Hi to all.

I had been communicating with a Mini forum a couple of months ago while working on my exe's R56 (2010) Mini Cooper, however I can't locate that particular forum, so I decided to come here and seek some advice.

I have worked on mostly European sports cars and Mustangs for many years, however this thing called a 'MINI' seems to have some tricks up her sleeves and is good at confusing some folk. So if I can bend an ear or two I would greatly appreciate the feedback.

Here is the current issue, or issues depending on how you look at it. She got the two amber engine lights the other day, while driving home, however the one behind the steering wheel went away. When she brought the car to me I put my Scan Tool on it and got the P2414 code. It came up with a P0137 later, however that was after I cleaned what I thought was the only sensor (one at the bottom of the engine) after I sprayed the connector with electrical spray and before removing the O2 sensor.

When I did remove that sensor the P0137 did go away after I cleaned the sensor and ran it for a bit. Codes went away and did not return, however when I took it to give it back to her the amber engine lights came on again. What seems odd is that sometimes the reader will show the P2414 code without the engine light coming on, and then other times the engine light comes on and there is no code. Then other times they both come on simultaneously.

I finally realized there were two sensors and removed the upper one and cleaned it. Both sensors were pretty nasty, but cleaned up fine. So after reinstalling it I drove for over six miles with no incident at all. No codes and no engine light. But then sitting in the garage retesting and verifying all was well, the engine light came on again, this time without the code. I have a reader that will monitor live data so I have been driving with it connected a couple of times, and this is how I am able to see the code while driving even when the engine light isn't illuminating.

So the P2414 code did return, so I assume the PRE-CAT O2 sensor is the culprit. Does anyone know the particular part number or suitable substitute for that sensor. I won't spend $200 plus on the sensor from BMW. It just ain't gonna happen. My main questions were does anyone have any experience with these lights coming on with and without the code coming up, or the code coming up without the accompanying light?

This may be simple for all the Mini folk here, but every vehicle has it's ghosts and oddities, and the Mini is known for these things. I never knew about the oil issues that can cause the engine to almost blow up or sieze up if the oil is too low. I found that out a long time ago when she was having lots of issues with the car running rough and very poorly. I finally checked the oil after someone on a forum suggested that. Sure enough the oil was almost three quarts low. She never checked her oil before and left it to when the oil was changed. Now she checks it weekly. That oil dipstick is the stupidest design I have ever seen.

Then the issues with the transmission fluid? Screw that. I changed her gaskets and tranny fluid, but what a pain in the behind that was. I lived in Europe three times and drove Mini's many times in the 80's and 90's. Boy were they so much easier to work on back then. BMW really screwed the pooch on this one, but that's just me.

In the end I'm thinking it may be best to just replace both O2 sensors so she doesn't have to deal with that down the road. Any suggestions or tips would be much obliged. Thanks for reading my novel, but I do like to be thorough. I am a technician on aircraft and cars, so I like to do the job the right way. Thanks for the assist and I hope everyone has a Very Merry Christmas.


Cheers,

Howster

 

did you mention if it were S or base model?

Also, did you do the cleaning while the battery was connected?

What was is it that you cleaned, area/location?

 

When you see the fault code without the light it is because it just hasn't set the light yet. P2414 is the pre cat sensor. As far as replacing the O2 sensor your Mini is picky on the brand, use Bosch. I use ECSTuning quite a bit for parts and there are other companies on the forum like Pelican Parts & WayMotorWorks etc. Click HERE for O2 sensor prices for quality.
Have you logged the fuel trims? If so, what are they. A vacuum leak or a faulty CCV in the valve cover can cause the O2 sensor to throw a code too.
How old is your battery? Is it holding a solid charge? If voltage drops below 11.5 the electrical gremlins will wake up and cause havic.

 

What type of scan tool are you using? Sometimes dealer codes will come up with a CEL and regular scan tools are unable to pull them. What brand O2 sensor did you use for the pre-cat?

Sensors: http://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/..._pg1.htm#item0
We have some useful information about sensors replacement here: http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarti...eplacement.htm.

 

Hi and thanks for the responses. It is a base Mini. It is an automatic. The battery is fine. It is charging and not an issue. I have already checked for vacuum leaks as well. I assumed the lights and code not coming on simultaneously was not an issue, but needed confirm it. I pulled the O2 sensors and cleaned them very well, but the P2414 code is still coming back eventually. The part number on the part is the Bosch, and I have found it at several stores at various prices. Hey Grussell, I tried to go to the link you supplied but it didn't work.

Pelican Parts? I am using a INNOVA Digital CAN OBD2 Scan Tool. Very nice tool and have used it on a number of my vehicles. I like that I can use it while the engine is running to acquire live data. I also have a INNOVA OBD2 Code Reader, however it just reads codes. It doesn't tell you what the code is, but the scan tool does. The O2 sensor that I pulled off of the vehicle is a Bosch, or I assume it is since that number matches up to the ones I am finding on-line. So far Rock Auto has that part for the least amount-$99.79 plus shipping. This car is a Mini Cooper Base and not the turboed engine. I have replaced a lot of sensors over the years and know that you really need to use a penetrative catalyst to help with loosening the sensor due to heat. I did that and it came out relatively easy.

