1st Gen Countryman (R60) Talk (2010-2015) R60 Countryman Discussions

R60 ALL4 Engineering

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Old Sep 30, 2011 | 05:08 AM
  #1  
tippykayak's Avatar
tippykayak
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ALL4 Engineering

While I'm not at the do-most-of-it-yourself stage with my MINI, I've always been happier with a car if I felt I really understood the basic engineering of the major components. So I know how engines work, how brakes work, and how transmissions work (though gear ratios in automatic transmissions still blow my mind).

One thing I really don't know is the details of my Countryman's ALL4 system. In fact, I've heard a number of completely conflicting things about it, some from the mouths of MINI dealership employees.

For example, one told me it was based on BMW's X-drive. Another said it was engineered from the ground up by the MINI team. One told me that the Countryman runs completely as an FWD car until there's slip, at which time an electromagnetic clutch engages and sends power to the rear. Another told me that the torque is split 50/50 between the front and rear at all times until there's slip, and it's capable of sending 100% to the front or back.

So who knows for sure? And how does it work? MINIUSA.com is not helping, and different online reviews say different things. Anybody got a reputable source?
 
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Old Sep 30, 2011 | 05:25 AM
  #2  
Rktcyntst's Avatar
Rktcyntst
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This article provides the information you're seeking:

http://www.motoringfile.com/2011/08/...stem-in-depth/
 
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Old Sep 30, 2011 | 05:39 AM
  #3  
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Mark Bielick
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FYI

I know it's a bit dated, but this is one of the better design reviews regarding the All4 design.


http://www.bimmerfile.com/2010/05/26...yman-cooper-s/

And this is an interview with a BMW exec regarding the differences:

http://www.bmwblog.com/2011/02/18/20...f-mini-canada/

Hope this helps

Mark
 
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Old Sep 30, 2011 | 06:45 AM
  #4  
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tippykayak
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Thanks, guys. So I'm guessing the CNET reviewer here was just spectacularly misinformed. He says:

Vehicles that fall into this category [full time AWD] are usually built from the ground up as all-wheel-drive vehicles. These all-wheel-drive systems are always engaged and differ from on-demand systems with a resting torque distribution that sits somewhere around a 50/50 split and the ability to send the majority of torque to either axle as needed. Rare cases, such as Mini Cooper Countryman's All4 system, are even able to send 100 percent of available torque to either the front or rear end.
That's in direct contradiction to the Motoring File article which says:

The system allows up to 50% of torque to go to the rear wheels when the system detects front wheel slip (any more wouldn’t make sense from a weight distribution prospective). However under cruising conditions (on a highway for instance) the ALL4 equipped Countryman is entirely front wheel drive.
Crazy misinformation bouncing around out there...
 
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Old Sep 30, 2011 | 07:29 AM
  #5  
is_it_the_shoes's Avatar
is_it_the_shoes
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[SIZE=3][FONT=Calibri]Seems like only the Motoringfile.com article claims no more than 50%, whereas everything else appears to claim that in some instances 100% can be sent to rears. I usually take what CNET claims with a grain of salt, they have produced some garbage articles in the past on many occasions, but the everything else seems to suggest it. Guess we will all have to keep digging, and post what we find here, I know I would love to know the answer as well !![/FONT][/SIZE]
 
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Old Sep 30, 2011 | 07:33 AM
  #6  
zone555's Avatar
zone555
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From: Toronto, Canada
GKN Electromagnetic Control Device (EMCD) on the ALL4:

http://www.gkndriveline.com/drivelin...icle_0041.html

Similar EMCD unit found on the Nissan GT-R??

http://www.gkndriveline.com/drivelin...icle_0022.html
 
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Old Sep 30, 2011 | 09:37 AM
  #7  
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ghamma
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From: SF Bay Area
Originally Posted by Rktcyntst
This article provides the information you're seeking:

http://www.motoringfile.com/2011/08/...stem-in-depth/
The picture in that article looks pretty much like my CM4:
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...p/photo/101868
 
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Old Sep 30, 2011 | 12:39 PM
  #8  
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tornado
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So from those articles it seems the All4 drive is controlled via DSC. So does this mean if we disable DSC from the dash button, do we also loose All4 capability?
 
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Old Sep 30, 2011 | 12:52 PM
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ghamma
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Originally Posted by tornado
So from those articles it seems the All4 drive is controlled via DSC. So does this mean if we disable DSC from the dash button, do we also loose All4 capability?
I'm not sure that's the case. From disabling DSC and Traction Control, I found you can drift the ALL4 rather nicely. You can also fling the back end around with handbrake and throttle. If I were set up to investigate the programming, I'd want to turn an unassigned button into one labeled, "Fun!"
 
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Old Sep 30, 2011 | 01:12 PM
  #10  
tippykayak's Avatar
tippykayak
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Originally Posted by tornado
So from those articles it seems the All4 drive is controlled via DSC. So does this mean if we disable DSC from the dash button, do we also loose All4 capability?
I don't think so. I think the same computer that senses slip controls the clutch in the ALL4, but I don't think "turning off" the DSC actually turns off the computer. It would be nice to see all the specs laid out, though.
 
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