Hello! This might be a long post, but I think it is concise and relevant to a lot of R56S owners.

My R56 Cooper S threw a CEL a few months ago, 3 months out of warranty. I am no stranger to the CEL.
The time prior, I was 2years into ownership, still under warranty, and was treated to a "carbon cleaning" remedy. I was told that the carbon buildup problem was due to "using bad gas" and was given the advice to "throw some Techron in the tank every so often" to mitigate future issues. I was not thrilled to be fingered as the negligent owner. I do everything reasonable to avoid bad gas short of having a chemistry set with me for testing each station I visit. I also thought that needing to spend $ on Techron on top of premium gas just to avoid damage to a snazzy new car was a bit odd.
No matter.... I obliged.
6 months ago, shortly before my warranty expired, I had the dealership check the idle (rpm would dip slightly on occasion at idle causing a mild shudder). I was told that the turbo inlet had come loose and they put it back on. I presume this was their method of fixing the stutter (though it continued afterward with the same frequency)
Back to the present-
This time that the CEL showed up, a generic scan-tool that I borrowed from a friend showed "random misfire" on cylinders 3 and 4 (at 0 mph). Since I had been experiencing the stutter/stumble at idle on and off for the last year despite the dealer fix (turbo inlet), I assumed that it finally registered in the computer.

I am suspicious that the carbon buildup problem is hitting me again. I have been following the forums here at NAM for a while now, silently learning.
This is my first true post and I hope to get some feedback and contribute my past and upcoming saga.

Still with me?

Here's my current situation-
I am out of warranty with a check engine light for misfires on 3 and 4.
I called a local dealer and asked for the price of a carbon cleaning (walnut blasting the intake ports).
Dealer One quoted under $200.
Sweeet!
I was considering cracking the intake open and doing my worst!
Called Dealer Two and asked for a quote on carbon cleaning...
Dealer Two said $850+ for the service.

"Exsqueezeme?"

I was told that in addition to the carbon blasting, "mini has found a permanent fix for the carbon buildup problem."

"I'm listening."

Apparently some time in the spring '12, mini released a fix in the software/ firmware/whatever. This upgrade is supposed to prevent the need for repeated carbon cleaning.
Great, right?
Well the software update runs $150! But I was assured that "nobody who had that upgrade has been back with the buildup problem anymore."
Keep in mind that the software update has only been available for about 6 months. I asked the SM if it was common for buildup to accumulate in such a short time, (otherwise, how would he know the fix was a fix?) I got a non-response (if you know what I mean).
So I am offered this magical software update for $150 if I pay $600 or so for the blasting (again)... Even though I had the problem "fixed" that way before mini found this new method, conveniently after my warranty ended.

So here are the questions for those of you still here-
1. Should mini offer software updates that solve engine troubles as a courtesy? Recalls for mechanical parts have more tangible expense. Software updates require labor but not much else. By the way, I understand this is not a recall (but c'mon).
2. Should I get noisy about this issue or just get my valves blasted by Dealer One and wait until my next CEL to have a fit?

Thanks for reading this- any advice is welcomed.

 

That's pretty interesting that there's supposedly a software fix for the carbon problem. If it's true, hopefully I already had the update applied before I got my tune. I think I'll call my dealer and get a 2nd opinion on this update.

I definitely think software updates should be treated like a recall and given for free or at least heavily discounted if it's not adding new features to the car but is fixing known problems.

Did you already pay once to have your carbon blasted or will this be the first time? More importantly, at how many miles did each of these issues occur? If it's only 15k between blastings then that seems like something to get noisy about but if you're doing 80k between blastings then it seems like you'd have less of a case.

 

The Dealer said the software fix for carbon buildup had something to do with the temperature of the engine. The SM didn't seem clear on the precise way it functioned but I got the impression that it periodically or, under certain conditions, raised operating temps to "burn off the carbon"... If that IS what it does, it sounds like it has the potential to cause as many problems as it solves...
To answer the mileage question- I have under 35k on the engine now. I had a carbon cleaning at about 19k the first time under warranty. They kept the car for a week and if I recall correctly, had it uploading and downloading quite a bit according to the SM. The carbon buildup problem was new at the time and I believe my car might have been a guinea-pig for MINI corporate in Germany to diagnose the issue.
Who really knows? It's tough to find solutions to problems when some of the parties involved have $ motives and don't necessarily contribute all the facts... Or worse- lie.

Thanks for the quick response, calforhelp!
Still looking for everyone to contribute their experiences.

 

I recently read some of the threads dealing with the carbon issue. I do not see how tweaking the computer will negate the fact that oil fumes introduced into the intake will bake onto the hot cylinder head. Seems like a snake oil solution.

I recently had the Scottsdale stealer do the walnut shell treatment, didn't seem to work. Seafoam is next, after installing an oil catch can.

 

Interesting. My Coupe is a 3/12 build and I've had it since Late July.

Here's the interesting part. When I had the JCW fixed spoiler installed, this required a reflash of the ECU. Since having the spoiler installed and ECU reflashed I have noticed that the cooling fan doesn't kick on after shut down nearly as much as before, which basically tells me something changed.

In addition to this, I recently installed a SG2 due to concerns of heat, water temp etc (I just wanted to know). This is where I think they may have indeed tweaked the heat settings. On start up it generally takes a few minutes of standard driving to get up to temps, and quite a while to top out at 220*. Occasionally (no rhyme or reason). the temp will literally shoot up to 220 within a few minutes of running (happened the day before yesterday). As to the Italian Tuneup burning carbon off; I know that happens for a fact. After the last "spirited" SoCal twistie run, I could definitely tell after Betty was run hard and heavy that she was much more responsive on the throttle. Maybe there's some truth to this s/w change...???