I just need to place the order for the sensor and will go from there. I would normally replace both sensors at the same time, but I have never had a code come up for the other sensor so will leave it alone for now. The part number on the one I removed is 0258017217. I found it at RockAuto Parts for $99.79 and with $23.99 will arrive this Friday, which is the day after tomorrow. That is the least expensive option I have found. I appreciate the info from everyone and will update with results.

Cheers,

Howster

 

I fixed the link, but you found a Bosch with a good price.

 

Howster - Sorry I misread what you wrote and thought you said you replaced the pre-cat sensor already. I'd say that you might want to replace it and see if that fixes your P2414 issue. Here is a good thread on NAM: https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...en-sensor.html. The individual didn't report your exact issues, but a place to start.

 

The Bosch is $99.79 and the NTK is $55.79. These are OEM replacement parts. Thanks.

Howster

 

The Bosch number is the same as the one on the car, but the NTK number is different. I found the number from Pelican is also different, but slightly more expensive. I will update when I have them installed. Thanks for the info everyone. Have a Merry Christmas.

Howster

 

Just be sure to get the right sensor for the right bank. NTK sensor is post-cat part number 11-78-7-548-961 and the pre-cat sensor Bosch is 11-78-7-590-713. Bosch will have its own part number (as discussed in the NAM thread I linked above), but the number we use in the catalog for it is the OEM/Genuine part number.

http://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/..._pg1.htm#item0

Good luck and Merry Christmas to you as well!

 

I just installed the two new sensors and still getting the P2414 code. I decided to disconnect the PCV valve on the valve cover and I sprayed it out with intake cleaner. The light went away, but I'm thinking it may be the PCV valve itself. Will see what happens next.

If anyone has any other suggestions that would be awesome. The sensors are the correct numbers. I'm also reading where the entire valve cover needs to be replaced it the PCV valve is defective. Does anyone have a dealership or parts store who doesn't charge an arm and a leg? Thanks again.

Cheers,

Howie

 

Check with the companies that support this forum and you can find one under $400. This is what failed on my valve cover. I had to drop the oil pan to find it stuck to the inside of the oil pump sprocket cover.

 

Hey Grussell,

After I changed both O2 sensors I was still getting the P2414 code, so I decided to do some more troubleshooting. I removed the hose from the valve cover and decided to spray inside knowing that carbon buildup sometimes causes issues. Once I did that the light went away and hasn't returned. I may remove the valve cover just to inspect the PCV valve and make sure it isn't actually defective. Thanks for the info.

I can't believe BMW would build something this way, but then again, it's BMW, and they like their money. Too bad we can't just buy the replacement PCV valve like 99% of every other vehicle made in the world.

Cheers,

Howie

 

I'm also wondering if I should return these O2 sensors of just keep them. The car only has 65K on it and the original sensors although dirty when I removed them cleaned up well. The lights even went away for awhile before reappearing. I had even sprayed some cleaner inside the valve cover yesterday but the light came back so I didn't consider it again. However I sprayed enough today to clean any gunk out pretty well and it hasn't come on again.

Is the gasket on that valve cover replaceable, and if so is it rubber? Thanks again.

 

Is there a oil catch can mod for the Mini? I have installed them on pretty much all of my performance vehicles. My old Boss 302 and my new GT350 each had two. My previous AMG had one hunking huge one. Just wondering if that might alleviate some of the oil consumption issues as well as PCV issues. Just wondering.

Thanks.

 

Just to cover your grounds make sure to check the connections and wiring of the oxygen sensors. Make sure everything looks connected properly and isn't damaged. Look for damaged wires. Here is some additional info on P2414: http://bestride.com/engine-trouble-codes/P2414. Most of what I've seen/dealt with P2414 is related to the oxygen sensor.

Are you having oil consumption issues? Disconnect the PCV hose on the valve cover and check to see if it's heavily coated with oil. If the PCV is bad, yes the whole cover will need to be replaced. Engine oil consumption increases significantly if the crankcase ventilation system is defective. Do you see oil leaking from the valve cover anywhere? Before replacing parts, definitely be sure to diagnose things. You can do a smoke test to see if there is a vacuum leak anywhere. I've listed some links below for you to check out.

Valve cover: http://www.pelicanparts.com/More_Inf...46-554-BOE.htm
Catch Can DIY article: http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarti...an_Install.htm
Valve cover DIY article: http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarti...eplacement.htm
Oil consumption tech article: http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarti..._Diagnosis.htm

 

oh, i see. Thanks for your knowledge, now i think i know what happen to mine.

 

Since you posted you must tell us what happened to yours...