R56 :: Hatch Talk (2007+) MINI Cooper and Cooper S (R56) hatchback discussion.
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Old May 4, 2020 | 12:21 PM
  #1  
AceGenuis's Avatar
AceGenuis
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Welp...

Hello first time poster.

I have a 2007 Mini Cooper S. Car has been sitting for about a year and half. Bad trans, clutch, thermostat housing unit, and wheel bearings those have been replaced. There's probably more just haven't came up yet. I did have the car running for about a month now. Found out super quick that the R56 loves to guzzle oil. So I'm driving probably going like 35 I'm trying to shift and my car just dies. Wont turn over for nothing. My boy came with an OBDII sensor ran the diagnostics and it there are 4 pop-ups. (Vehicle speed, signal; Bypass blow-off valve, plausibility; Inlet camshaft sensor x2) Got it towed. So um yea oh and one more thing I bought new spark plugs for it and whoever the idiot was. Wasn't paying attention to how the spark plugs were put back in so now I have a stripped spark plug that I haven't been able to get out yet.

I've been asking around what could go next and I'm told the High pressure fuel pump would be most likely to change out next. I've been doing the work myself and learning that these cars are um challenging. I've came this far and I'm not stopping. Any ideas to get this Spark Plug out?


 
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Old May 5, 2020 | 08:39 AM
  #2  
schovil69's Avatar
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Your spark plug is not stripped. A stripped thread is not able to build up any clamping force. You may have a cross threaded spark plug or the spark plug was installed without anti-seize. A cross threaded spark plug may require removal of the head to fix. If your problem is a spark plug installed without anti-seize there may be some hope. You may be able to remove it by slowing backing it out a bit then tightening a bit and repeating. I would suggest backing it out about 1/8 of a turn at a time then running it back in between each 1/8 of a turn out. Continue doing this until the spark plug is successfully removed. Drop some oil down the hole while doing this to provide some lubrication and cooling as the threads will become heated. Some oil would be defined as a few drops, just enough to work its way into the spark plug threads. Heated threads become damaged threads. Any oil that drips onto the piston will burn off shortly after startup.

WARNING: Following this out and in method does have potential for successful removal but it does not guarantee success. You may still strip the threads attempting to remove the spark plug and need to remove the head to fix the problem. You may also want to run a scope into the cylinder to inspect for any metal shavings, another reason for head removal.
 
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Old May 5, 2020 | 09:47 AM
  #3  
mildensteve's Avatar
mildensteve
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From: Keller, Texas
Engine oil may be too thick. I use PB Blaster and heat. Works for me on bolts, should work on spark plugs.

Oh, and love the color combo. Silver with red interior. Very familiar.
 
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Old May 5, 2020 | 10:17 AM
  #4  
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giorgos
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BMW requires that no greasing agent, oil, etc. is used on the spark plug threads, quote:

"Do not grease/oil thread or use any graphite or copper grease. Adhere to the torque values of the packaging information or regulation.
Note: If these instructions are not followed, especially with regard to greasing, this may result in mechanical damage to the spark plug housing/thread. Spark plugs that are not tightened sufficiently lead to leaks and to the spark plugs coming loose during engine operation.
"
Source
(Also note the requirement for using an extension with a joint)

NGK, too, explicitly advises against the use of anti seize, quote:

"NGK spark plugs feature what is known as trivalent plating. This silver- or chrome-colored finish on the threads is designed to provide corrosion resistance against moisture and chemicals. The coating also acts as a release agent during spark plug removal. NGK spark plugs are installed at the factory dry, without the use of anti-seize. NGK tech support has received a number of tech calls from installers who have over-tightened spark plugs because of the use of anti-seize. Anti-seize compound can act as a lubricant altering torque values up to 20 percent, increasing the risk of spark plug thread breakage."
Source


 
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Old May 5, 2020 | 04:34 PM
  #5  
schovil69's Avatar
schovil69
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Originally Posted by giorgos
BMW requires that no greasing agent, oil, etc. is used on the spark plug threads, quote:

