asked around, it ranges from 100 to 300 to do that. again, ask around and add that to the list. see hoe much that will be and go from there

 

If there's something wrong with the valves, just buy new ones.

I just did the valves and a gasket kit for $350 or so. Gasket kit came with new valve seals. Had to buy a few spare keepers as I lost a couple. I had a few other things wrong as well as I got into it, but nothing that crazy. Just had it started for the first time the other day...this is probably one of the easiest engines I've ever timed when you have the tools (and knowing how they work, it would be pretty easy to do it without them or to make your own, but they're cheap enough its worth getting the kit).

As MiniToBe said, your cylinders should be fine and the head should most likely just need a good cleaning. If a head ever does need resurfacing, almost any metal fab shop should be able to do it (find a local one). I doubt that yours would need any more than a good cleaning though.

Definitely check the rocker arms and look for bent valves.

 

Right, new parts are a given if something is damaged like the valves, or if it's a known problem like the HPFP or Vacuum pump and the timing set.

I get that a good set of valves will come with the guides, and seals, but if the valves were bent, isn't there a good chance that the valve seats on the head might need resurfacing or is it not likely that the seat got damaged, and is still good to be relapped for the new valves?

Any recommendation on valves? I haven't found too many options yet.

Thanks for the info.

 

Have you determined it's the valves yet? With the valve cover off it should be obvious if the timing chain or guides are damaged. You'll also have access to the rockers to see if any valves are damaged (they will be loose). I would skip looking at the fuel pump until you've determined what is causing the compression issue as the fuel pump would not have anything to do with that problem...

 

No, I haven't yet. looking again is on my docket for tomorrow, though the timing set was intact as far as I could tell, it's only got about 30K miles on it, and all the guides were good. the rockers weren't loose when I was measuring the valve spring heights when I did have the cover off, but as I said I wasn't checking. The reason I keep coming back to the valves, was I did a compression test on the engine and it didn't build any pressure at all on any of the cylinders, which makes me think that the valves are bent, unless anyone can give a different possibility on the failure that would cause complete compression loss in all cylinders. Where did you buy your valves?

 

Bought the valves here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fits-Mini-Co...72.m2749.l2649

As for losing compression on all 4 cylinders, yes, it would make sense that it would be bent valves. But to have bent valves something would to have broken (most likely your timing).

Once you get a chance to check the rockers things should come to light.

 

Right, the working theory right now is that the crank bolt loosened just enough to let things slip a little as the cams and the attached gears do spin when the engine is cranked. I'll check the rockers here in the morning to see if anything there shows a more distinct sign of a problem, and I'll report back what I find.

 

The loose crank bolt theory can be applicable...when i did mine, I thought i tightened it but i found out the hard way that wasnt the case...the rocker arms flew all over the place and bent intake valves. I learned to triple check my torques before heading the road.

 

Did you have a chance to take a look at the rockers yet? Curious what this will turn out to be.

 

Ok, finally managed to get back under the valve cover. The rockers had a little side to side motion no up and down play. I've got the timing tool coming in today so I'll be able to see if either of the cams have slipped. Any thoughts on my rebuild questions?

 

And after a little more investigating with a rigged up leak down tester, with #1 and #4 at top dead center cams off of #1 it was determined that both the intake and exhaust valves had airflow, This was verified via audible checks at the exhaust pipe, and mechanic's stethoscope at both the intake and exhaust manifolds, as well as the both sets of intake and exhaust valves. Timing did appear to be out a few degrees as well though I am unable to completely verify at this time.

 

any updates?

I just bought a clubman S with 53k that was misfiring. even though the cams were slightly off with respect to each other, they were 180 deg opposite to what they should be. I reset the timing and now it purrs fine.

 

I'm glad that your Mini was able to be saved. We're still not sure exactly what caused the failure, however we are proceeding under the assumption that the timing failed, and that the whole set needs replaced as do the valves. We are currently in the process of pulling the engine and getting ready to disassemble it to begin repairs.

 

It’s not uncommon for dealer techs to reuse the vanos cam sprocket bolt!! This is a single use bolt and must be replaced during chain replacement or adjustment. It backs off and allows the cam timing to fault.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case with any/all of the torque to yield fasteners on the timing set. I'll be replacing all of that when I start putting it back together. The VW dealer my dad talked to when doing his timing set said that they never replace the torque to yield bolts when they do a timing set. So I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case here too. And given that the intake is misaligned I'm not surprised.