 

If you Google something like "direct fuel injection carbon buildup", it seems this issue is inherent to DI engines and a mechanic at the MINI dealership said this as well.

I'm sure there were issues when fuel injection was new to the common car, so I'm hoping that the manufacturers will resolve the DI carbon buildup issue soon. Maybe the N18 engine is better in this respect. Time will tell.

 

Only if they want to establish themselves as a business that cares about its customers.

However, I am reluctant to believe that the software update will solve this problem. I will be among the first to congratulate MINI when proven it does.

MINeclair, It was a pleasure to read your post - beautifully written.

 

My understanding of the carbon buildup on any DI engine is an issue with the valves not being cleaned by the fuel mixture like a port injection system. I fail to see how a software update and fix a purely mechanical issue...

 

Good info everyone!

@MarinePMI- interesting info about the temp and fan behavior. That info seems to corroborate the claim by the dealer that the software is at least in part attending to the buildup problems. Whether it works or not is anybody's guess for now.

I agree with most of you in this post who believe that the software probably can't do much, if anything, about the problem. Spirited runs could do just as much. Unfortunately, I don't get out on the twsties as much as I'd like, and my city commute isn't the place for going all out on the throttle!

@grgramps- glad you enjoyed the post! Hopefully I will find a business that cares about their customers in this process. I have had only small complaints with mini as a whole so far, but most of my time with them has been on their dollar (well, my dollar that I gave them in advance!)

My plan based on everyone's feedback is to stroll on in to Dealer One, get them to scan my keyfob, and hope that the walnut blasting seems like a reasonable attempt at a fix. I will try to "pick my moment" for bringing up the firmware/software issue, if the opportunity presents itself. I will continue to update my saga as it progresses- hopefully to everyone's enjoyment and benefit!

 

Looking forward to more of your clarity and your search for the truth.

 

I can't remember the details, but it seems like I read that other manufacturers (Audi and GM) have avoided the DI carbon buildup issues through creative valve timing. That is, I think they are able to get some fuel into the intake system somehow. If the update changes the timing, then maybe it could replicate the solution from the other manufacturers.

I don't know much about this and I'm working from memory, so please don't flame me!

 

Because I had been on the BBs, I had anticipated a carbon problem around 30,000 miles with my 2010 MCSC. When I started having hesitations in accelerating and then just maintaining speed, I was pretty sure "this must be it". It was about 34,000 miles and after 2-3 weeks of noticing the problem, my check engine light came on so I made the appt. Turned out they had to replace my fuel pump. I was thinking maybe I would escape this carbon plague. And yes, I got the 'only good gas' speech too but the only thing I had ever put in it was BP or Shell Premium or Ethanol-free Premium gas.

Two weeks of smooth driving and it gradually started to happen again only not as frequent or as bad. At close to 36,000 miles I took it back in - no check engine light this time, but with a trip to FL coming up didn't want to take any chances. Sure enough, it was the carbon. They explained they had developed a "fix" for this issue but it required "reprogramming". Sounded great to me! They DID NOT BOTHER TO MENTION that the "reprogramming" would essentially turn OFF my turbo! (I have since been told that that is not possible - but that's what it drives like) I can't explain how frustrated I still am - this was about 6 months ago. I bought an "S" and after 2.5 years of absolute driving bliss, I am "S"less and very disappointed. All the way home I kept saying to myself "This is not my car!" I even looked inside the armrest just to be certain that it was indeed my Mini! I promise you, it drives like a regular old car :-( Before, I had to make an effort to just keep the thing from going too fast. Now it takes effort just to make it go and the whiplash starts are more like prodding a turtle off! I am so disgusted and get so mad every time I think about it for very long.

I had to go back the next weekend fter the "fix" for a door-seal they had to order and asked if they could deprogram it back to the car I bought - "No, ma'am, we can't do that". There was assurances that after my new programming determined my driving style, it would adjust. I tried, as instructed, to drive it like a maniac at every opportunity & it did loosen up a little but it is still not even close to the same car I had before the reprogramming. Don't get me wrong, I still LOVE my Mini - I waited 8 years for it.

All the work was under warranty so I didn't have to pay for any of it. I have to say that none of the issues with the hesitations & such have happened again but it might as well not be a turbo anymore.

I hope it's not too late for any of you here that were offered the opportunity - if I had known how it would change my car, I NEVER would have had it done! It would have been worth having to have it cleaned out every two years.

 

DME Adjustments to Valve Overlap is basicly what strategy MINI is employing when they encode your vehicles DME after performing their carbon cleaning service. For who ever said that their SA or SM stated that this update will be the end all be all of their carbon issues with their n14, they are sorely mistaken and really shouldn't be speaking on matters it seems they have little knowledge on. There are many "physical" flaws with the n14 that contribute to carbon build up not to mention the engine being DI being one of the major contributors that no "magic" software update could ever correct.

 

The Peugeots in Europe using the n14 motor are now using block off caps deleting the PVC hose that dumps the oil vapors into the intake and yes those caps are genuine Peugeot parts. It's a cheap fix that I guess we don't get here because repeated carbon cleanings are too profitable is my guess.

 

Mimi,

This doesn't address your carbon buildup, but to get your acceleration back and probably better than ever, you could probably get an aftermarket ECU software upgrade. Others more familiar with doing this would be able to point you in the right direction.

 

^This.