"Do not grease/oil thread or use any graphite or copper grease. Adhere to the torque values of the packaging information or regulation.
Note: If these instructions are not followed, especially with regard to greasing, this may result in mechanical damage to the spark plug housing/thread. Spark plugs that are not tightened sufficiently lead to leaks and to the spark plugs coming loose during engine operation.
"
Source
(Also note the requirement for using an extension with a joint)

NGK, too, explicitly advises against the use of anti seize, quote:

"NGK spark plugs feature what is known as trivalent plating. This silver- or chrome-colored finish on the threads is designed to provide corrosion resistance against moisture and chemicals. The coating also acts as a release agent during spark plug removal. NGK spark plugs are installed at the factory dry, without the use of anti-seize. NGK tech support has received a number of tech calls from installers who have over-tightened spark plugs because of the use of anti-seize. Anti-seize compound can act as a lubricant altering torque values up to 20 percent, increasing the risk of spark plug thread breakage."
Source
That's some good information I wasn't aware of, thanks for sharing. It's interesting as well because ARP, manufacturer of fasteners, recommends their own lubricant be used when torquing nuts/bolts in order to achieve proper torque. A clear example that their is always more than one way to skin a cat.
 
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Old May 5, 2020 | 09:40 PM
  #6  
giorgos's Avatar
giorgos
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From: Germany
Originally Posted by schovil69
It's interesting as well because ARP, manufacturer of fasteners, recommends their own lubricant be used when torquing nuts/bolts in order to achieve proper torque. A clear example that their is always more than one way to skin a cat.
The question is though, whether manufacturers of fasteners are in a position to adequately factor in properties, requirements and structure of what their fasteners are fastened to and if so, whether they (can) do for each and every different one of them. The manufacturer of those (e.g. the engine head) on the other hand can and usually do so (at least when they are liable for the whole product).

So whenever there is a contradiction, I would follow the instructions of that party which either manufactures the item more expensive (both in money and effort) to replace or is fully accountable for damages caused by following their instructions. For cars, both of the above criteria (overwhelmingly) point to the engine manufacturer rather than the manufacturer of the fasteners (this of course does not mean that the advice by the latter is necessarily wrong).
 

Last edited by giorgos; May 5, 2020 at 09:46 PM.
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Old May 6, 2020 | 10:56 AM
  #7  
oldbrokenwind's Avatar
oldbrokenwind
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Joined: Mar 2011
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From: Northern NV
Originally Posted by giorgos
BMW requires that no greasing agent, oil, etc. is used on the spark plug threads, quote:

"Do not grease/oil thread or use any graphite or copper grease. Adhere to the torque values of the packaging information or regulation.
Note: If these instructions are not followed, especially with regard to greasing, this may result in mechanical damage to the spark plug housing/thread. Spark plugs that are not tightened sufficiently lead to leaks and to the spark plugs coming loose during engine operation.
"
Source
(Also note the requirement for using an extension with a joint)

NGK, too, explicitly advises against the use of anti seize, quote:

"NGK spark plugs feature what is known as trivalent plating. This silver- or chrome-colored finish on the threads is designed to provide corrosion resistance against moisture and chemicals. The coating also acts as a release agent during spark plug removal. NGK spark plugs are installed at the factory dry, without the use of anti-seize. NGK tech support has received a number of tech calls from installers who have over-tightened spark plugs because of the use of anti-seize. Anti-seize compound can act as a lubricant altering torque values up to 20 percent, increasing the risk of spark plug thread breakage."
Source
Originally Posted by schovil69
That's some good information I wasn't aware of, thanks for sharing. It's interesting as well because ARP, manufacturer of fasteners, recommends their own lubricant be used when torquing nuts/bolts in order to achieve proper torque. A clear example that their is always more than one way to skin a cat.
Don't confuse spark plug or TTY threads with ARP hardware. NGK has very good reasons for not using lubricants, that also apply to TTY hardware. ARP furnishes their own lube, to be used with their own torque specs, and their instructions should be followed when using their hardware. My limited use of ARP hardware tells me that the kits are made for very specific uses, so some research has been done. This is one of the few aftermarket sources I feel is trustworthy.
 
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